Depression, Ireland and living with it.

nesf

Right, going to get all rambling and introspective here. Apologies if this isn't the place for this, but I can't think of anywhere better to put it tbh. And I'd like opinions on this.


Warning, this is going to get a little heavy and possibly intense in places, and could not be considered either light-hearted, fluffy or happy reading by even the most optimistic of people. I will not ask anyone to read this, I am merely posting it here for people to consider and offer me opinion on.

Negative reactions are fine, and won’t bother me. I appreciate that what I am about to say will not sit well with everyone and I do not expect it to be the case that everyone will consider this a worthwhile post or even fit to be on this board. But I feel like it is, and I like to think that one or two people might read this and gain some insight from doing so. Or at the very least might find it entertaining or interesting. The below starts quite light but gets quite heavy and complex. Not good casual reading but I hope that it is of interest to someone.

This is also a post about mental health. I am not looking for medical advice here and I can assure everybody that I am in good professional hands with regard to these issues. I just want to talk about some stuff

Right, now after the obligatory health warnings, some verbose bitching I think. Fair warned, be yee says I!

I've not been so good recently. I've been kinda dealing with being depressed for the past 4 or 5 days. Nothing too serious, nothing too bad, just been quite a tough few days when I've had such a good spell in the past 3/4 months. Guess it is a bit tough to deal with the change of mood rather than with the actual depression. The past few days are pale in comparison to what I've had to deal with in the past 4 years. So yes I'm whining and moaning, but **** it, I'm allowed every so often.

It's basically, just dealing with the change in mood is a little harsh, rather than the actual depression part. Coming down off one of the better periods of my life was always going to be hard, I didn't have any illusions about it, I just hoped it would be easier, and that I wouldn't have as many issues. Some musing I think is the way to go, this is how I like to deal with problems, and I've found that taking the time to express myself in this manner really helps me to relax and chill out. I guess I kinda feel more in control when I can express myself and I can feel that I'm on top of things because I'm able to rationalise them and not be the victim of my own emotions.

I guess that talking helps. But I've found that doing this is better. I don't have any shame or feel that I have anything to hide with regard to my depression or with my mental illness. I am not proud of what I have, but I do feel that I am a stronger person for it. Not a better person, but I am definitely more keyed in to myself for it, and I understand myself a lot better for it. I guess I've more control too, but I'm not sure if that’s a good thing. If I didn't have the control that I have, I don't think I could have avoided being hospitalised over the past 2-3 years. I suffered from suicidal urges on a daily basis. I was always able to rationalise them as "suicidal ideations coming from me having depression rather than me wanting to die". I, just like any other sufferer, had a preoccupation with death and it was a subject that always was on my mind, I've dreamt about my own death since I was 13 or so. Not bad dreams, not in the slightest. They have always been the most peaceful of my dreams; I'd wake up feeling calm and relaxed. Not a good thing. Since I've gone on Effexor, my dreams have been really ****ed up. Effexor does weird things to my dreams. I wake up each morning disquieted by what I saw in my mind the night before. I can't remember specific things; I've just this very strong feeling of wrongness. Kind of like my dreams have been things that should not be. Maybe I'm dreaming of Cthulhu or something.

It's been a bit strange. I suppose the last few days have caused me to think a lot about the bad times and make me appreciate that I might be over, or at least at the end of, the depressive episode I was in. My anxiety has been troublesome these past few days, almost had a panic attack. Not good. Although, I wasn't too bad and I managed to keep myself in check to a large extent. I've a much better grip on myself these days and I don't have panic attacks often. I know the warning signs and when I get them I just take a moment, and I pull back a little from what’s happening. I go for a walk or whatever. My anxiety is controllable, or at least avoidable. Although avoiding anxiety aggravating situations can lead to withdrawing totally within myself. So I'm not allowing that to happen. I suppose I'm just trusting myself enough at the moment. I have been pushing the envelope a little with regard to situations I put myself in. I'm not 100% away from where I was, but I'm not the anxious ball of energy that I was either. I've made progress and I'm happy with that. I know my anxiety is only a reaction within myself to certain pressures and events. I've been trying to get used to actually dealing with these situations and not falling into a panic with them. I've made progress. The drugs help a little too, I'm not getting the same swings of anxiety levels that I used to. I used to go from feeling fine to a panic attack in less than 5 minutes. Now there is a slow build up of anxiety, so I can adapt to it and control it easier. My anxiety will never go away in my opinion, but my lack of control of it will change. I don't think anyone can get rid of anxiety while remaining aware and conscious of themselves, but I do believe that anxiety can be controlled. Yes it's not exactly easy to do when you have mental illness, but hell I'm not going to live as a slave to it.

