Motorway Driving

BrianD

This morning I commuted in on the M1 and was absolutley stunned by the standard of motorway driving.

Nearly all the traffic stayed in the overtaking lane doing an average 65MPH. The outside lane (left lane) was virtually empty. I found that by driving in the left lane I was actually undertaking long lines of traffic in the overtaking lane.

The number of L drivers was also astonishing. I could see that in one L plated car the passenger was seated in a way that it looked like he was advising the driver. Anyone who has guided a learner driver will know that posture you adopt in the front passenger seat!!

Also many drivers didn't seem to understand that it is OK to cut into a line of steady moving traffic safely. Some drivers seem to think that you need a least a mile of clear road to overtake. In the UK drivers swiftly change lanes on motorway traffic as a routine. I was a bit peeved that some guy driving in convoy at 65 mph the over taking lane beeped me when I took advantage of the gap in front of him to overtake a vehicle in the lefy lane.

In Australia, most dual carriageways have signage every so often saying "Dual Carriageway. Keep left unless overtaking. Maximum fine $90" These signs serve a purpose of educating drivers. Perhaps the NRA and NSC should consider erecting similar signage on our dual carriageways.

seamus

BrianD wrote:

Also many drivers didn't seem to understand that it is OK to cut into a line of steady moving traffic safely. Some drivers seem to think that you need a least a mile of clear road to overtake. In the UK drivers swiftly change lanes on motorway traffic as a routine. I was a bit peeved that some guy driving in convoy at 65 mph the over taking lane beeped me when I took advantage of the gap in front of him to overtake a vehicle in the lefy lane.

I get this a lot too. Being a bike, swift course changes are part and parcel, and the amount of times I've had people flash me for jumping into a safe gap is unbelievable.

In Australia, most dual carriageways have signage every so often saying "Dual Carriageway. Keep left unless overtaking. Maximum fine $90" These signs serve a purpose of educating drivers. Perhaps the NRA and NSC should consider erecting similar signage on our dual carriageways.

That's a great idea. Never heard of that sign before.

impr0v

The powers that be obviously also consider this an issue, seeing as they went as far as commissioning a television advertisement aimed at educating the public. It now seems to be off the air after only a brief run and judging by driver behavior the campaign hasn't been all that successful. Years of ultra-violent speeding, seatbelt, drink driving and anti-smoking ads have obviously desensitised us to simple practical advice.

seamus

impr0v wrote:

The powers that be obviously also consider this an issue, seeing as they went as far as commissioning a television advertisement aimed at educating the public. It now seems to be off the air after only a brief run and judging by driver behavior the campaign hasn't been all that successful. Years of ultra-violent speeding, seatbelt, drink driving and anti-smoking ads have obviously desensitised us to simple practical advice.

I saw the motorway ad once, and the roundabout ad twice, and I'd say my TV watchage (?) is about average. For ads about driving to have any effect, they need to be drummed in, like the drink-driving ads. If I sing you the words, "Can I tell you about my life...?", what's the first thing you think of? Do the same thing for driver education ads, and I'd say they'd make an impact.

A few weeks of sparse broadcasting of the ads was a waste of money.

GristlyEnd

I use this road everyday for work and I agree the standard of driving is very poor. I usually stick to the left lane at approx 60mph, it's a more relaxing drive then.

MG

The same type of thing applies to the dual carraigeways. Driving in the left lane seems to be terribly unfashionable. It gets very lonely sometimes.

Victor

BrianD wrote:

Anyone who has guided a learner driver will know that posture you adopt in the front passenger seat!!

The foetal position with hands over head?

robinph

BrianD wrote:

In the UK drivers swiftly change lanes on motorway traffic as a routine. I was a bit peeved that some guy driving in convoy at 65 mph the over taking lane beeped me when I took advantage of the gap in front of him to overtake a vehicle in the lefy lane.

I can't say that I'd ever noticed people in the UK using the lanes properly much either though. Most people would just sit in the middle or right hand lane constantly as well.
Are there any three lane motorways in Ireland? I'd say that only having the two lanes makes the bad lane behavoiur more noticable though.

BrianD

Only three lane dual carriageways ... N7 and N11.

FX Meister

In response to robinph, I've found that in the UK drivers tend to stay in the right hand lane but when they see a car coming up behind them the nearly always pull in a and let you pass and then just move back out again.

Victor

robinph wrote:

Are there any three lane motorways in Ireland?

Only insofar as certain sections of the M50 have weaving lanes where some junctions are relatively close and de-merging traffic is starting to leave while merging traffic is still joining. It is proposed to upgrade much of the M50 to dual 3+1 lanes.

Other differences are on/off ramps tend to be single lane, over-use of (signal controlled) roundabouts, but at least these tend to have free-flow left turns.

sceptre

BrianD wrote:

In Australia, most dual carriageways have signage every so often saying "Dual Carriageway. Keep left unless overtaking. Maximum fine $90" These signs serve a purpose of educating drivers. Perhaps the NRA and NSC should consider erecting similar signage on our dual carriageways.

The fine could be nne grand and it wouldn't make much of a difference to most people if they were pretty sure the signs were just for show and they weren't going to be pulled over by a passing pleaseman on his bike.

