The standard of the EPL as regards the rest of Europe

Jivin Turkey

Im loving seeing some of the posts

"The Premier League is crap in comparison to the rest of Europe"
"La Liga is the best"
"They just cant cut it"

following Uniteds and Arsenals exit from Europe.

When it comes down to it the only place you can judge which is better is in Europe. And correct me if Im wrong, there is no La Liga teams left in the CL, and the quarter finals arent even finalised yet. Valencia have also been eliminated from the UEFA cup.

Yet there are two English teams left in the CL. One of them just after knocking out the darlings of La Liga. And deservedly so.

Only Millwall, out of Englands european representatives were been eliminated from Europe before last night. United and Arsenal both went out, but were hardly blown away. If it werent for a blunder by Caroll at OT, last nights game would have been a totally different kettle of fish. Arsenal made it difficult for themselves, but again came very close.

Italian teams are doing well this year in the CL, but then last year only one made it to the quarters.

Other leagues might be more pleasing on the eye as regards technique, but as Chelsea showed last night, flair and silky skills dont always triumph. Virtues like grit, hunger, determination can take you just as far (even further when complemented with skill and flair).

Some people need to open their eyes, particularly at La Liga. It looks great, and is a joy to watch. But there is a lot more to football than Ronaldinhos latest turn.

Juve to lift the CL.

A Dub in Glasgo

TBH, I was surprised how easily the Bacelona defence capitulated against Chelsea. I was not surprised to see the other 'strong' teams of the EPL fail to go through against the 'strong' teams from the Italian and German league. I was also not surprised (especially after the 1st leg) to see 'a not so strong' EPL team go through against 'a not so strong' German team. What can I conclude from this? It is the luck of the draw!

Jivin Turkey

But what Im really getting at is:

People rave on about La Liga. The top two in La Liga were eliminated by their coresponding teams from the other strongest leagues in Europe. The best teams winning.

The other Spanish teams in the CL didnt even make it to the knock out stages.

KdjaCL

Swings and roundabouts tbh there has been all spanish finals ,every 2 years or so balance changes in CL, Epl clubs usually still involved till latter stages. This year could be all english or all italian final depending on the draw.

Cracking 2 nights of football all the same, the best players in the world having kickabouts.

kdjac

A Dub in Glasgo

Celtic knocked out Barcelona last season in Europe and held them to a draw this season in the Camp Nou... Does this mean that the SPL is better than La Liga (no need to answer that one )

Jivin Turkey

KdjaC wrote:

Swings and roundabouts tbh there has been all spanish finals ,every 2 years or so balance changes in CL, Epl clubs usually still involved till latter stages.

The all Spanish final was five years ago.

This Barcelona team that people rave about flopped. Just like they did in last years UEFA cup. Real Madrid also did. These are the two best teams in Spain, yet its three years since either made an impression on Europe.

David19

KdjaC wrote:

Swings and roundabouts tbh there has been all spanish finals ,every 2 years or so balance changes in CL, Epl clubs usually still involved till latter stages. This year could be all english or all italian final depending on the draw.

Cracking 2 nights of football all the same, the best players in the world having kickabouts.

kdjac

Off topic slightly: it was a great two nights of football. Im glad they changed the format. Its a great competition.

Anyway on topic: Is it not true that generally in the latter stages English teams aren't there? How many times have English teams been in the semi's or final in the last few years? Its mainly Spanish, German and Italian teams.

Jivin Turkey

David19 wrote:

Is it not true that generally in the latter stages English teams aren't there? How many times have English teams been in the semi's or final in the last few years? Its mainly Spanish, German and Italian teams.

In the last three years England have had two representatives in the semis, Italy have had three, Spain four, Germany one, France one, Portugal one.

There is hardly a huge gulf in class there. Which is what Im trying to point out. Im not saying England pisses on the other leagues from a height. Im saying that a lot of peoples perceptions of how good La Liga is and how bad the EPL is, going by this years results in particular, is incorrect.