I guess that’s been one of the big things for me. Acceptance. I accept that I was born this way; I accept that there isn't any good psychological reason for my condition. It wasn't my upbringing, schooling, childhood or life style that was the dominant reason for me being this way. It was an accident of birth. Same as my poor eyesight, asthma and appearance were mostly down to genetic factors rather than life ones. Accepting this has made a big difference in me. I don't look at myself and see someone with a problem. I see someone who has something to deal with, and something to work on. But I am not essentially a bad person for having depression. I am not wrong for being the way I am. Having a mental illness in this country when you are very young is not easy. There is a lot of stigma and misinformation out there in this country. Depression is seen as a sign of weakness and not as a mental health problem by a large group of people in this country. Mentioning the word depression in your workplace can be the equivalent to shooting yourself in the foot. I remember jobs where my doctors lied on medical certificates because they knew that putting depression down on the cert would result in me losing my job or being discriminated against. In fact for the most part, I am forced to hide my illness (and yes it is an illness in my eyes) from certain parts of my life. I need to keep people unaware of what's wrong because of the stigma and problems associated with having a mental illness in this county.

"You can't be depressed you don't seem sad all the time. You don't at all act like someone with depression."
"Depression, pfft. It's all in your head, you just feel sorry for yourself. Think positive thoughts!"
"I know that he has depression, but I think it's just laziness" (from a psych student!)
"He just needs a kick in the ass to sort him out" (from a psych post-grad)
"You're not making an effort. Of course you're going to be depressed if you aren't leaving the house and exercising everyday!"

All the above are direct quotes from my life. I could list out a lot more negative ones, but I don't see a need. Now I am not for a moment saying that I haven't been supported or that everyone has been negative with regards to my mental problems. They haven't. I am very lucky in that some of the people I can count as friends of mine, in both real life and online, are some of the finest people I've ever met. I get most of the support I need from people in real life. Day in, day out, I've had some very understanding friends who have looked after me and helped me up when I've fallen. They've put up with me at my worst, and I can only say that I am in debt to them for their friendships. I've gotten quite a lot of support online too, I don't disregard that, but I'm sure most of you would agree that a hug from someone when you are feeling down can do a lot more than any online chat. But anyways, I'm digressing, back on topic!

I suppose I'm writing this as more of an exercise in expression than for any therapeutic value. I am not pouring my heart out; I am not talking here about anything I feel very private about. I might be verbose, but some topics and things are better left for quiet chats with close friends and not for public consumption online! However, I'm optimistic that at least a few people might read this and feel a little empathy or feel a little less alone for reading it. That or not be bored out of their minds. I'll settle for the latter!

I've had a few bad days in a row. My mood has been off; I've been cynical and very negative. I've been stopping myself from indulging these thoughts too much. I may not be able to control my mood but I can control my interaction with others to some degree. It's always easier in the quiet hours though. I find it hard to deal with people sometimes, although I did spend 2 and a half hours out of the house today, so I'm not doing too badly. Have barely eaten today though. Have to watch that.

Meh. It will pass, it always does.




(Continued in the next post)

nesf

That’s the key. Knowing that it will pass. It's so hard to think like this when you're down. Depression is so stigmatised in this country. It is so kept in the shadows and people can't talk about it. I hate that about our society. I hate having to hide that I'm depressed from people because they have some issue with it. I've been accused of many things, from making it all up to just being a lazy git who's looking for an excuse. This was the result of me being open about my illness in the past. I've been ostracised, mocked and abused because I've refused to be quiet about the issue and I feel like talking about it. People go immediately on the defensive when I talk about depression, I know psych students that have thought to "correct my thinking" and convince me that it's all pycho-somatic and that it's all just a figment of my imagination. I've been sat down by well meaning people and I've been talked to about how it's quite obvious that the reason why I am depressed is because of the way I chose to live my life. I wasn't someone with a mental illness quite obviously because I wasn't locked away in a home somewhere. Surely if I had depression I'd be in care and not in college attempting a degree. Surely no one who did so well in their leaving and who got through so many years of honours physics could be a depressed person. That just doesn't make sense. It must be laziness and some other choice of his that causes him to be this way. Can't be depression, we all know what that's like.

The above thinking and actions made me ashamed of what I was like. I was wrong, I was immoral and I was acting the prick by being the way I was. I didn't need any medical help and only needed to be kicked up the ass every so often to stop me from feeling so sorry for myself. There was nothing wrong; it was all just in my head. I was imagining things. I've not felt able to describe in any detail what a day with depression is like for me outside of a doctor's surgery for a long time. But I feel like sharing something with you now. It's a little personal, but I don't really care. This is how it was, not how it is.

