Building self esteem

For years I've never had much confidence in myself. It's mostly due to issues such as lack of friends or being slagged to death at school. It really got me down but I've never forgotten it for whatever reason.
This seriously affects my lifestyle. I never interact with people because I feel I'm too shy or afraid, and past memories prevent me from building new ground for myself. For example, I never went to college because of the treatment I got in school, and that may have prevented me from getting where I want to go. I feel like the stereotypical geek, working in computers, have glasses and an acne problem, although in fairness to myself its minor. I also fancy girls that are probably too good for me. I never smile or anything, and have a very pessimistic view on life.

I want to be a bit more optimistic and less self-conscious so I can enjoy life for a change. Can this be done without resorting to counselling or psychology? If not then I'll have to consider that. The only suggestion I've had so far is "drop your glasses and get contacts."

Any valid comments/suggestions are welcome. Thanks.

Evilution

Karsini wrote:

For years I've never had much confidence in myself. It's mostly due to issues such as lack of friends or being slagged to death at school. It really got me down but I've never forgotten it for whatever reason.
This seriously affects my lifestyle

Hasn't affected you posting here, bud. And Boards can reduce even the toughest of men to quivering wrecks. Ever thought of saving some money and going back to college. I went back to college when I was 25 and love it. I never even think about my old secondary school now. Could give that a shot? Are you interested in studying anything?

Evilution

Evilution wrote:

Hasn't affected you posting here, bud. And Boards can reduce even the toughest of men to quivering wrecks.

Well I don't mind so much about posting online. At least I could leave PI and never come back. hehe. Although... maybe if I went to a Boards Beer I could get lumps taken out of me!

Evilution wrote:

Ever thought of saving some money and going back to college. I went back to college when I was 25 and love it. I never even think about my old secondary school now. Could give that a shot? Are you interested in studying anything?

I'd only go to college if I knew for certain that it would improve my chances of finding work that I'll like doing. I want to do something in computer repairs, which is what I'm doing now, but full time. Lots have said to start my own business, but at 20 I feel I'm too young.

And I can probably never love someone else if I don't love myself. My love life has been non-existent. I've been attracted to girls, but over-analyse the situation so much that I never make a move. I fancied a girl for 7 years and never made any attempt of doing anything. She still doesn't know, but my chance is gone.
The only time I attempted to make a move (with a different girl), my mam found out and caused war, so I didn't do it in the end.

Evilution

Karsini wrote:

Although... maybe if I went to a Boards Beer I could get lumps taken out of me!

Yeah, but in a good way. Boards, in my opinion, is indicative of irish society at large but its members are a little more civilised to say the least. Be not scared, obi wan

Karsini wrote:

I'd only go to college if I knew for certain that it would improve my chances of finding work that I'll like doing.

College is about this and lots more. Granted, you'll study something you really like and hopefully get good at it. However, if you join some societies or clubs, you might find other interests too which could lead you down a different path. Its just a matter of finding a course you like and getting your foot in the door. How did your LC go?

Karsini wrote:

And I can probably never love someone else if I don't love myself. My love life has been non-existent. I've been attracted to girls, but over-analyse the situation so much that I never make a move.

Hey, $hit man, that was me a few years ago. I tried to brainiac chatting up a girl and it never worked. I'm not going to patronise here so you won't hear me say the usual 'be yourself' stuff. Being honest though, I think you should put the ol' love thing down your list of priorities for a while. Its a fecker like that; its when you're not focussing on it that it can come and find you. Just focus on doing other stuff that makes you happy. I've a friend who was stuck in a rut for a while - same job, did nothing different - but he went and did a parachute jump and played paintball a few times and he's a different guy. He's in australia sleeping off a hangover as I actually type.

You've gotta work from the inside out, bub. Try either expanding your group of friends or breaking into a different group if you can. Put yourself in different situations and try going different places on nights out. Broaden your spectrum a little and see what you make of it.

I'm very intelligent but because I was depressed around the time of my LC I only scraped 180 points. I didn't bother repeating because I saw school as the root of my problems. Before secondary school I regularly outperformed other students in the class but I dropped downhill from around 3rd year onwards, my JC was excellent but that means nothing now.
But now that I've been out of school for 2½ years I don't feel much better. I've just been working part time since then and there's times where I have no work for anything up to a month. Sitting at home for a month doing nothing isn't my cup of tea.