Worth a try though and a good idea if there's some tiny amount of enforcement as well though.

seamus wrote:

If I sing you the words, "Can I tell you about my life...?", what's the first thing you think of?

Honestly? Fleetwood Mac whan they were good. And I watch a lot of TV. if I saw a guy in a car singing along to it I'd think of the advert though.

De Rebel

BrianD wrote:

Only three lane dual carriageways ... N7 and N11.

And a bit of the N25.

The general interpretation appears to be:
right lane - for MEN to drive in
centre lane - for pussies
left lane - for leppers and people with social diseases

De Rebel

seamus wrote:

That's a great idea. Never heard of that sign before.

Actually you probably have. In reverse of course, this being Ireland.

Where there are two or more lanes, the designer’s intention is usually that the left lane is a driving lane and the right lane is an overtaking lane. For some reason, instead on putting up signs saying "Drive in the left lane, overtake using right lane" our ever with it county councils stick up signs saying "slow lane". Which has the immediate effect of driving every red meat eating macho hunk straight into the right hand lane, and sticking there becomes a matter of enduring male pride. Watch it sometime, on one of those long inclines, where you are stuck behind some fool ambling along at 80km (50mph) in the overtaking lane, and not another soul in sight. It’s totally infuriating.

jlang

BrianD wrote:

Only three lane dual carriageways ... N7 and N11.

... and the N4 from the M50 junction out for about a mile (plan exists to upgrade to three lanes as far as the M4 (4miles?) with a grade separated interchange at the Newcastle Road, and not before time).
Although the N11 hardly counts as the third lane is really only a bus lane that ceases to be a bus lane at 7pm and there's an ungodly amount of traffic lights and right turns so proper lane discipline could never be enforced.

BrianD

The N11 bus lane should be 24 hours to avoid confusion.

Sceptre, you raise a good question about whether people will follow the instruction on signage. However, I believe a large number of people haven't a clue about lane driving. Put these signs up at regular intervals and the message might hit home. I think putting the amount of the fine (if one exists) is also useful.

mackerski

robinph wrote:

Are there any three lane motorways in Ireland?

Apart from the short bits already mentioned, A lot of the M2 in the vicinity of Belfast is multi-lane. From Motorway start to junction 2 there are anything up to five (briefly six?) lanes per direction. When northbound, normal lane discipline doesn't really apply, since the whole stretch is marked out as a get-in-lane for the approaching M2/M5 split, but southbound it's just a really, really wide motorway. It's the busiest stretch of road certainly in NI, and possibly in Ireland as a whole.

For, I think, one further junction beyond J2 the northbound carriageway has 3 lanes.

FWIW, I've never had trouble finding a free lane in which to overtake on the wide bit of the M2...

Dermot

DubTony

Driving in the overtaking lane seems to be the norm in Ireland. Even when I'm doing 70 mph on the inside lane of a clear motorway there'll be some idiot on the outside just slightly behind me in that spot that the mirror doesn't quite catch.
This makes overtaking dangerous and usually requires extra acceleration to ensure a safe manouevre.

As for driving in the UK; it's a joy. It's very rare that anyone blocks your progress by hogging the outside lane.
On a recent journey along the M6, I was travelling at a steady 95 to 100. (I know, lunacy) Cars pulled aside like I was God. The Range Rover behind me pulled in behind me every time I moved across. I assumed this was to let me know he wasn't going to pass. But it sure made pulling out a lot easier, when, looking in the door mirror, I could see a clear outside lane.

Wasn't there some provision for a penalty with the introduction of Penalty Points for "travelling" in the outside lane?

seamus

DubTony wrote:

Wasn't there some provision for a penalty with the introduction of Penalty Points for "travelling" in the outside lane?

Not exactly.
There are two offences which may qualify this:
Failure to drive vehicle on left
Now, I'd say you'd have trouble proving that this applies to motorways, as the implied meaning seems to be "Not driving on the correct side of the road". Although it's rather specific wording may mean otherwise.

There's also:
Prohibition of driving vehicles with 50 mph speed limit on outside traffic lane of carriageway of motorway.
I'd say the chances of that one *ever* being enforced are slim to none.

mollser

DubTony wrote:

The Range Rover behind me pulled in behind me every time I moved across. I assumed this was to let me know he wasn't going to pass.

Nope - he was using you as a shield - if there were cops around, chances are you'd get caught for the speeding and he'd trundle along and find the next sucker to take the bullet!

I do this meself all the time !

mackerski

seamus wrote:

There's also:
Prohibition of driving vehicles with 50 mph speed limit on outside traffic lane of carriageway of motorway.
I'd say the chances of that one *ever* being enforced are slim to none.

As I recall from my reading of this law, it only applies on 3-lane-plus motorways. That mirrors practice in other countries.

Dermot

magpie

I was a bit peeved that some guy driving in convoy at 65 mph the over taking lane beeped me when I took advantage of the gap in front of him to overtake a vehicle in the lefy lane.

He might have viewed it as you undertaking him and then cutting him up in order to get 1 car ahead in a convoy of 30 cars.