The next bit is an insight on what a normal day was like for me when I was depressed. I'm not going to post up the very bad days, because I don't believe that that would be of any use or very nice reading for anybody. But the following is what it was like for me. It isn't an account of a regular day for someone with depression. I just want people to understand just what I mean when I say depressed.

You've spent the day doing nothing, it's 4 am, and all that you can think about is how the world would be a better place without yourself, and you've spent hours just staring at the ceiling in bed waiting for sleep to come. Hmm, you feel hungry all of a sudden. Like there’s a pit in your stomach. Did I eat today? Hmm, let me think about that. No can't remember eating anything. Remember taking my drugs though. Meh, no point in eating now, won't be able to sleep at all then. But when sleep comes all you have is dreams about dying and death and there’s nowhere to run to in your mind. You are a prisoner of your own consciousness. You are trapped in this depressed and anxious thought pattern from which there never seems to be any escape. The drugs, well the drugs help don't they, don't cure it though. It's still there in the back of your mind like some kind of malicious shadow. Waiting patiently for you to fall back into it. Then you wake up. It's 6 in the evening. The day is gone. **** you had an appointment at 3 didn't you? How did you manage to sleep through the 4 alarm clocks going off in your room? You check them, they're all still on. You slept through them all. 3 missed calls on the phone, 2 voice messages. The college want to know where you are, they haven't seen you in 4 weeks, and your parents are wondering how college is going. Can you get up? Hmm, it's been a half hour since you've woken, but you’re still not really awake. Don't want to leave the room. Don't want to leave the bed. Why bother? It's not like you could do anything anyway. When was the last time you did anything you enjoyed? Actually when’s the last time you felt anything other than guilt? Is it the drugs that are stopping me feeling or was I like this before them? I don't remember. Actually I can't remember anything really. It's all a hazy bubble. **** it, better do something. Think I'm alone in the house, think so. Will be ok if I pop out quickly to the bathroom. I don't want to though. Can't really care enough to do that. Could go outside. Outside has people. People mean pressure, people mean feeling bad. I don't know. Maybe if I go back to sleep this will pass. Can't sleep, but I feel so very tired. Just how long did I sleep last night? 14 hours, damn it's getting worse. I'm spending more of each day asleep than I am awake. And when I'm awake all I feel is tiredness like I've not slept in weeks. But no matter what I do, I sleep for 12+ hours a night. No matter what sleeping tablets I take, no matter if people try to wake me up at a certain time, they always give up eventually. I'm answering my phone in my sleep nowadays. That can't be good. Can't remember what I say to people. I just wake up some days late in the evening, and my phone is nearly out of battery and there’s all these calls received on it. I don't remember any of them. What is happening to me? ****, I'm late for my dosage, better take the tablets before the headaches and cramps kick in. Forgetting your drugs is bad, hospital if I forget for too long. Something about the brain getting used to being on a high dosage makes missing the drugs feel worse than any cold turkey experience. Your brain gets used to having more serotonin, nonadrenaline and dopamine. It doesn't like it when you mess with that. Shakes, shivers, hallucinations, fever. That’s the first day. The second day it gets worse. You spend most of day two gagging, and not quite sure who you are or what you're doing. But you're sure that something is very wrong with you. I don't know what day 3 is like. I've never gotten that far before someone managed to get drugs into me. I was told by a doctor that by day 4 I'd be in hospital. Maybe day 5. Maybe he's trying to scare me into taking my drugs? I don't know. Read up on it online. Coma, hospitalisation, severe hallucinations. Hmm, and that’s for low dosages. Doesn't say anything about the maximum dosage level. Well. Not like I can do anything worthwhile today. Might try and lie and hope for quiet time in my head. I like it when I can switch off my brain. Happens so rarely these days. I start reading. I flick pages, I mimic reading exactly, to a tee. I stop to have a smoke and look down at the page and don't recognise any of it. I flick back through the pages and fail to recognise anything, character names, plot, nothing. But I was reading this. I remember reading this. This can't be right. Gah. I throw away the book and look at the ceiling. I know the ceiling better than I know my own face. Can't stand looking in the mirror these days. Can't stand to see my own eyes. Can't stand to see what I look like. I look like ****. I feel worse. But knowing I look like that makes it worse. And, when I see myself in the mirror, well, I know I exist then, and that this isn't all just a bad dream. I wish this was a dream. I wish that this wasn't happening. I wish that this would just go away. How long has it been? Its years now. I've been like this for about 6 months, had a few weeks of normality there for a while but that didn't last long. No escape. Can't do anything, can't even feed myself. I'm gaining weight even though I am not eating most days. I don't understand this. Well, weights the least of your problems isn't it? Meh. Can't even concentrate enough to watch TV. Can't focus on a film. Can't even read through posts or blogs online. It's all just hazy and fuzzy and has no meaning or impact. I hate being this way. I hate it so much. Doesn't change things though. Things stay the same. Chances are, I'll be like this tomorrow. Why do I keep going like this? I don't know. I really don't anymore.