Evilution

Have you tried looking for fulltime work?

Shrimp

What is it that ppl feel they should slag you about? like you seem bang on! wtf they on bout? like your open for one thing!

Chad ghostal

College isnt the end of your problems obviously, but it is nothing like secondary school in my experience..
i hated secondary school and was very down, when i got into college and actually started doing something i liked for the first time, it made life alot easier...

imo your just going to have to drop the past and open yourself up for a beating (wether you recieve one) and take risks, its the only way your going to get along,
dont let the tools from secondary ruin your future..

Dr Bolouswki

its all about action karsini - take a bunch of little small steps and the rest slides into place. first thing i'd say is get working full time if you can - you don't ahve to get a job that you think will be 'your job' for the rest of your life, but it will accomplish a number of things - it'll get you out of the gaff (i might be reading too much into the post, but it'd be nice for your ma to encourage moves on girls! see the son finding happiness !!)- it'll get you interacting with other people (inc the ladies!) - it'll get you some money! to spend on other stuff that is small steps (new glasses? contacts? clothes? even therapy?) getting stuff together like this may not be the 'ultimate solution' but its good to be active and involved in new stuff... if you find you don't like the 'job' - quit! but wait until you find something better to work at rather than quitting to stay at home - remember, what yuo work at doesn't define who you are...

anyway - don't knwo how much sense i'm making - but remember - every 'whole' is a sum of its parts - take some steps on the little things in your life and the bigger things may start to slide together for ya.

Have you looked at doing any self study courses? A+ or network+ for instance for some PC orientated stuff?

I've gone through my own ups and downs (i've got pretty poor health which really effects my attitude to things) but i found doing some of the above has really helped - i do therapy once a week too, and at the least its a good chance to talk about myself for an hour with a sympathetic listener! but also it helps you view things differently, and more clearly. often we just have a poor opinion of ourselves that is based on skewed reasoning, and not inherent truth.

anyway - best of luck man - you have a rare quality if this post is anything to go by - honesty. Stick with it.

B

@Shrimp

I suppose I'm just not very good at finding jobs in the first place. There's no jobs in my area, at least in my line of work. One of my brothers works in Super Valu here and hates it, so I don't think I'd consider supermarket work. I sometimes look for jobs online or in newspapers but don't find a lot.
I've applied for a few jobs but only made some progress in one application - Dell in Cabinteely interviewed me but I didn't get the place. I'm interested in anything technical, as a result I tried to apply to Vodafone Retail but they turned me down at the first step. Then again, if I'm this honest could I sell phones???
There's something going in Ballymount now but I'm not sure if its exactly what I'm looking for, might call on Monday and get some more info. I had intended to move back to Dublin since I'm originally from there and am hoping that life may improve if I do go back. My brother is living in Lucan and having a brilliant time.

I do have the A+ certification under my belt, just haven't seen many jobs on offer that recognise it (but that position I mentioned above in Ballymount do accept it). I studied that from home because I didn't want to step into a classroom, just took the exams in Parnell Street.

@Shrimp:
I'm certainly more open than most, prefer to get things off my chest. I have a soft character so I'm open to being used and am easy to tick. Most of the things were to do with physical appearance, my accent, or something to do with my computer interest. I also have little interest in sport, unlike most of the class I was in. My school was a living advert for Kerry GAA - being a Dub didn't help there either.

nesf

Karsini wrote:

I'm very intelligent but because I was depressed around the time of my LC I only scraped 180 points. I didn't bother repeating because I saw school as the root of my problems. Before secondary school I regularly outperformed other students in the class but I dropped downhill from around 3rd year onwards, my JC was excellent but that means nothing now.
But now that I've been out of school for 2½ years I don't feel much better. I've just been working part time since then and there's times where I have no work for anything up to a month. Sitting at home for a month doing nothing isn't my cup of tea.

I was depressed around the time of my LC too, well actually I spent from just after my JC to present day depressed and recieving treatment. I'm in the situation where I got to third level, and am now stuck trying to finish a degree which I can't seem to get bloody done due to my illnesses mostly while having papers published in my subject! But enough about me...

