Best computer qualification(s)

Alfasudcrazy

I am just wondering what all you computer whiz-kids consider to be the best computer qualification(s) to have in Ireland at the moment - and what do I have to do to get it/them?

Now that I have mastered photobucket.com I am thinking about a career change into IT - suggestions please

PowerHouseDan

Programming so i have been told with 3 Very big companies in Ireland.

RicardoSmith

Computer Science Degree then Industry Certs from Microsoft, Cisco, Sun etc.

Photobucket????

PowerHouseDan

Where would you go about doing those certs?

kjt

Cisco and Micosoft certs are usually done in the same centre's.
Most Fás colleges do night time courses in them too

Cisco is good but it could be hard going if your were to jump right into it.
Also its good because its known world wide

Ummm more cisco 2mrw :S

Variable lenght subnetting :eek:

damnyanks

Phd ? :d

RicardoSmith

Alfasudcrazy wrote:

I am just wondering what all you computer whiz-kids consider to be the best computer qualification(s) to have in Ireland at the moment - and what do I have to do to get it/them?

Now that I have mastered photobucket.com I am thinking about a career change into IT - suggestions please

Personally I wouldn't recoment a move to IT at the moment. Its becoming devalued and the market is shrinking as jobs are outsourced abroad. If you specialise in a specific area, like security, that might be a better option.

PowerHouseDan

I would have to disagree, All college courses are having very small numbers for computer classes, In my class alone there is 5, in another college there is not many more, there is going to be more demand than supply. It couldnt be a better time.

RicardoSmith

I wouldn't know about college. Though I'm doing a part time dip at the moment, its full of mature students who work in other fields.

I'm just going on my own experience and that of my collegues who are finding that opportunities in IT are reducing, theres competition for fewer roles and wages are stalled or even decreasing. For people with lots of experience and are fairly senior its still ok. Whish is why agencies are cherry picking them. But anyone in junior or intermediate roles its a tough market.

I've gone back to college to upskill myself, and have got out of contracting for the time being. But I'm still in IT.

seamus

Cisco Certs, MCSA/MSCE would probably be the best places to start.

Got a Win 2003 Server exam myself in 30 minutes! :eek:

Tempted

seamus wrote:

Cisco Certs, MCSA/MSCE would probably be the best places to start.

Got a Win 2003 Server exam myself in 30 minutes! :eek:

Hope you fail it.

RicardoSmith

seamus wrote:

Cisco Certs, MCSA/MSCE would probably be the best places to start.

Got a Win 2003 Server exam myself in 30 minutes! :eek:

Good luck!

I think that all IT professionals should have done the ECDL/MOUS at some point. Its a good introduction into the mindset of the certification exams, which is very different from real world experience. Its a nice easy ice breaker and easy to do. Plus you'll use those simple skills over and over.

Once you've done that then A+ etc, till you decide the path you want.

Khannie

Tempted wrote:

Hope you fail it.

Hope you like your ban. A**hole.

Khannie

Alfa: Depends how much time you want to spend. I'm a software engineer (aka programmer) and I did the whole degree thing. Spent 4 years in DIT Kevin Street. Great course. Very practical. Have a look around at Computer Science / Software engineering degrees if that route tickles your fancy.

There are plenty of alternatives out there though....various certifications from large companies that are well recognised.

IronMan

If the college route is out, and programming is not your scene, then I would recommend (in this order) A+, Network+, CCNA, which will give you an excellent grounding in Networking, and very employable.

unkel

@Alfasudcrazy: you'd better stay in the force. Better money and all the perks :eek:

Won't harm you to do a course in your spare time though

cormy

Alfasudcrazy - I know I could be accused of being all 'airy-fairy' by saying this, but in terms of career choice as well as the decisions one makes in life generally, you have to find out what you want, and once you do, just go for it.

If IT is where you want to be then don't necessarily be put off by an apparently poor IT market, and lack of experience. I've been working in IT through the boom and the bust, and I can tell you that it's the good people who are good at their jobs and who are willing to work hard who are still there and doing fine out of it. Sure there's less IT jobs around now but that's because a) There was an artificially high IT workforce 5 years ago, when companies threw jobs at anyone who could use a keyboard (plus some who couldn't!), and b) By now most of the jokers who were just coasting along with the boom have been cut, with the genuine workers remaining.

Edit: Phew, that was veering very off topic (and turning into a bit of a rant) - apologies :Edit

In terms of courses/certification I say there's no harm in it - at the very least it might help you figure out if a job in IT is something you want, and at best it'll show a prospective employer that you are committed to this career change. You could also look into DB admin qualifications - there seem to be a few jobs in Oracle admin for example - plus don't forget about unix - there's less jobs going in unix-related areas compared to windows - but the pay may be better.

Balfa

How do people go about looking for entry level programming jobs?? I've got a CS degree, but I haven't been able to work for a while. Now I am looking for a job, but there are no entry level programming jobs available! Everyone wants like, 5, 7, 10 years experience (usually in very specific areas).