(Continued in next post)

nesf

The above scares me. I have lived like that for years. I have spent weeks and months on end with no relenting in that frame of mind having a quality of life that an animal wouldn't envy. The basic life functions were about all I could manage. Sleep, food, shelter. That was it. Nothing else. I do not want to go back to that and the thought of it scares me more than anything else in life. I could face and have faced a lot of things, but I am so afraid of being like that again. Being so dead inside. Depression for me was never feeling sad and lonely like most non-sufferers imagine depression to be like. It was an emotional dead land. I couldn't feel anything except panic, anxiety and fatigue.

It's fear that has me at the moment. I've it under control. I am not in a panic every time I feel a bit down. I've been down for 4 days now and it hasn't been anywhere close to the above. I've not been good, but I'm still far far above where I was.

I am not worried about being like that again. I accept that I have depression and that it isn't something that can be cured. It isn't something that can be switched off.

My depressive episodes are abnormally long in duration. I spend a lot of time fighting to stay out of mental hospital. I hate it in hospital. I have panic attacks and it's all bad. At least when I'm in my home, I can feel safe. I don't in hospital. I don't suffer from typical depression. Or at least that’s the medical opinion on the matter. What I suffer from is of far longer duration than your average depressed person. My episodes are measured in years not months or weeks as would be the case for most people.


I guess, I just wanted to share the above with people. I wanted people to know what it was like for me. I know I had it easy when compared to other people. I don't have a thing to complain about when I look at some people's lives. I am not looking for sympathy, or commiseration. I just wanted someone else to have a tiny inkling of what it's like for me when I'm down. Nothing can convey the reality of it. But I want to exorcise my fear by sharing the experience. I hope that you can understand that. Those that know me very well, know that I've left out a lot out of the above. I'm just not comfortable enough to talk about a lot of what happens to me when I'm depressed. I might be in time, but not now.

I just hope that this little bit of shared experience can help you to understand me a little better. Or at the least, give you some insight into what it's been like for me since I was very young.

Thank you for reading this. It's taken quite a bit of concentration for me to write it, but I feel like I've at least done something right and it's definitely good to get this stuff out in the open.

Any opinions or advice?

(Apologies for splitting it into 3 posts, but it wouldn't fit into one post.)

LegacyUser

Interesting read.

Any opinions or advice?

Not sure what to make of it really, no questions to answer, no statements to disagree with, it's your perspective on your own life... I don't think anyone can argue with that.
I think it's empowering to articulate that which in your head seems a jumbled fog into words and sentences... making structure out of the unstructurable. (that's probably not even a word, but don't tell anyone )
I'm also pretty introspective, but sometimes I find it annoying... I feel I should be living less in my head and be more outwardly focused... just enjoy life and fúck what other people might think... tho it's hard to silence my inner dialog sometimes.

People mean pressure, people mean feeling bad.

Why is (was) that?

I am MAN

Lost interest midway thats my only opinion on it (Way too long)

Zombienosh

nesf wrote:

"You can't be depressed you don't seem sad all the time. You don't at all act like someone with depression."
"Depression, pfft. It's all in your head, you just feel sorry for yourself. Think positive thoughts!"
"I know that he has depression, but I think it's just laziness" (from a psych student!)
"He just needs a kick in the ass to sort him out" (from a psych post-grad)
"You're not making an effort. Of course you're going to be depressed if you aren't leaving the house and exercising everyday!"

I can relate to that, I've heard them all, "Depression? ah you're just tired, go to bed earlier."

And the description of your day was all too familiar. As for advice, I've no idea I don't know what I do when I have bad days, I just let them pass, theres nothing I know of that helps all that much, anyway....

biteener

I would advise printing all of that out and handing it to your phychiatrist. And please use more paragraphs.

Ardent

I don't suffer from depression, not in the way you've described. But we can all get depressed from time to time. The f**king weather in this country doesn't help that's for sure.