I empathise with your situation mate, but I'm afraid there are no easy answers, I still suffer from a lack of self confidence even though I have what appears to other people as an extroverted personality. In my opinion the best thing you can do is try to find some interests through which you can meet people and socialise and feel comfortable. Hobbies are great for this. Boards for instance can be a great release for some people I know, it allows them some form of social contact without all the baggage that comes with "normal" socialising.

I second Dr. Bolouski's suggestion to look at therapy. I'm a strong advocate of therapy, it's been fantastic for me and helped me alot. Everyone should have a therapist in my opinion! Your local GP can help you find a therapist or a psychiatrist if you think that medication is necessary or an option. It never hurts to find this out. Medication has really helped me deal with life and has put a stop to an endless cycle of severe depressions that effected me for a long number of years. Not that I'm telling you that you need medication or anything, just that sometimes it can be a help.

On an alternative therapy side of things, since many of us come from "old" thinking families where medication and therapists are frowned upon or actively discouraged (I know I did!). Music is a great healer and a fantastic way to meet people. I've met alot of people through my particular taste in music, heavy rock/metal. Music can also be very relaxing and a great way to escape from life for a short while. Also musical instruments can be a good way of finding a new focus and a way of developing self confidence and creativity. Other things are martial arts to develop self confidence and discipline, reading to broaden your mind, painting can be very theraputic, recreational sports like golf can be very good for your lifestyle, going walking/mountaineering can be a fantastic way to clear your head and get a fresh perspective on things, and some pastimes like gaming, poker and other more alternative games can be a great way to meet new people.

Um I kinda just threw stuff at you there, hope you can take something from it mate. Main thing is not to give up and not to despair. Things improve. Believe in that.

Just my 2c.

ChRoMe

I had a revelation recently. For the past 2 years I have been a shadow of my former self and feeling quite similar about the attitude towards life that you have expressed. I cant tell you 5 steps that will fix everything or that if you get contacts you'll meet a nice woman.

I can however share with you the one thing that has made me 20x times more happier since I realised it (and I dont mean notice I mean take to heart and live your life this way).

For me (and I'm guessing you) the thing that holds you back is fear. Its really that simple I know it sounds corny or whatever but its true. The reason you never went for it with the girl you liked for 7 years was because you were afriad she would say no and the fantasy would be ruined. The fear itself is over powering and crippling (thats why you cant think of what to say to women) good news is that there is a proven way to fix it.

Get rejected. Then you'll relaise that being rejected is not a big deal. I mean any time I've been rejected I have to admit the girl was always extremely good about it. Didnt give me anything other than a big smile and "i have a boyfriend,girlfriend,not interested etc"

Dont forget man people are just people. The stunning blonde or whatever in a club that all the lads are after can still have self esteem issues NO ONE is perfect or without faults. I recall one night myself, my girlfriend of the time and two of her friends went out to the red box. Everyone was having a great time but something really struck me as being wrong.

One of the friends was beautiful like model material. The whole night not one bloke chatted her up. Everyone assumed that they wouldnt have a chance. She was starved of any real attention and anyone who would have had the balls to chat her up would have gotten her (within reason of course). And I know for a fact that this is the norm for her and other girls like her. Sorry for the rambling just trying to demonstrate the point

ChroMe

nesf

ChRoMe wrote:

I can however share with you the one thing that has made me 20x times more happier since I realised it (and I dont mean notice I mean take to heart and live your life this way).

For me (and I'm guessing you) the thing that holds you back is fear. Its really that simple I know it sounds corny or whatever but its true. The reason you never went for it with the girl you liked for 7 years was because you were afriad she would say no and the fantasy would be ruined. The fear itself is over powering and crippling (thats why you cant think of what to say to women) good news is that there is a proven way to fix it.

lol I'm sorry mate I just have this image of you drawing the "Fear-Love" line and handing out cards with scenarios on them....


That said fair point

ChRoMe

I know when I try to put it into words I feel like ****ing Dr.Phil or some ****

CathyMoran

Karsini wrote:

I'm very intelligent but because I was depressed around the time of my LC I only scraped 180 points. I didn't bother repeating because I saw school as the root of my problems. Before secondary school I regularly outperformed other students in the class but I dropped downhill from around 3rd year onwards, my JC was excellent but that means nothing now.
But now that I've been out of school for 2½ years I don't feel much better. I've just been working part time since then and there's times where I have no work for anything up to a month. Sitting at home for a month doing nothing isn't my cup of tea.

