Whats the name of the one with the sticks?

Zulu

Hello all, I'm hoping you can help me.
I was interested to know the name of the martial art, where they fight with sticks (used like swords), and where I might learn it. (or any other info about it)

Thanks in advance.

Kevin_rc_ie

escrima.

do they study this somewhere off molesworth street?

Zulu

sorry I ment the one where you use one long stick. Not a staff, but more like a samuari sword. They wear face masks like fencing.

Dyr

kendo?

theres a club out in DCU. google should find you their web page, try

Dyr

Kevin_rc_ie wrote:

escrima.

do they study this somewhere off molesworth street?

Sure do. in a few other places too

Zulu

Thats exactly the one! Thanks a million.
Can anyone recommend a good place near baggot street? I can google - but I'd prefer a recomendation!

Thanks again.

Dyr

theres probably three kendo clubs in ireland so if youre training in dublin then DCU is probably youre only option Im afraid. ive heard that its a good club

http://www.kendo-ireland.com/clubs.htm

soma

Those guys squaring up to 'spar' in the picture.. they are barefoot.. anyone know if they are allowed to kick..? else what on earth is the point..? altho then again I've never understood *any* MA that makes you go barefoot..

Those guys squaring up to 'spar' in the picture.. they are barefoot.. anyone know if they are allowed to kick..? else what on earth is the point..? altho then again I've never understood *any* MA that makes you go barefoot..

Dude its Kendo. Kendo doesnt make any street effective assertions. Its a swordfighting sport. They dont kick and have very strict rules. Again its a sport. The point is that they do it cause they enjoy it.

MMA peeps train without shoes. Its safer and really doesnt make a huge difference. It just avoids broken toes and stops mats getting dirty! Most mat based martial arts train barefoot. It keeps the place clean!

soma

columok wrote:

Dude its Kendo. Kendo doesnt make any street effective assertions. Its a swordfighting sport. They dont kick and have very strict rules.

You're only re-enforcing my puzzlement! It's *sword* fighting.. yet they're in their bare feet.. have you ever seen anyone fencing barefoot..? *lol*

They dont make any claims to be genuine real lethal effective sword fighting. Its just kendo a sport derived from Japanese swordsmanship. Nothing more nothing less. They also wear hakama and sport kendo armour. Ive never seen people sword fight with sport kendo armour before! As for hakama...

pma-ire

columok wrote:

They dont make any claims to be genuine real lethal effective sword fighting. Its just kendo a sport derived from Japanese swordsmanship. Nothing more nothing less. They also wear hakama and sport kendo armour. Ive never seen people sword fight with sport kendo armour before! As for hakama...

Locks throws and takedowns are taken from the motion of iado (the art of drawing and cutting with the sword). Again it was natural to use a format of movement that was being used for weapon work with the same muscle memory involved.

Dyr

soma wrote:

You're only re-enforcing my puzzlement! It's *sword* fighting.. yet they're in their bare feet.. have you ever seen anyone fencing barefoot..? *lol*

interesting aside, A guy i train with has a mate whos just took up kendo: Seems they had a weekend course recently, and as kendo is practiced barefoot and they have a lot of stamping movements, one of the japanese guys developed a large blister on the sole of his foot. He "cured" it by simply melting some rubber onto it and carried on :eek:

Another aside on the foot thing: another guy i trained with was also a gym instructor and he maintained that training barefoot was bad for your achilles tendons as we're used to our heel being kept at an angle to the floor by wearing shoes all day, so training barefoot causes the tendon to stretch a bit more. He used to have a couple of warm up excercises to stretch it out a bit

interesting aside, A guy i train with has a mate whos just took up kendo: Seems they had a weekend course recently, and as kendo is practiced barefoot and they have a lot of stamping movements, one of the japanese guys developed a large blister on the sole of his foot. He "cured" it by simply melted some rubber onto it and carried on

Very Rambo 3!

Locks throws and takedowns are taken from the motion of iado (the art of drawing and cutting with the sword). Again it was natural to use a format of movement that was being used for weapon work with the same muscle memory involved.