Anyway, the last time I was down and depressed, I started thinking about the good things in my life, where I am now in relation to where I was five years ago. That got me out of that state of mind. Bottom line, in my opinion, is sometimes we take things for granted and life fails to live up to expectations as a result. I don't mean for that to be condescending but, while it may seem simplistic, that's what I honestly believe.

LegacyUser

**************
"Having a mental illness in this country when you are very young is not easy. There is a lot of stigma and misinformation out there in this country. Depression is seen as a sign of weakness and not as a mental health problem by a large group of people in this country. Mentioning the word depression in your workplace can be the equivalent to shooting yourself in the foot. I remember jobs where my doctors lied on medical certificates because they knew that putting depression down on the cert would result in me losing my job or being discriminated against. In fact for the most part, I am forced to hide my illness (and yes it is an illness in my eyes) from certain parts of my life. I need to keep people unaware of what's wrong because of the stigma and problems associated with having a mental illness in this county."
**************

This is all too true. We have made some progress in Ireland on a lot of fronts over the last ten years - but let no-one think that we are at the front in terms of enlightenment....just a case of us being so far behind!

I have a good friend whose life has been wrecked by anxiety/depression, a close family relative who is most probably schizophrenic (sp?) and over the last year, I have gained a far greater understanding of one aspect of some specific mental health problems due to my own difficulties.
In the case of my friend, we were at college, sharing a house when he started getting compulsive/paranoid/stressed. He started imagining things - and at the time, I/We (his friends) didnt understand what was in front of us as a sickness - and started to drift away from him. Maybe if we had a better understanding (and if people in general had a better understanding), we could have been more helpful.
The close relative - well, shes currently going through her own personal hell. Its a difficult scenario as shes running away from the problem and has distanced herself from family. I can't help but think that if there wasnt such a stigma, this problem could have been treated and sorted out a long time ago - in which case she would be living a normal life now.
There is no better educator than personal experience. Some six months ago, I started doing extra hours at work. The nature of the working environment involves working in a very small space with approx. 60 others - working unsocial hours and longer than normal working days. I was never 100% comfortable in this situation but up until that point i could deal with it. I somehow found myself hanging over the edge - started getting tensed up, choked up and couldnt talk, the face would blush, the eyes would water - and i would draw everybodys attention to myself which just led to ever decreasing circles. Basically, what i'm talking about is anxiety and panic attacks - only happens at work but i need this job to pay the mortgage.

Anyways, i've digressed a little - as the point i want to make is as follows:
I dont regard myself as 'soft' by any stretch of the imagination - in fact, i would say that most of those i work with by my definition are far softer. However, it was interesting to see peoples reactions to me going through this turmoil -
'Does he have no shame?'
'What would you do with that? The only thing for that is a bullet in the head' (no joking - thats two gob****es standing a bit behind me (but within earshot) when i was going through one of these episodes. Under normal circumstances, I would have taken the heads of them - but these werent normal circumstances.
'....just feels sorry for himself'.
'hes soo special'

I could go on. But what i'm saying is that in all of these cases, theres a recurring theme....ignorance. Mental health is probably the last taboo subject in Ireland. If we were a lot more open about it, we would fair a lot better in dealing with it. Maybe those affected would come to terms with their affliction faster. Maybe the general population would allow them to deal with their problems without stigma and predjudice getting in the way.


Great post nesf. Good luck to you.

Corksham

First of all you have nothing to be ashamed of and you are far from being alone. I too am a long time sufferer and have totally accepted is as part of who I am but know this - it can be treated, I am living proof of someone with 2 suicide attempts under his belt who is damn glad not to be pushing up daises.

What to do? Well if I could solve it in one fix I'd make Bill Gates look like a pauper with the money I'd make.

What have I done? Personally only very recently have I found a spiriutal side to my life and this with lexapro has made a huge differenece (read the book the Power of positive thinking)
Talk - never ever keep it bottled up, I did for far too long and it is not at all macho to keep it inside, a real man cries for help and breaks under emotional pressure but can recover and be a better person for it. Respect the ilness its a real as cancer and ignore and bullsh1t stigma that anyone who doesnt understand attaches to it.

Go to your GP and ask for a referral but my experience - go private as the hospitals are too busy
Read up on the subject - beyond prozac is a good book, read about cbt, positive thikning etc these are helped me (Dorothy Rowe has a few good books as well), take your medication its not prescribed for the sake of it and most of all realise there are others like you who have had many dark nights of the soul and can offer a helping hand

Altheus

Just a question to the OP, do you have any faith in any organised religion, or concepts such as dogma and karma?

If not, do you accept every day reality through what you feel?