Have you had your IQ checked - it sounds like you were a 'gifted' kid who did not get the stimulation you needed in school. It is easy to get bored and slump for your LC as a result. If so doing something in college will help as it will use your brains again and make you feel better and then the rest will fall into place - college is a great place to meet people too.

Mickey_37

one of my first posts so bear with me if its not too tidy. i can understand how you feel because i felt like that for years mostly during my teens. went through all the stuff that you did (slagging, etc) but a friend put me onto this guy, Carl Jung. and i have to say he changed my life! im not saying its for you but just read the attached file and try tell me that nothing he says dosen't click with you. i'll say no more, just read it!

(hope it ok to attach that file. if not then sorry and please remove it.)

Gordon

The zip contains a word doc with no content.

Mickey_37

damit the file is too large to zip down to 100kb and i can't attach rar files! here is another doc on the same guy but its not as good as the one i tried to post. any ideas on how to post it up? i can email it to you if you want?

neuro-praxis

How's the mud down there in that rut?

There's lots of hope for you, Karsini. I recommend that you sit down with a positive attitude and write out a list of your values. (Don't underestimate the power of this little exercise.)

What is important to you (hypothetically, even?) What do you wish to achieve in your life, short term AND long term? What do need in order to feel good? What turns your day from an ordinary crap day into something halfway bearable?

Then examine your list, and set about finding ways to achieve at least one of your goals. Only you know what you need and want.

Have a look in the mirror. People with low self confidence often neglect their personal needs because they feel they don't deserve anything. Perhaps getting contact lenses isn't such a bad idea? (Although personally, I love glasses.) Do you need some new clothes? Do you need a haircut/shave? Do you need to take better care of your body by eating better and taking some exercise?

You are aware of your intelligence. An intelligent person can achieve anything. They just need a little motivation.

If it helps you, my brother went through something similar. His confidence was shot to pieces by incessant bullying at school and got a poor LC as a result. But then he worked his ass off. He got a cert, then a diploma, and then worked a crappy job for a while, before deciding to go to the UK to study again, and at 26 is now a teacher earning €28k. He looks good and has many friends. His first relationship wasn't until he was 22, either. Now he's a total slut, you'll be happy to hear.

Once you examine what you want from your life, you will be able to go and get it. Watch Being John Malkovitch and listen to Maxine when she's stoned for advice.

Victor

You're young, you have your health, you have work skills ... it's a start.

Now, everybody hates their job (to some degree or other), so don't be put off by your brother's experience. What I would suggest is you get a job, any job. It will count towards your experience, motivation and keep you at least at minimum wage (people with less than two years experience can be paid a lower minimum wage). Do the computer repair as a sideline until such time as it's worthwhile to go full time.

Socially, third level education tends to be quite different than school. The small mindedness of the school bully doesn't work anymore (or certainly manifests itself very differently). At least go as far as getting some of the industry exams done so the skills you have are recognised.

ChRoMe

Hi, thanks for all the suggestions, I have a lot to read through. I'll comment on a few points that were made.

ChRoMe wrote:

For me (and I'm guessing you) the thing that holds you back is fear. Its really that simple I know it sounds corny or whatever but its true. The reason you never went for it with the girl you liked for 7 years was because you were afriad she would say no and the fantasy would be ruined.

I agree with that. Fear holds me back with a lot of things, not just women. Finding a job is difficult because I'm afraid I won't like it. Change scares the life out of me.

CathyMoran wrote:

Have you had your IQ checked - it sounds like you were a 'gifted' kid who did not get the stimulation you needed in school. It is easy to get bored and slump for your LC as a result.