A Dub in Glasgo

Jivin Turkey wrote:

The all Spanish final was five years ago.

This Barcelona team that people rave about flopped. Just like they did in last years UEFA cup. Real Madrid also did. These are the two best teams in Spain, yet its three years since either made an impression on Europe.

That is a valid point but you cannot then say that the EPL is stronger. How many years has it been since a side from the EPL made an impression in Europe?

Jivin Turkey

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

That is a valid point but you cannot then say that the EPL is stronger. How many years has it been since a side from the EPL made an impression in Europe?

Chelsea made an impression last year. I think they will go one better this year.

But Im not stating as fact though that: The EPL is stronger.

Im disputing the notion, that a lot of people claim is fact and completely clear-cut, that: La Liga is the best in the world.

KdjaCL

Jivin Turkey wrote:

There is hardly a huge gulf in class there. Which is what Im trying to point out. Im not saying England pisses on the other leagues from a height. Im saying that a lot of peoples perceptions of how good La Liga is and how bad the EPL is, going by this years results in particular, is incorrect.

I wouldnt look at it as a league pissing contest but from the 4 from EPL 2 are on form Utd Chel 1 kinda on form Arse other widly unpredictable in league but doing well in CL. (EPL top 3 and 5th)
The 4 spanish who started in CL only Barca and Real have hit decent form this season Depor and Valencia (champions) have been fairly **** this season so wouldnt expect them to go tru. (la Ligas top 2 and 5th and 9th)

kdjac

Rossonero

2001 2 Italian teams in final.
2000 2 Spanish teams in final
2004 1 French in final, 1 in semi
2004 1 English in semi

If the EPL is better it's not being shown.

Plus in England there is always the same 3 in the race for the title, in Spain it varies more. More depth in quality.

S.America>European>EPL

thejollyrodger

Im loving seeing some of the posts

"The Premier League is crap in comparison to the rest of Europe"
"La Liga is the best"
"They just cant cut it"

following Uniteds and Arsenals exit from Europe.

Real Madrid has won the competition more times than any other team and even most countries !!, so beat that !

Mancherster united have only won it twice but you would think listening to them that they are champions of Europe. Arsenal Nil so maybe thats where it stems from.

Badabing

I think la liga is the best league in europe because of the players that play there and the type of football they play, plus the depth of quality of the league ,the top teams always get very tough games outwith the top six or seven teams.

dcarroll

thejollyrodger wrote:

Real Madrid has won the competition more times than any other team and even most countries !!, so beat that !

Mancherster united have only won it twice but you would think listening to them that they are champions of Europe. Arsenal Nil so maybe thats where it stems from.

Yeah that's true, but also a lot of them were in 1950s/60s (don't know or care I wasn't even born then) but now there just a bunch of prima donnas more concerned about what their hair looks like than the champions league

thejollyrodger

Real Madrid have won it more recently than Man Utd, so thats not a fair comment. A few of the Reál player think they are glacticos but thats only a few players in Real. None of the other teams like Barca, Juve, Milian are queer acting.

Personally I was delighted when Cafu started laughing at that clown Ronaldo. Poser.

I for one was cheering on Barca the other other night. I knew sadly that Chelski (+ all their porto tricks)would win it. Barca were playing the better footbal !!

Slash/ED

Jivin Turkey wrote:

The all Spanish final was five years ago.

This Barcelona team that people rave about flopped. Just like they did in last years UEFA cup. Real Madrid also did. These are the two best teams in Spain, yet its three years since either made an impression on Europe.

Flopped? Come off it for **** sake. They were very unlucky to lose to a goal that should have been disallowed in a match they should have won if they took their chances, it was just luck.

The EPL have had one team in the final in around twenty years, that's fairly pathetic even accounting for the fact that they weren't allowed enter for around a quater of that. Until that changes they will always be viewed as inferior to the best that La Liga and Serie A has to offer, EPL teams normally survive well until the latter stages and then go out.

Like someone said though it swings in roundabouts and someday the EPL will be the dominant force for a short while.