I'm not from a cult or anything, but I'd recommend you try and disconnect from that reality, through positive thinking, or through hallucinations.

For me self-hypnosis and psilocybin mushrooms were the key to removing my "depression". I still have those thoughts and doubts. The physical anguish is gone, and I can concentrate on other thinks. I see the way that apathy and inaction have the most detrimental effects on my body via my subconcious. There was no 'mystery' it was just a process that started at some point (even birth) and took quite a while to manifest, and when it did it was fairly controlling.

The power of suggestion and negative thinking combined with physical pain is what got you to where to are, and it's the power of suggestion and postive thinking combined with physical comfort which will remove it.

nesf

I'm going to reply to a couple of of the posts that I feel need replying to Two of them will be replied to sepreately.

Cheers for the opinion, good and bad, so far

I am MAN

I am MAN wrote:

Lost interest midway thats my only opinion on it (Way too long)

Thanks for at least making some effort to read it. It's not too long, I cut out about 3 thousand words before deciding on posting it


biteener

biteener wrote:

I would advise printing all of that out and handing it to your phychiatrist. And please use more paragraphs

My psychiatrists are well aware of everything above. Most of the above is stuff I've been talking to them about for years.

I deliberately did not use paragraphs when I described a day for me. It was representive of the lack of cohesion and order to the day in my opinion. Not the most readable way to do it, but it was the best way of expressing it in my opinion.


Ardent

Ardent wrote:

I don't suffer from depression, not in the way you've described. But we can all get depressed from time to time. The f**king weather in this country doesn't help that's for sure.

Anyway, the last time I was down and depressed, I started thinking about the good things in my life, where I am now in relation to where I was five years ago. That got me out of that state of mind. Bottom line, in my opinion, is sometimes we take things for granted and life fails to live up to expectations as a result. I don't mean for that to be condescending but, while it may seem simplistic, that's what I honestly believe.

Right, firstly, you are 100% correct in your thinking. The vast majority of people do not require drugs, therapy or professional help to help them get over being down. It is not condescending for you to think this way. I completely understand where you are coming from.

The biggest problem that people with depression face in my opinion is that the majority of people will never experience what depression is actually like. But they think they know what it is, because "feeling down" is a normal human thing. Having a bad day is nothing like spening a day in a severe depression. Believe me.

However, I appreciate that it is not easy for someone to understand this. So don't feel bad about it.

But a lot of the stigma with depression is that people have a lot of trouble accepting that depression is a serious illness. It doesn't compare to a regular person's down spell. There is a huge difference between clinical depression and what is commonly considered being depressed. The problem is the line is very blurred. Yes, when we compare severe clinical depression and a normal down, it is very obvious that they are very different. But the line between depression and feeling down is very blurred. Someone with mild depression might not appear to be any more down than any regular person.

I'll do a proper post about this another time, it's a complex topic and deserving of having it's own discussion.

Corksham

Corksham wrote:

First of all you have nothing to be ashamed of and you are far from being alone. I too am a long time sufferer and have totally accepted is as part of who I am but know this - it can be treated, I am living proof of someone with 2 suicide attempts under his belt who is damn glad not to be pushing up daises.

What to do? Well if I could solve it in one fix I'd make Bill Gates look like a pauper with the money I'd make.

What have I done? Personally only very recently have I found a spiriutal side to my life and this with lexapro has made a huge differenece (read the book the Power of positive thinking)
Talk - never ever keep it bottled up, I did for far too long and it is not at all macho to keep it inside, a real man cries for help and breaks under emotional pressure but can recover and be a better person for it. Respect the ilness its a real as cancer and ignore and bullsh1t stigma that anyone who doesnt understand attaches to it.

Go to your GP and ask for a referral but my experience - go private as the hospitals are too busy
Read up on the subject - beyond prozac is a good book, read about cbt, positive thikning etc these are helped me (Dorothy Rowe has a few good books as well), take your medication its not prescribed for the sake of it and most of all realise there are others like you who have had many dark nights of the soul and can offer a helping hand

Right, I'll give you a little background. I've been clinically depressed from my early teens, I'm in my 20's now. I've gone through 3 different psychiatrists and I've lost count of how many therapists (over 20). I am seeing a private psychiatrist for the past 2 years, and at the moment am also seeing a consultant psychiatrist in Dublin. I've been on a lot of medication over the years and have have been on a drug that helps some bit over the past 3 years.. I'm not going to get into medications and their use here.

What I will say is, while they can help, they are not a cure.