Not sure what you mean by this contextually Paul! How does the resemblance of certain cutting motions of aiki arts to the drawing and cutting of the sword in Iaido relate to this thread. Not being a d1ck rather trying to follow your line.

heat

Just thought Id clear things about kendo. It’s a sport based on Kenjutsu. It is said to be one of the oldest martial arts. Don’t know much on its history. The idea is that it was a safe way for samurai to train. So as for the bare foot thing it’s a traditional thing like in most other ma. Every time you hit someone with the shinai you have to stamp and shout. It’s the way you show your fighting spirit. Like columok said it’s a sport. If your really interested in it the best thing to do is call into a class and see what is involved. Some of the stuff is better understood when you see two people face off and fight. By the way, the thing with getting blisters on the foot. I used to get them so was told to burst it and pour vinegar on it to condition that part of my foot. The Dublin club is alot of fun. Great bunch of guys + girls. Lots of people wanting to hit you with sticks and lots of people you can hit with them too

Dyr

"It is said to be one of the oldest martial arts. Don’t know much on its history."

damn right you dont

kendo proper originates from around the late 1800s-early 1900s, aint one of the oldest MA's around by a long shot

Dyr

soma wrote:

You're only re-enforcing my puzzlement! It's *sword* fighting.. yet they're in their bare feet.. have you ever seen anyone fencing barefoot..? *lol*

the spartans went into battle bare foot. Many samurai did too out of necessity. Not uncommon in some indonesian styles either.

And before you stick the sword in *italics* try spar or train sword kata with some kendo players, your puzzlement might just be dispelled :rolleyes:

Colm_OReilly

Another aside on the foot thing: another guy i trained with was also a gym instructor and he maintained that training barefoot was bad for your achilles tendons as we're used to our heel being kept at an angle to the floor by wearing shoes all day, so training barefoot causes the tendon to stretch a bit more. He used to have a couple of warm up excercises to stretch it out a bit

So what you're saying is that wearing shoes hurts our achilles, and we're conditioned to have bad achilles by wearing shoes.

Roper

I'm not mad on weapons training, or the attitudes of some weapons types, but Kendo is a different kettle of fish altogether. Looks like a good laugh and a lot of skill. Have to say I would LOVE to do it, especially with some mates. I was at a demo a few years ago, in DCU I think, and was very impressed by the skill and although I was dubious about it as I am with weapons training, the guys who were doing it were very down to earth and basically got to leather the sh1te out of each other with big sticks during sparring, that is my kind of game. Still, I reckon a good hurler would have them!!


Do they do stag nights? It'd be way better then paintball!

Dyr

Colm_OReilly wrote:

So what you're saying is that wearing shoes hurts our achilles, and we're conditioned to have bad achilles by wearing shoes.

Im not saying anything, its second hand information presented as such. The chap who told me this has been a fitness instructor for as long as ive known him and works in the prison service in that capacity, so i tend to take what he says on these topics at face value. His point, as i remember, is that our heel is kept elevated at a slight angle from the ground by shoes, while in our bare feet our heel is flat and level to the ground. therefore training in our barefeet puts more of stretch on the achilles tendon than training in runners etc as we're far more used to the footwear "position"

yes? no?

Colm_OReilly

Bambi,

I was saying "you" in the more general sense, rather than "you, Bambi".

I just thought it interesting how something natural (barefoot) and something contrived by man (shoes) were reversed in the example. You'll have to forgive me, I hang around with Anthropologists.

Peace Out,
Colm

pearsquasher

There was a great documentary about kendo a few years ago on ch4 or bbc2. It was a build up to the national kendo exams in japan and showed a really elderly gentleman going for his upteenth try at his next rank. It was a quality piece of tv full of tension and you really got rooting for the guy. It also showed another fella who's aim it was was to win some tournament for his dying son before he succumbed to cancer or something - pretty intense stuff!

