Rock n'Roll attitude for Musicians

Spicy Lauren

I am SICK of people who say they have that "rock 'n roll' attitude just because they play in bands or are musicians!
I've seen guys being sacked from their job after telling their boss to fcuk off, and their friends, inevitably calling that 'rock n Roll'!
I believe that there is no such thing as 'being rock n' roll', in fact my belief is that "rock n'Roll" only belongs in magazines and in films.
Being a musician/in a band is a lot of work and commitment, and I think that people who pretend to be "rock n'roll" are either alcoholics and/or druggies who try to justify their bad behavior, ignorance and/or lack of intelligence as "being rock n'roll"
I dont know what you people out there think about this and would very much appreciate your opinion!

Lauren, the 'Rock Chick'!! - as I was called the other day just because of my hair cut!!

Baggio

Lauren,
..your probably right although its not the most important question out there,,,, by the way whats with the rock chick hair cut!!!
I believe many folks here are somehow dragged into sort of "must haves" to be into rock or in a band etc you must say "dude" and smoke weed now and then, you must do the ol satanic fingers sign ,,,and dont forget to wear black only no coulours in rock and roll..so pink and green are out
For me the biggest problem is unreliable so called musicians and so called bands i couldnt care less really what they talk or look like - just bloody wel turn up and do yer stuff with yer band!..not doing that at least - is deffinately NOT rock and roll.

now...where did I leave that yellow and green covered Jim Reeves album?!....

ciao'..Baggio....

Bitsie

i would have to agree with you there Baggio, i dont think rock n roll or any type of music is based on style or attitude its the committment and talent to the music, and actually turning up and playing and enjoying it all. all the other crap that people regard as being rock n roll can give other people in rock bands bad names. People who just want to play music.

magpie

Rock musicians should have sensible haircuts and dayjobs.

Em... I always thought that the reason "Rock Stars" ala Kurt Cobain, Jimi Hendrix Jim Morrison etc. (All Dead peeper people!) were legends was down to the fact, they did break all the rules and led a life that the rest of us can only fantasise about. I like my rock stars to be that.

Bitsie

i think the reasons they were legends was because they were incredible musicians and unfortunatly all that other crap just went with it......why do you think they are all dead now!!! not the way it should end up

Possibly.

What about Jim Morrisons CONSTANT failure to turn up to rehearsal sober?
Nearly missing shows because they were ALL of their faces?
Would you like to watch a wrinkly old "Legend"?
Because would you really like to say you would like to have seen Jimi, Jim, Janis, Marc Bolan and the other young suicides go through the eighties?
Before you say yes, please look at what happened to Bowie, The Rolling Stones Paul McCartney, Rod Stewart.

Spicy Lauren

Yea no sorry, I'm just p*ssed off really with some drummer who thinks he's a rock star because he drinks beer for breakfast. Yer man's a feckin' bum if you ask me.. Anyway I think I just needed to let my anger out somehow!
I wasnt at all talking about the way you dress or do your hair; only about that 'I-dont-give-a-f*ck-cos-i'm-a-rock-star-and-I-can-do-whatever-the-f***-i-want' attitude that p*ss me off so much with so-called musicians.

Thats a different kettle of fish.
I'm in a band at present and while we all (to an extent) live a rock n'roll lifestyle (he says, typing in his office day job ) You have to put the effort in first. Rock n'roll should free you and make you feel fulfilled. If you are hearing the sound of a can at the breakfast table, something is obviously not right.

spunkymunky

Was the 'rock star' saying 'live fast and die young'? Thats what these guys did. Drugs booze and an all that goes with but this just doesnt cut it any more. To many rules to many outcomes people arent prepared to take also its not safe any more. To much s.hit that can go wrong.
People are still living fast and dying young unfortunatley but its in cars and fast food. It all go go go. Maybe were all rock stars but for all the wrong reasons????

John

This is all very metaphysical for the music forum!

Drinking beer for breakfast isn't rock and roll, it's alcoholism (although I have done it before)

sroberts82

Papa Smut wrote:

Possibly.