I'm not in Ireland, but does anyone have general ideas on how to find entry-level programming (or software engineering) jobs?

damnyanks

Its a numbers game getting a job. I've had to secure an industrial placement (12 month contract) this year. I'm not an excellent student and I don't know it all nor do I pretend too

However I've been lucky enough to have been offered a lot of positions ranging from 10k sterling to 35k sterling. Most of these positions offered are given in the hope that you actually are a good employee and will be sponsored for your final year at university and masters if you wish after which you will be offered a job int he company. At least thats the way it seems talking to people who have done these placements.

I've also been to companies that have major software development going on in Asia they still require a strong pressence in countries based in Europe for different reasons. At the very least localisation will be needed

RicardoSmith

Balfa wrote:

How do people go about looking for entry level programming jobs?? I've got a CS degree, but I haven't been able to work for a while. Now I am looking for a job, but there are no entry level programming jobs available! Everyone wants like, 5, 7, 10 years experience (usually in very specific areas).

I'm not in Ireland, but does anyone have general ideas on how to find entry-level programming (or software engineering) jobs?

In many cases you can subsitute project experience for years of experience. By that I mean the following. If you have built a website, or a database, or an application for friends and family, and its built using good practise. Many companies will see this as better then say a years experience in a testing or localisation role. For myself I found that lots of people were more interested in talking through what I did on projects, how it worked, to see if I had and understanding of what was on my CV than simply taking years of experience for face value. There are too many chancers people who coast in IT.

Also reference from people especially those whom you've done some work for, works out well. So if you built a database system for a family members shop or business that would help a lot too.

KdjaCL

Start Small and see if you likeif, keeping expenses to a minimum and all the while working in a real job

Do A+ and Inet + with this lot basics

Then if you into it go for an MCP in Windows XP, by then you should have basic job in IT, then go for the biggie MCSE, should take a year max to get 1st 2.
MCP in XP actually easish if you know what you doing.

Then decide what you want to do, can all 3 1st ones for under €400 and studying twice a week.


kdjac

Skud

start with communication. People are crying out for individuals to be the middle man between business (customer needs) and the programmer for example. Very well paid.

RicardoSmith

Skud wrote:

start with communication. People are crying out for individuals to be the middle man between business (customer needs) and the programmer for example. Very well paid.

You mean a business analyst?

causal

seamus wrote:

Got a Win 2003 Server exam myself in 30 minutes! :eek:

Hope it went well for you Seamus.

causal

seamus

Cheers, I got it alright.

Onto the next (Network Infrastructure)...

causal

Congratulations - but you're a glutton for punishment!


causal

seamus

causal wrote:

Congratulations - but you're a glutton for punishment!

It's all gratis, so twould be rude not to

Nietzschean

RicardoSmith wrote:

I think that all IT professionals should have done the ECDL/MOUS at some point.

I ain't following that logic, from what i've heard of it is it not all very very basic computer stuff? I for one have never done it, never crossed me mind to do it either...

seamus

Darth Bobo wrote:

I ain't following that logic, from what i've heard of it is it not all very very basic computer stuff? I for one have never done it, never crossed me mind to do it either...

Well, unless obviously you've got other qualifications like a degree.
My place insisted on the MOS exams. Tbh, they are simple, but they'd be useful for any support role, particularly dealing with the apps you wouldn't use as much, namely Powerpoint and Access.

Gandorf

Just an aside, if you're interested in Java programming you could do a lot worse then do the Sun certifications.

Sun Certified Programmer
Sun Certified Developer
Sun Certified Web Component Developer
etc.

I've done 3-4 in my spare time and, while no sbstitute for experience, you will learn a lot and become a better and more confident developer. That's assuming of course that you use the certs as an opportunity to learn and not just to get a bit of paper

www.javaranch.com is a great resource for the Sun certs (and others to a lesser degree) .

Alfasudcrazy

Thanks for all the advice people - it was a great to read through all those posts even if a lot of the stuff went over my head.

I would like to do some courses in my spare time and gradually see if its for me or not - I will enroll in some night classes for the winter.
If that fails I can alway fall back on plan B - my career in FI (I suspect there may be an opening there now that Shumi is not as strong)

shoegirl

It depends what you are interested in. If you want to do support etc, then networking, ERP appls, Oracle and Unix are good areas. Unfortunately there are a lot of good bullshi**ers in the Windows support market and competing with them is enough of a pain without having to work with some of those losers - so go for the more difficult skills as you'll find that the chancers won't be able to talk their way into these kinda jobs.

Certification from Sun, Cisco, Oracle are good places to start for jobs like these. MCPs are good, but again, I have found that the Windows support/hardware support and helpdesk market is flooded with a lot of people who are great at selling themselves so its highly competitive. Also a lot of places want languages so if you are english only you're often at a disadvantage.

A diploma or degree is best for programming but there are also Microsoft, Sun etc qualifications that will do. A lot of people I know who've made it in programming started out in testing - it seems to be a good way to get your foot in the door if you've limited experience.

Lastly there is the business option - there are a lot of business process jobs out there for which a business qualification with some IT element will get you in. A lot of these seem to be excellent jobs and well worth a look into. Having said that again there are a good few bullshi**ers in that area of the market and its bad enough to have to compete for the jobs without having to endure them as colleagues.

The support and programming salaries seem to have lost pace with inflation in recent years so don't expect big money. However with experience and hard work, like in any trade, you will progress bit by bit.