I was given the Power of Positive Thinking when I was very young by mother who found it very good to help her deal with her depression (she has mild/moderate). It didn't do anything for me. I agree with it's message but I didn't find it helpful because I don't have a problem with negative thinking, I've a nice positive outlook generally

Self help books are good for a lot of people. But they do not help some of us. I could go into this more but it's a topic for another post


Altheus

Altheus wrote:

Just a question to the OP, do you have any faith in any organised religion, or concepts such as dogma and karma?

If not, do you accept every day reality through what you feel?

I'm not from a cult or anything, but I'd recommend you try and disconnect from that reality, through positive thinking, or through hallucinations.

For me self-hypnosis and psilocybin mushrooms were the key to removing my "depression". I still have those thoughts and doubts. The physical anguish is gone, and I can concentrate on other thinks. I see the way that apathy and inaction have the most detrimental effects on my body via my subconcious. There was no 'mystery' it was just a process that started at some point (even birth) and took quite a while to manifest, and when it did it was fairly controlling.

The power of suggestion and negative thinking combined with physical pain is what got you to where to are, and it's the power of suggestion and postive thinking combined with physical comfort which will remove it.

Eh....

You want me to disconnect from reality through hallucinations??????????

Ok... Look, go see a therapist. And by therapist, I mean a professional.

What you've just suggested to me is both dangerous and self destructive.

Running away from your problems and hiding from them in a fantasy land will NOT help you. You need to deal with your problems and go on living not hide from them in a drug fueled haze!

Seriously mate, I'm as much into alternative therapy as any open minded individual, but they are complimentary therapies not replacements for professional help!!

You need to talk to a professional about this. Believe me.

Edit:

There is a very harsh reality in depression where people try to "self-medicate" through alcohol and narcotics. I know I went through a patch of using alcohol and pot to try and block out my depression. I did more damage to myself over this time than any other time in my life.

Alcohol and narcotics are not answers to your problems they just create new problems that need to be dealt with!

nesf

AlcoholicA wrote:

I can relate to that, I've heard them all, "Depression? ah you're just tired, go to bed earlier."

And the description of your day was all too familiar. As for advice, I've no idea I don't know what I do when I have bad days, I just let them pass, theres nothing I know of that helps all that much, anyway....

Glad that someone could relate to what I said.

nesf

guest10000 wrote:

**************
"Having a mental illness in this country when you are very young is not easy. There is a lot of stigma and misinformation out there in this country. Depression is seen as a sign of weakness and not as a mental health problem by a large group of people in this country. Mentioning the word depression in your workplace can be the equivalent to shooting yourself in the foot. I remember jobs where my doctors lied on medical certificates because they knew that putting depression down on the cert would result in me losing my job or being discriminated against. In fact for the most part, I am forced to hide my illness (and yes it is an illness in my eyes) from certain parts of my life. I need to keep people unaware of what's wrong because of the stigma and problems associated with having a mental illness in this county."
**************

This is all too true. We have made some progress in Ireland on a lot of fronts over the last ten years - but let no-one think that we are at the front in terms of enlightenment....just a case of us being so far behind!

I have a good friend whose life has been wrecked by anxiety/depression, a close family relative who is most probably schizophrenic (sp?) and over the last year, I have gained a far greater understanding of one aspect of some specific mental health problems due to my own difficulties.
In the case of my friend, we were at college, sharing a house when he started getting compulsive/paranoid/stressed. He started imagining things - and at the time, I/We (his friends) didnt understand what was in front of us as a sickness - and started to drift away from him. Maybe if we had a better understanding (and if people in general had a better understanding), we could have been more helpful.
The close relative - well, shes currently going through her own personal hell. Its a difficult scenario as shes running away from the problem and has distanced herself from family. I can't help but think that if there wasnt such a stigma, this problem could have been treated and sorted out a long time ago - in which case she would be living a normal life now.
There is no better educator than personal experience. Some six months ago, I started doing extra hours at work. The nature of the working environment involves working in a very small space with approx. 60 others - working unsocial hours and longer than normal working days. I was never 100% comfortable in this situation but up until that point i could deal with it. I somehow found myself hanging over the edge - started getting tensed up, choked up and couldnt talk, the face would blush, the eyes would water - and i would draw everybodys attention to myself which just led to ever decreasing circles. Basically, what i'm talking about is anxiety and panic attacks - only happens at work but i need this job to pay the mortgage.