As for Kendo itself, it definitely seems like an interesting sport and very like fencing which my mother studied a lot of. I practice sword in the Bujinkan and Kendo seems very far removed from how you'd move with real blades, the way we study it. Still I appreciate the sporting stratigic side of it and the use of it as a spirit building pursuit although I'd rather study real sword fighting myself.

Interestingly a Kendo student friend of mine is moving from Poland to Ireland soon and it'd be cool to exchange ideas with him on sword work down at the dojo.

Dyr

I wasnt being cranky (for once lol). its just that i know my explanations can be fuzzy at the best of times so i was trying to be very concise.

when you consider that, historically, many asian cultures, unlike in the west, did not wear footwear indoors and only wear light footwear outoors then it could make some sense I guess

Dyr

pearsquasher wrote:

There was a great documentary about kendo a few years ago on ch4 or bbc2. It was a build up to the national kendo exams in japan and showed a really elderly gentleman going for his upteenth try at his next rank. It was a quality piece of tv full of tension and you really got rooting for the guy. It also showed another fella who's aim it was was to win some tournament for his dying son before he succumbed to cancer or something - pretty intense stuff!

As for Kendo itself, it definitely seems like an interesting sport and very like fencing which my mother studied a lot of. I practice sword in the Bujinkan and Kendo seems very far removed from how you'd move with real blades, the way we study it. Still I appreciate the sporting stratigic side of it and the use of it as a spirit building pursuit although I'd rather study real sword fighting myself.

dont get sucked into the "real sword fighting" thing and give em a go, you might be suprised. kendo dudes also practice sword kata, and while kenjutsu/koryu types might rag on it, when i got to try kendo kata with them I found that they were definitely a big step up in intensity from what i had experienced with aiki-ken, jujutsu and, i would hazard, the booj dudes also. I dont live far from DCU and i was thinking of trying kendo out in the summer but im just not too eager on going back into "budo mode", kinda like a recovering alco in that regard

pma-ire

columok wrote:

Not sure what you mean by this contextually Paul! How does the resemblance of certain cutting motions of aiki arts to the drawing and cutting of the sword in Iaido relate to this thread. Not being a d1ck rather trying to follow your line.

Really I was saying that the motions of kendo can be releated to other fighting arts. I have cross-trained with a Ju Jitsu guy who looked at the locking and throwing actions related to the sword they work very well.

Also when I studied HKD the sword motion was used to give meaning an direction to a movement.

I did'int thinkI was going off thread :eek: as it's not the form of the board

pearsquasher

I do not doubt that Kendo is spirited, intense, full of wonderfull strategy and all those things. I've had interesting chats with dedicated Kendo students and its always been facinating. Its still a sport though where nobody dies, and was developed in peacetime. Not my thing.... this could easily go down the root of sparring vs. combat so let not go there. I enjoy watching Kendo, repspect the people i know who do it and think its a fine sport. That is that.

pma-ire

Can be very expensive !!!

I know, cause used to sell the gear

Zulu

So basically guys - I need to go the DCU to do it?
Perhaps you could recommend an alternative?
I don't have a car; I work and live near Baggot St (so ideally somewhere close).

I'd like to learn something similar (I'm interested in the tactial aspect to it more so than the self defence & and I'd like to build up arm strenght in the process).
Perhaps the martial art where they use staffs? (don't know the name)
...or are there others a noob like myself wouldn't know about?

Thanks for all your input so far.

Dyr

Zulu wrote:

So basically guys - I need to go the DCU to do it?
Perhaps you could recommend an alternative?
I don't have a car; I work and live near Baggot St (so ideally somewhere close).

I'd like to learn something similar (I'm interested in the tactial aspect to it more so than the self defence & and I'd like to build up arm strenght in the process).
Perhaps the martial art where they use staffs? (don't know the name)
...or are there others a noob like myself wouldn't know about?

