Bus lanes

vector

If I had a blog I'd put the following in it, but seeing asI don't I'll put it here.

What do you thinbk of the folling....
Bus lanes should be on the far right of the road (not on the far left as they are)
This would convey a "overtaking, fast, going places" image that would attract passengers, and not the tantemount to hard shoulder "slow coach" image of present.

Further, the reopening of the far left for cars would reinforce the "keep left" mantra that drivers often forget as they sit in the fast lane of dual carrigeways"

However, this would require buses with doors on the right side and not the left.

The bus would still be allowed to cross lanes if if had to turn the opposite direction.

murphaph

What about when the bus isn't on a dual carriageway?

What about the fact that on a dual carriageway alighting passengers would be stranded in the central reservation?

I'm sorry, I think it's bonkers.

antoinolachtnai

Well, a related idea is the contraflow bus lane. The idea here is that the contraflow lane is unlikely to be disturbed by people parking or driving in it.

One place where this has been proposed is on the Quays in Dublin. One part of the quays is already contraflowed. This is an idea that seems to make a fair amount of sense.

Placing bus lanes isn't really a matter of making an impression. Putting the bus lane in the right place makes a big difference to journey times. Shortening journey time by even 5 or 10 percent can result in a vast improvement in profitability and viability.

John R

That is a stupid idea, it would not be practical in an area with large amounts of continuous seperated dual carriageway never mind Dublin where only one such route exists and even that is only approx 50% of any bus route.

antoinolachtnai wrote:

Well, a related idea is the contraflow bus lane. The idea here is that the contraflow lane is unlikely to be disturbed by people parking or driving in it.

One place where this has been proposed is on the Quays in Dublin. One part of the quays is already contraflowed. This is an idea that seems to make a fair amount of sense.

If you are referring to Eden Quay then it will soon be devoid of any buses as DCC has insisted that all the stops be removed, something to do with ruining the atmosphere of their new boardwalk. Already dangerously overpopulated Westmoreland St/Fleet St/D'Olier St will probably be the happy new stops for the displaced Tallaght routes.

I am not sure if the contraflow bus lane will be removed but without any buses it doesn't really matter much.

antoinolachtnai wrote:

Placing bus lanes isn't really a matter of making an impression. Putting the bus lane in the right place makes a big difference to journey times. Shortening journey time by even 5 or 10 percent can result in a vast improvement in profitability and viability.

Properly designing the bus lane is equally important, I could easily shave 5mns off the typical outward Stillorgan QBC journey times with a brush and pot of white paint. The no doubt very well educated and highly renumerated professionals who design and implement these things appear to be uniformly ignorant about the most basic requirements of a useable bus corridor. Things such as bus lanes needing to be wider than a bus and not providing short undertaking sections where bus lanes dissappear and queing cars can legally block bus progress.

Sarsfield

John R wrote:

If you are referring to Eden Quay then it will soon be devoid of any buses as DCC has insisted that all the stops be removed, something to do with ruining the atmosphere of their new boardwalk. Already dangerously overpopulated Westmoreland St/Fleet St/D'Olier St will probably be the happy new stops for the displaced Tallaght routes.

If Dublin Bus extended these city centre terminating routes a little further, places such as Eden Quay and Aston Quay could actually operate as genuine bus lanes as opposed to the bus parks they currently are.

Hopefully when the port tunnel opens and traffic on North Wall Quay is reduced as a result, it will be possible to extend a lot of East-West routes into the docklands. Possibly serving Spencer Dock Train Station?? And maybe introduce two-way traffic (or a contraflow bus lane) on Sir John Rogersons Quay?

weehamster

Wasnt Galway CC suppose to do a trial where the bus lane was in the centre?

Sarsfield

Sarsfield wrote:

And maybe introduce two-way traffic (or a contraflow bus lane) on Sir John Rogersons Quay?

City Quay I mean!

raster

vector, I see the thinking behind your idea and if this was a progressive scandavanian country the idea would be tried, it might have its advantages, but there is little political incentive here to reform public transport (outside dublin)* so the its a non-starter.

when we finally switch to dirving on the right, as EU harmonisation will dictate, you will see a temporary realisation of your idea but not as you desire.

*look at the posts here, and the news, the papers, dublin is what counts, the AA ad on the radio 6179950 (the 01 area code isint mentioned as it is presumed to be the default, still fair play to the AA for jazzing up a normal number and saving on a 1800/1850/1890)

jman0

raster wrote:

when we finally switch to dirving on the right, as EU harmonisation will dictate, you will see a temporary realisation of your idea but not as you desire.

Is that really on the cards?
It'd be brilliant if tru, it sucks being in a backwards country
http://users.pandora.be/worldstandards/driving%20on%20the%20left.htm#leftdriving
Scroll down (or up?) and check out the map

John R

jman0 wrote:

Is that really on the cards?
It'd be brilliant if tru, it sucks being in a backwards country
http://users.pandora.be/worldstandards/driving%20on%20the%20left.htm#leftdriving
Scroll down (or up?) and check out the map

Oh yes, a fantastic use of resources. Should we build some badly needed rail lines to ease the commuter chaos, nah let's spend the money on digging up every piece of street furniture in the country, redesign every major junction, make every car far more dangerous to operate and render every single public service vehicle obsolete. Why? Well we don't want to be associated with a "backward" form of driving now do we? :rolleyes:

John R

Sarsfield wrote:

If Dublin Bus extended these city centre terminating routes a little further, places such as Eden Quay and Aston Quay could actually operate as genuine bus lanes as opposed to the bus parks they currently are.