What about Jim Morrisons CONSTANT failure to turn up to rehearsal sober?
Nearly missing shows because they were ALL of their faces?
Would you like to watch a wrinkly old "Legend"?
Because would you really like to say you would like to have seen Jimi, Jim, Janis, Marc Bolan and the other young suicides go through the eighties?
Before you say yes, please look at what happened to Bowie, The Rolling Stones Paul McCartney, Rod Stewart.

If they wouldnt have been capable of getting through the 80's without being influenced by all the other crap going on then they wouldnt have been the legends we think. Are you seriously trying to say it was a good thing that jimi hendrix died? Cmon. The reason these guys are legends is because they died young and never got a chance to play crap stuff. If paul mccartney had been shot instead of lennon we'd all worship mccartney and not lennon.

jptk

Spicy Lauren wrote:

Yea no sorry, I'm just p*ssed off really with some drummer who thinks he's a rock star because he drinks beer for breakfast. Yer man's a feckin' bum if you ask me.. Anyway I think I just needed to let my anger out somehow!
I wasnt at all talking about the way you dress or do your hair; only about that 'I-dont-give-a-f*ck-cos-i'm-a-rock-star-and-I-can-do-whatever-the-f***-i-want' attitude that p*ss me off so much with so-called musicians.

i agree, i hate people who have that attitude. Arrogant W*nkers! Give the rest of us a bad name

To Sroberts 82:

Yes, I believe that was my point.

Thank you.

paulmartin

It's ok having that attitude if your in a big rich, successful rock band. But as long as you still have a seperate day job it makes you look like a bollix. Getting sacked for telling your boss to **** off is just dumb. The reason people like Jim Morrison and Kurt Cobain acted like they did is because they could, they had lots of money, and nobody was going to sack them for turning up drunk to recording sessions or telling a record exec to **** off. Anyway, I don't think it's as common as your making it out to be, except maybe among 12-17 year olds, where i suppose that attitude is understable. All the best local musicians I know are the soundest people you could meet.

magpie

Being unemployed, drinking Dutch Gold for breakfast and living in a Bedsit in Rathmines doesn't sound very rock'n'roll to me.

For tips on Rock Star ettiquete check out the Motley Crue book. Funniest thing I've read in years. Should have a 'Do not try this at home' warning sticker.

However, most Irish musos are unbelievably earnest, quiet, unassuming types who talk in hushed voices about Wilco, Lambchop and other such alt.countyr.lofi.twaddle acts and are busy recording triple albums of Son Volt covers in their Mam's house in Phibsboro. Which, let's be honest, isn't very rock'n'roll at all.

EDIT/ Smut, I saw Bowie in the HQ on Abbey Street about 5 years ago and he was astonishingly good.

Yes he was.
However, can I just say two words?

Tin Machine

magpie

Tin Machine

That was harsh.

magpie

magpie wrote:

That was harsh.

lol

Brother A

I think this is a question for our times:
what is rock & roll?

Back when it all kicked off, it was fairly clear: us vs them, kids vs grownups, old vs. new.

Now those people have grown up, and instead of music for adults, most commercial music now appears to be made for young people,
More importantly though, society in general has embraced rock
and roll, and generally innovation. So there is no 'them' to rebel against. If you make rock and roll these days, you are 'them'.


Yet, rock and roll, and all its 'music for young people' incarnations is still stuck in many ways where it began, as a 'rebellion' of some sort.
But because that ethic is (arguably) no longer truly relevant, rock & roll is increasingly reduced to expressing this 'rebelliousness' in its cloths, hairstyles, and general 'style' etc.

The fact is, the more you engage in bad behaviou & general rebelliousness, the more 'rock and roll' you really are. But the reason why Spicy Lauren & many others today react negatively to this is because the 'rock and roll' culture, as it once was, is no longer relevant to us, and this 'bad behaviour',
stripped of the worthiness which it once might have had (us vs them etc.), is now seen as useless and disruptive.

But why do new musicians still want to 'rock out', in the way we're discussing. Maybe they simply do not realise the rebellionis 'over'. I put it now as follows though, that many do this because rock&roll continues (for the present at least) to afford a benefit which it has always afforded -> social status.