Thanks for all your input so far.

emm as someone mentioned youve got escrima off molesworth street, different from kendo but still an opportunity to hit people with sticks albeit padded ones. Not sure whats happening with newbies at the mo tho, there was talk of trying a seperate class as they'd been falling between two stools a bit

or you could try western fencing! i imagine trinity would have a team but then it might be restricted to students.

I cant think of any martial art thats common in the west and uses staffs other than jodo and they dotn spar

pearsquasher

Some styles of traditional Okinawan karate use staffs as do some styles of Aikido althought its not their main focus. Of course the Bujinkan has staff weapons training too.

soma

Yeah I reckon that escrima class might be a good bet, hopefully they do something like..

http://escrima-sticks.gungfu.com/

Atho having said said... dude you're a bit lazy!! DCU is not hard to get to from baggot st & kendo looks like fun. The number 11 and 13A buses pass quite close to you and drop you at DCU. Or if you walk a bit closer to the city centre there's the 19A, the 16's, and the 3. <- spot the ex-DCU-4-years-on-public-transport-head.

Zulu

soma wrote:

Yeah I reckon that escrima class might be a good bet, hopefully they do something like..

http://escrima-sticks.gungfu.com/

Atho having said said... dude you're a bit lazy!! DCU is not hard to get to from baggot st & kendo looks like fun. The number 11 and 13A buses pass quite close to you and drop you at DCU. Or if you walk a bit closer to the city centre there's the 19A, the 16's, and the 3. <- spot the ex-DCU-4-years-on-public-transport-head.

TBH I am very lazy, that kinda why I really want a place near. (on a rainy winter day after work, I know I'll never get on a bus to make the journey out ...at least I'm honest.)

Thanks a million for all your info though guys, it's appricated

Really I was saying that the motions of kendo can be releated to other fighting arts. I have cross-trained with a Ju Jitsu guy who looked at the locking and throwing actions related to the sword they work very well.

I used to be an Aikidoka in a former life and the motions of the sword, mainly the shomen-uchi (downwards cut) and the kesa-geri cut, are related to the movements of aikido locks and throws. This resemblance stands in theory but I dont believe that it works in application.

Kendo is kendo. I dont believe that it translates in any way to hand to hand combat. If you want to learn to throw or joint lock then its best to spar throwing and joint locks!

Kevin_rc_ie

iaido website with kendo links

That will probably help.

The thing putting me off Kendo was the 200-300 euro u needed to just even start with basic gear. However the gear should last a life time. i like free stuff thou. fencing looks cool too. not sure about escrima. i keep on thinking about the angry guy on another thread in this forum who kept wacking his students with a stick.

pma-ire

columok wrote:

I used to be an Aikidoka in a former life and the motions of the sword, mainly the shomen-uchi (downwards cut) and the kesa-geri cut, are related to the movements of aikido locks and throws. This resemblance stands in theory but I dont believe that it works in application.

Kendo is kendo. I dont believe that it translates in any way to hand to hand combat. If you want to learn to throw or joint lock then its best to spar throwing and joint locks!

I know you were, and respect you views on that function. Which is why I spoke of the JJ and HKD I had experienced. Indeed the practice of any tech on a live body is paramount. But a visual map to the path can be of great help at times.

pearsquasher

I feel that it is true that swordwork informs hand-to-hand combat. It lets you explore further body mechanics and strategy. I have experienced this myself and its one of the inherent reasons we do sword in the Bujinkan.. or any weapon for that matter.

I'm not entirely sure if Kendo itself has this feature as, purely from my own opinion based on seeing Kendo matches and training sessions, the Kendo sword doesn't seem as much an extention of the body but more of the spirit (hense the "do" suffix). This is different from kenjutsu - combat fighting with real swords as opposed to sparring with bamboo ones.

Of course i'm pretty sure there is some overlap.. kendo having body-extention features and kenjutsu developing the spirit to some extent, but its important to recognise the difference. If kendo practicioners actively applied their kendo techniques to hand-to-hand they could discover if, in fact, the theory played out. Because they don't as far as i am aware, and kendo isn't designed like that anyway, it's probably not the case. With kenjutsu, it is the case though.