Jivin Turkey

Slash/ED wrote:

Flopped? Come off it for **** sake. They were very unlucky to lose to a goal that should have been disallowed in a match they should have won if they took their chances, it was just luck.

Yes flopped. For the second season in a row this Barcelona team (who many rate as the best in La Liga, and even Europe at times) has been eliminated from European competition before the quarters.

People still go on about this "disallowed goal", Ive seen the highlights four times and have yet to see conclusive proof. So I dont know how you have. Carvalho is allowed stand beside the keeper, he didnt impede him going for the ball.

Chelsea also had their fair share of chances.

Slash/ED wrote:

The EPL have had one team in the final in around twenty years, that's fairly pathetic even accounting for the fact that they weren't allowed enter for around a quater of that.

Its actually two in twenty years. But why pick 20? If you extend your sample to 25 or 27 you are going to bring that up to about seven or eight.

Accounting for missing six of those twenty years, and then subsequently adjusting back to the pace of European football, you have to disregard over ten of those twenty years.

Slash/ED wrote:

Until that changes they will always be viewed as inferior to the best that La Liga and Serie A has to offer, EPL teams normally survive well until the latter stages and then go out.

I think Chelsea proved the other night that they are not inferior to the best Spain has to offer.

They were as good techniqually. Better physically. Better mentally. And better tactically. Im sure they would be better losers than Barca also had they gone out.

Slash/ED

Jivin Turkey wrote:

Yes flopped. For the second season in a row this Barcelona team (who many rate as the best in La Liga, and even Europe at times) has been eliminated from European competition before the quarters.

People still go on about this "disallowed goal", Ive seen the highlights four times and have yet to see conclusive proof. So I dont know how you have. Carvalho is allowed stand beside the keeper, he didnt impede him going for the ball.

"Flopped" would imply they were outclassed and were completley flat. Not even close, they were outclassing Chelsea at times and were outstanding and very unlucky to go out, blame missed chances and Chelseas winner being allowed. In all fairness you must either be blinded to it or haven't seen the replay from behind the goal because it clearly was a foul, thought ehr ef was never going to spot it.

Chelsea also had their fair share of chances.

Not even close to the amount Barca had.

Its actually two in twenty years. But why pick 20? If you extend your sample to 25 or 27 you are going to bring that up to about seven or eight.

Accounting for missing six of those twenty years, and then subsequently adjusting back to the pace of European football, you have to disregard over ten of those twenty years.

Alright then in it's current format there's been one finalist, even disregarding those years it's a woeful effort for a league that's supposed to be one of the best.

I think Chelsea proved the other night that they are not inferior to the best Spain has to offer.

They were as good techniqually. Better physically. Better mentally. And better tactically. Im sure they would be better losers than Barca also had they gone out.

And if Chelsea go onto win it, and if over the next three/four years they're consistently in the semis or later, then the balance of power will have yet again shifted and England will have a genuine contender again.

PiE

Rossonero wrote:

S.America>European>EPL

South America? Maybe in the off-field entertainment stakes, but not in overall quality.

thejollyrodger

I think Chelsea proved the other night that they are not inferior to the best Spain has to offer.

They were as good techniqually. Better physically. Better mentally. And better tactically. Im sure they would be better losers than Barca also had they gone out.

Thats a bit of a strectch of the imagination to be honest. If chelsea were playing Real Madrid and the circus stopped messing around and tried to really play, they would wipe chelsea off the pitch.

chelsea are better mentally than the catlans thats for sure but defintely not tatically by any stretch of the imagination. 4-4-2 looks like a rubgy line out and is as flexible as a bus.

Carvalho did cheat a little with the keeper. Deco was falling all round the place and Mourinho was quick to point that out to the ref. Must be something in his training regime : P

All in all chelsea are better at competing while Barca played the better football.

Chucky the tree

Jivin Turkey wrote:

Im sure they would be better losers than Barca also had they gone out.

like they were when they lost the first leg?


oh wait..