Underground pipe leakage.

leakingpipe

Hi all,

I have found out, to my horror, that I have a leak under my cement
floor in the kitchen or airing cupboard.


I emptied out the hot press and noticed that one of the pipes going
underground had damp insulation around it where it went into the
ground and could hear a gurgling like noise so I guess the leak is somewhere near this area.

Under the lino the floor is damp and in the kitchen I took up some lino and it was also damp.

This seems to have been going on for a long time but put it down to a
bad joint somewhere, as air built up in the radiators after a few
days.


There are two pipes going from the hot press underground, out of the
house and to the oil boiler in the garden.


Is this a DIY or should I get a plumber in, what is the best
way to approach it, should I take up the floor just inside the hot
press hoping that is where the leak is? and do I break up the cement
to one side of the pipes so as not to damage them. How deep will the
pipes normally be buried.


I would appreciate any helpful advise or tips.

Thanks

leakingpipe

wideband

Hi,
just woundering is this a fairly new house covered by a builders warranty....also Id contact your home insurance broker.

I emptied out the hot press and noticed that one of the pipes going
underground had damp insulation around it where it went into the
ground and could hear a gurgling like noise so I guess the leak is somewhere near this area.

condensation is a major problem with this type of system (sounds like your in a bungalo with pipes going out of the house and to the oil boiler in the garden).....and can cause a serious build up of water/dampness...is the pipe damp further up?...were is your cold feed to the storage tank in the attic?

This seems to have been going on for a long time but put it down to a
bad joint somewhere, as air built up in the radiators after a few
days.

There are two pipes going from the hot press underground, out of the
house and to the oil boiler in the garden.

This can't cause air build up in the rads......seperate part of the system....

Is this a DIY or should I get a plumber in, what is the best
way to approach it, should I take up the floor just inside the hot
press hoping that is where the leak is? and do I break up the cement
to one side of the pipes so as not to damage them. How deep will the
pipes normally be buried.

it say first monitor the area for condensation above floor level....if this doesn't solve it its probbly time for plan B.

Get in a plumber!! and let him dig up the floor.....unless your handy at this work, you could do some damage.

good luck

rooferPete

Hi Leakingpipe,

Have cyou checked the pipes above the floor ? it could be a minor leak coming down the pipe, just a thought.

It is possible for the leak to drain the radiators because some heating systems use the same flow and return for the radiators and the cylinder.

Depending on your area I may be able to reccommend a good plumber you can send me an email if you like.

How old is the house / heating system ?.

antoinolachtnai

There is a thing for sale in the DIY places that you can inject into your heating system and which will (allegedly) seal small leaks in the system. It costs around 40 euros as I recall. I have no idea whether this would work for you.

It sounds like it would be worth getting someone experienced to look at it. I think you are probably right, that you will have to break the concrete to sort it out. I don't think it will be that hard to break the concrete to get at it, but it will obviously depend on how hard the concrete is and whether you can get it easily.

leakingpipe

wideband wrote:

Hi,
just woundering is this a fairly new house covered by a builders warranty....also Id contact your home insurance broker.



condensation is a major problem with this type of system (sounds like your in a bungalo with pipes going out of the house and to the oil boiler in the garden).....and can cause a serious build up of water/dampness...is the pipe damp further up?...were is your cold feed to the storage tank in the attic?




This can't cause air build up in the rads......seperate part of the system....



it say first monitor the area for condensation above floor level....if this doesn't solve it its probbly time for plan B.

Get in a plumber!! and let him dig up the floor.....unless your handy at this work, you could do some damage.

good luck

Hi wideband,

Yes its a bungalo, the radiators do get filled up with air from this damaged pipe because there are no other leaks to be seen.

When the heat is on, after a few hours the coating of water under the lino gets pretty hot. Feeling about I have found the hottest spot is in an area between the hot press and a long press so its probably the place to dig.

I guess as this is a diy site I should first have a go at digging up, its probably safe to start about 1ft away from the skirting board?

Thanks for your help and if I am wrong please let me know.

leakingpipe

HI rooferpete,

the house is 14 years old, I can actually hear a noise where the pipe comes up in the hotpress.
Thanks.

leakingpipe

antoinolachtnai wrote:

There is a thing for sale in the DIY places that you can inject into your heating system and which will (allegedly) seal small leaks in the system. It costs around 40 euros as I recall. I have no idea whether this would work for you.

It sounds like it would be worth getting someone experienced to look at it. I think you are probably right, that you will have to break the concrete to sort it out. I don't think it will be that hard to break the concrete to get at it, but it will obviously depend on how hard the concrete is and whether you can get it easily.

Thanks for the tip but I have gone into the attic and the replacement water going into the tank would indicate a fairly large leak, like a tap open a quarter turn, a strong flow.

Thanks for your help and thanks everyone for giving advise. You have all been great.

leakingpipe

Hi all,

I need some guidance.

I have just tried to break up the cement, its very hard, I am using about a 5 lb hammer and a flat cold chisel but dont seem to be making much of an impact. Is this normal and I just need to take it slow or is there something else I should be doing.

I am digging about 8" away from the hairline crack, this is probably the centre of where the pipes run parallel to wall, and just outside the hollow sound of floor.

I would really appreciate feedback.

Thanks,

mad m

Its concrete which would be harder to break up than plain cement..god love you.I think its going to be a labour of love,why not rent out a small kango from hire shop it would get through it quicker and ask them in hire shop for advice on what your doing and get right bit for kango....

antoinolachtnai

Good advice. One thing to consider is whether there is any alternative way of running a replacement pipe to the kitchen (though probably not).

I take it that you are in a position to cut off the water if/when things get really wet!?

If you prefer not to rent, you can get a light SDS kango-style hammer-drill for less than 50 euros in Argos. I have one, and it's perfectly serviceable for the sort of stuff you're doing.

Be gentle though, take your time (though I think you know that).

leakingpipe

Thanks for the tip, yes can turn off the water. The pipe should be in sand, if this is correct then the damage is just random and the rest of the pipe should be ok. Is this a correct assessment?

Thanks for the advise.

antoinolachtnai

In sand? Why would it be in sand? It might be, but I wouldn't think so. The floor should be a couple of inches of solid concrete, with a sheet of polystyrene and a plastic membrane below if you're lucky, all lying on a bed of hardcore or similar. (If you reach the polystyrene, you've probably gone too far!)

I'd be surprised if it's 'random damage'. There's no reason (in general) why a relatively new pipe embedded in concrete should start leaking. It's unlikely to have frozen if it's a heating pipe and it's a few inches under concrete.

There could be some sort of connection or right-angle down there that might be bad.

If it were possible, i would be inclined to replace the complete under-concrete section. The reason is that I wouldn't want to concrete in any type of connector if I could avoid it. The chances of a connector starting to dribble after you install it are actually quite high. The chances of a straight piece of pipe springing a leak are quite low.

In practice, this may not be possible without smashing up the whole house, but hopefully you get the idea. If it really is a random leak in the pipe, you might be better off patching it up than trying to replace the section.

Anybody in the trade got a view on this?

rooferPete

Hi Leaking pipe,

Check your mail.

yankinlk

this might be silly, but did you contact a plumber??

I had a similar problem and contacted a plumber, i could hear gurgling noises coming from the floor. I had nightmares of having to dig up the entire kitchen floor - thank god i didnt do anything. Rang a plumber, in 10 minutes he had it fixed (including the digging) and charged me 50 euro.

leakingpipe

Thanks everyone, I have decided to leave it to the professionals.


Thank again for your help though.