Not as simple as that, even if all the buses terminated outside the city they would still clog up narrow bus lanes when picking up the large numbers that fet on in the city centre, just look at O'Connell Street southbound in the evenings.

The plan for the Tallaght routes is to run them from Ringsend Depot so they won't be sitting around in the city centre, but they will still have to crowd into stops already full with other routes.

As it currently is the lane on Eden Quay is of little benefit to through routes, accessing it would use up any time gained from using it.

antoinolachtnai

Extending routes is often not the answer. The problem is that you increase the duration of the journey. If you increase the duration of the journey, then you inevitably end up reducing the frequency of the service. In a lot of cases, it is more frequency than convenience which drives ridership. (Just look at the Luas.)

Of course, everything has to be kept in balance, and it's obviously important to make the routes long enough so that they intersect.

Branoic

Umm.....all the stops are on the left of the road. If the bus lane was on the right, it would have to weave across the traffic lanes every time it had to stop to let off / pick up passengers. I don't see that working.

vector

Branoic wrote:

Umm.....all the stops are on the left of the road. If the bus lane was on the right, it would have to weave across the traffic lanes every time it had to stop to let off / pick up passengers. I don't see that working.

You can't make an omlette without breaking some eggs, I was just running an idea up the flagpole to see if anyone would salute, but they won't wear it

antoinolachtnai

Vector, look upon it as a success, it prompts discussion.

On the wrong-side-of-the-road issue, aircoach use the buses they use to facilitate parking on the right hand side of the arrivals road at Dublin Airport.

magpie

reform public transport (outside dublin)*

YAWN

MrPudding

raster wrote:

........the AA ad on the radio 6179950 (the 01 area code isint mentioned as it is presumed to be the default, still fair play to the AA for jazzing up a normal number and saving on a 1800/1850/1890)

I have only heard that ad on Newstalk106, as it is a Dublin only channel I would have thought it perfectly valid to leave out the code.

That said, Dublin is more important.:D

MrP

magpie

I have only heard that ad on Newstalk106, as it is a Dublin only channel I would have thought it perfectly valid to leave out the code.

That said, Dublin is more important.

MrP

Holy ****. I agree with Mr Pudding.

MrPudding

magpie wrote:

Holy ****. I agree with Mr Pudding.

I'll get me coat.

MrP

vector

MrPudding wrote:

I have only heard that ad on Newstalk106, as it is a Dublin only channel I would have thought it perfectly valid to leave out the code.

That said, Dublin is more important.:D

MrP

No it also plays on (rTé) Radio 1

Victor

There is actually a proposal for the main avenue in the North Fringe to have the bus lanes in the middle of the road, presumably the logic being it isn't obstucted by parked and turning vehicles. Stops would be staggered and poision on the "centre left" of the road (busses would go to the right, other traffic to the left).

vector wrote:

No it also plays on (rTé) Radio 1

But thats a Dublin-only station, isn't it?

vector

RTE Radio 1 is the "Irish Times"* of the air

that would make a nice soundbite for some hack to use in a syndicated dead trees sidebar that is published every thursday, oh no its mine copyright and all that, damn journos

*ie considered dublin centric, authorative the source of record, guarantees audience regardless of content, etc

Metrobest

What's happening with the 'save the trees' campaign on Mount Merrion Ave?

Sarn

Metrobest wrote:

What's happening with the 'save the trees' campaign on Mount Merrion Ave?

Now that would be criminal if they cut down all those trees to facilitate a handful of passengers a day. Why cut down trees to speed up the last 50 m of a route (just before it hits the Stillorgan dual carriageway). If it was a main/busy bus route there might be some merit in installing bus lanes. I live near that bus route and gave up getting any buses on it simply because they were so infrequent.

I've only experience with the Stillorgan QBC into the city centre, but I find that works unbelievably well. Having the QBC on the left allows the bus to pull in easily. Coming out is messier though, especially with people double parking in Donnybrook :mad:

Victor

Sarn wrote:

Now that would be criminal if they cut down all those trees to facilitate a handful of passengers a day.

Yeah! Build the bus lane in the oversized gardens!

D'Peoples Voice

Sarsfield wrote:

If Dublin Bus extended these city centre terminating routes a little further, places such as Eden Quay and Aston Quay could actually operate as genuine bus lanes as opposed to the bus parks they currently are.

Hopefully when the port tunnel opens and traffic on North Wall Quay is reduced as a result, it will be possible to extend a lot of East-West routes into the docklands. Possibly serving Spencer Dock Train Station?? And maybe introduce two-way traffic (or a contraflow bus lane) on Sir John Rogersons Quay?

That's a problem I have with Dublin Bus. why must buses terminate and leave the Quays.
It would be better if the buses from the southside (46A, 48A, 10,11 etc) came down Westmoreland street, over o'connell bridge, took a right turn, went down to the custom house, took a right across Matt talbot bridge, had their terminus beside Ulster bank(knock down an old buildin or two on the left), and then stopped at Tara Street dart station before taking a left up d'olier street and up past Trinity. At least then they would get in O'connell street (just a about I accept) and the IFSC and the DART.
Or at least some compromise of the above!