In all of this, I haven't discussed the 'work and committment' mentioned by Spicy Lauren, because I'm not sure if thats the real issue. The real issue, the one that is starting to upset many, I feel - is the 'rock and roll' output, which is I would argue, insufficient to our times - in exactly the same way as the 'rock and roll' attitude.

Right well, what is sufficient to our times. We had our rebellion we have our freedom (musically at least I suppose) - so what now. Like after all rebellions, I would say - we build.
Build better songs & better ways of expression & music creation.
Forget rock & roll,
make a new attitude so you can make a better music.

Turd Ferguson

I think the bottom line in this is that it never really mattered what they did, weather(spelling?) it was music or acting or fixing washing machines. They would have all ended up the same cause thats the kinda people they were. For example I'm sure if Jim Morrison was never in the Doors he would have still drank and took drugs to excess(as he did BEFORE he joined them!). Alright granted some eg Kurt, might not have ended that way but still its only because of the fact that they were musicians that they were deemed 'rock and roll'.

I'm sure there are pleanty of office workers and fishermen and POLITICIANS that have that same "go f*ck yourself" attitude but just because there not in a band means there not 'rock and roll'. Its just exposure and the media that creates this bullspit.

Its not the music, its the general attitude. Some people are a**holes, some people are quiet and others are 'rock and roll'.

And thats my two cents.......

NeMiSiS

The amount of arrogant, pompous, so up their own arse about their abilities 'musicians', I have met in Ireland is staggering.

Bit off topic I suppose, but like.. I was at a gig the other day.. and one of the bands we were playing with.. because my band had not showed up in their entirity yet.. I asked him for a dig out.. just carrying an amp.. up two flights of stairs.. Ye'd I'd asked 'Can I ride yer mam for an hour' Barely talked to us before the gig.. I think they figured we were 'the competition' where as.. we were there just to.. play a gig.. have a bit of fun and put on a good show for any of the people that showed up.

We have supplied backlines for bands, and barely got a ****ing thank you.

The amount of idiots that seem to think they are 'the next big thing' so they can be a pack of arrogant assholes is beyond me. I'l allways say good luck to a band we are gigging with before they go on, and well done afterwerds.. but the reverse seems pretty rare.

Just seems to be alot of ego's floating round.
Bit of a rant I suppose.
TK

juno75

Bit of a rant I suppose

Im in solidarity with that rant.

That cr@p seems to be the norm , or I'm getting old and narkey...

jcoote

that rock and roll attitude is bollix ...i'm sure u'll find that the life of excess that all the greats lead was only possible because they were so good... wait until u have proved yourself before u go drinkin beer for breakfast or throwing tele's out windows... what the point in wastin your dole money on bein an asshole?????

BossArky

I used to be in a band with a fellow who used to wear a fishnet singlet gigging, long hair swinging in the smoke on the club. Couldn't play to save himself but god didn't he look cool :rolleyes: Tried to talk him into writing a few riffs intead of writing crap chordy songs. May has well have been talking Chinese. So rock and roll he was :cool:

clay

yes, the whole rock n roll attitude is incredibly passe, and seeing people affect that kind of behavior in an effort to be cool is really pretty funny.
As for the "obnoxious musician" types the thing to remember is that when they're trying to put other people down they're just projecting their own insecurities, basically they're scared little children.
I think an interesting point about this whole attitude argument is that if you want to succeed in the music business and sell a lot of records, the attitude you project IS important. People aren't just buying the music, they are (even if only subconsciously) buying the attitude too. Obviously without good music behind it the attitude counts for sh*t, and those who are in it for the attitude or believe the attitude is more important than the music are fools. Still the fact remains that if you make eg hip hop your record company will do everything in its power to keep your love of fly fishing and best behaved pupil in fifth class award out of the public domain. Same goes for any other kind of music...maybe coldplay don't give a toss about making trade fare, but they sound so earnest and, you know, REAL (just like their music)...guess we'll never know