Anyways, i've digressed a little - as the point i want to make is as follows:
I dont regard myself as 'soft' by any stretch of the imagination - in fact, i would say that most of those i work with by my definition are far softer. However, it was interesting to see peoples reactions to me going through this turmoil -
'Does he have no shame?'
'What would you do with that? The only thing for that is a bullet in the head' (no joking - thats two gob****es standing a bit behind me (but within earshot) when i was going through one of these episodes. Under normal circumstances, I would have taken the heads of them - but these werent normal circumstances.
'....just feels sorry for himself'.
'hes soo special'

I could go on. But what i'm saying is that in all of these cases, theres a recurring theme....ignorance. Mental health is probably the last taboo subject in Ireland. If we were a lot more open about it, we would fair a lot better in dealing with it. Maybe those affected would come to terms with their affliction faster. Maybe the general population would allow them to deal with their problems without stigma and predjudice getting in the way.


Great post nesf. Good luck to you.

Again thank you for sharing. It is nice to know that I am not alone in my situation.

Altheus

Okay, straight up, apologies to anyway who may have construed my post as a message of endorsement for the use of drugs as a treatment for depression. Drugs are a volatile and dangerous thing that must be administered by a professional in coordination with therapist.

In my case however I did not 'self-medicate' however used hallucingenic drugs as a voyage of self-discovery along side a very heavy handed self analysis. I'm not going to recommend this to anyone as it is irresponsible.

However, for the purposes of hopefully not sounding like a complete loon, I'll try and explain..

You want me to disconnect from reality through hallucinations??????????

Ok... Look, go see a therapist. And by therapist, I mean a professional.

What you've just suggested to me is both dangerous and self destructive.

It is the case that the distorted reality of these situations through depression were almost completely at the root of my problem.

I did not tell you to self medicate through narcotics or self harm, nor would I recommend this to anyone.

Psilocybin mushrooms have a practical nature too, read about them and you'll see how they are used in other cultures to essentially rewire the perceptions of some people, it's not new crazy or anything like that.

What I was trying to do is explain how I was able to come out of a long term depression, which almost concluded locked in my room phase of my life involving methods of self-harm, self-deprecation, self-loathing and many other acts of detrimental nature.

Also a friend of mine who suffered similiarly since 10 (his 8 year old brother died of a brain tumor after several failed operations), was heavily medicated throughout his life, as well as several intensive counselling sessions a week. Three dissapearances, two suicide attempts, a brief spell in St. Pat's, he's here to tell similiar tale.

Another friend of mine, who I wont name, used drugs in a different manner, acid and ectasy specifically to "forget his problems", this is different to what I did in many aspects. However his long-term depression coupled with what was probably a brain completely devoid of serotonin resulted in his death last summer. Drugs are not the answer.

I still see scars on my legs and arms, I still see some of the people I know fade away and suffer, but I'm okay now. It came through self analysis, and being able to disconnect from the impossible realities that I enforced upon myself everyday I was depressed. The impossible reality of being medicated into a docile state, and as soon as it was removed a complete and utter system failure. Fetal positions on the street etc.

The self analysis I was able to perform through writing, situational removal. Depression isnt feeling sad, and it certainly isnt something making you sad. It may have been something sad that has spiralled out of control and you've buried deep in your unconscious, however I no longer harbour those demons, and I've explained to you how.

Life during depressive periods in my life did not seem real, however long they seem to get through. This place is no longer a prison, and days no longer are challenges I don't want to face.

I've got my family back, my girlfriend and I'm reasonably content in my job, and I'm happier than I've ever been. Also, probably important to note that I dont do psilocybin mushrooms anymore.

nesf

Ok, I misread it and thought you were talking about mushrooms of a different sort to the one's you seem to be speaking of.

I can begin to understand where you are coming from, and you do seem to realise that narcotic drugs, just do more harm than good.

Altering your perception of reality can be quite a complex and difficult experience. In one sense this is what therapy does for you. Although it is more accurate to say that it is not one's perception of reality that needs to be changed, but it is one's perception of one's self. Not in the idea of self esteem or self worth. But in the perception and interpretation of your emotions and thinking.

I'll talk more about this later. Don't have a chance to do it now.

LegacyUser

Thanks for your post Nesf - it was a learning experience. I have only mild depression but as you say that is almost the worst type to have in that its not really considered as anything other than a normal 'down' mood.

I used to be a very optimistic and energetic person that wanted to conquer the world but for the past few years I have had a lot of bullying at work which has progressively brought on this illness.
I can't help feeling kinda ashamed over it as I always considered myself a very self controlled person but just can't control this.

I have has some therapy too and am on medication but don't find it any good. I think the best 'therapy' is a good solicitor to sue the morons responsible for my health problems (he thinks I have a very good case)

I hope things work out for you and your degree - as you say just using a forum like this to get things off your chest can be a great relief.