I never got my IQ checked but you're spot on. At age 8 I had the reading ability and vocabulary of an 18 year old, and I was featured on an RTÉ radio show back in the summer of 1992 with other kids who were similar to myself (if nobody believes me I have the tape!). My memory is excellent, I can remember phone numbers much easier than many people, and I can master new things quickly - but only if I have the enthusiasm and a want to do so.
Primary school was a doddle for me, it certainly seems that I started to fall around the start of 3rd year. I also went straight to 5th year, my school had no option for transition year. Looking back I probably wouldn't have done it at the time anyway, just wanted to get out of there.
The thought of stepping into a classroom again for any reason burns me up inside. I've been in several schools in my line of work, maintaining school PCs, and I don't even like being in a school for that. Especially when travelling along the playground to get into the school (if necessary), I feel really uncomfortable when passing through, especially if the kids are on a break and outside. I've also got a fear of public toilets after someone let off a banger in the toilet cubicle beside me when I was in 5th year, I passed out after that.


My health is excellent, I don't smoke and have only been sick once in the last 11 years. I'm not overweight, might actually be a little underweight, but I'm happy with my figure. I do sometimes neglect my appearance but recently I've experimented with different clothes to see what makes me feel best. Shaving is one of my weak points, I seem to cut my face any time I try so have a habit of putting it off for a few days more.

I think I am just stuck in a rut. I never had any suicidal tendencies, my attitude was always "get through this." I want to make something of my life, not throw it away.

CathyMoran

I was diagnosed as being a gifted kid when I was 2 - my parents did not do that much about it except buy me as much reading material as I wanted and art material and we had a good computer and other educational toys such as Meccano. It is easy to get very fustrated when your school does not progress at the same rate as you and I just got bored... I was lucky in school in that I was into the Pogues and I used to teach some of the kids in school so I was never really bullied in school but I did find that college was a better environment for me. I just wish that I could have skipped 5 years of school! I also found that I used to be friends with people who were a lot older than me as they talked on the same level but there were a few gifted kids in the school I was in so we used to stick together. I really do think that college may help you. Best wishes.

I can find it hard to interact with people my own age, which can be embarrassing for me. One of my friends down these parts is 46.

My best friend still lives in Dublin, he's an old school friend, one of the few I do have. I've been back up there to see him a few times and also made friends with his girlfriend, so it seems that I can connect with people my own age, just need to find the right ones. It's hard to keep in touch with someone that lives 180 miles away, but I try.

The college idea really freaks me out, I'm not sure if I could ever make myself go.

CathyMoran

I found more friends my own age when I was in college than when I was in school - college really can be a good place, it just depends on the course you are doing. There are lots of good college societies that you can get involved in depending on your interests. You just have to take the first step. PM me if you want to discuss college as an option.

Victor

Karsini wrote:

I never had any suicidal tendencies, my attitude was always "get through this."

Odd thing to say, any comments? But yes antime I was bullied (from first class right through to sixth year - including having a dozen guys sticking me in a fridge) it was a matter of "screw them, I'm not losing".

The_Conductor

Karsini wrote:

I can find it hard to interact with people my own age, which can be embarrassing for me. One of my friends down these parts is 46.

My best friend still lives in Dublin, he's an old school friend, one of the few I do have. I've been back up there to see him a few times and also made friends with his girlfriend, so it seems that I can connect with people my own age, just need to find the right ones. It's hard to keep in touch with someone that lives 180 miles away, but I try.

The college idea really freaks me out, I'm not sure if I could ever make myself go.

You could always explore the possibilities of doing a degree by distance learning. It would enable you to do it in your own time from home, and also work part-time or do your own thing at your own pace. Some colleges will take relevant experience and/or other qualifications into account, and may give you exemptions allowing you to skip some subjects.

As has been pointed out, college is a totally different ball-park than school, its very much a sink or swim, and bullies have no place there. You will find like minded people there- regardless of how odd and unusual you consider yourself to be- speaking from personal experience. Some people in a similar frame of mind would be inclined to join societies such as Gamesoc or Science Fiction and Fantasy Society- both as a manner to practise their own personal form of escapism, and while they are there to suddenly discover that there are lots of others in a similar situation.

The first thing you should know, is there are many many people out there- similar to you, more similar than you would care to believe. Its easy to hide and look on the world as an outside alien place- to examine the world from a distance, without ever taking part in it. Its harder to actively decide that you are going to take the bull by the horns and come to terms with the world.

I empathise totally with you, in common with others here. There is a better way though.

S.

Victor

Victor wrote:

Odd thing to say, any comments? But yes antime I was bullied (from first class right through to sixth year - including having a dozen guys sticking me in a fridge) it was a matter of "screw them, I'm not losing".

Well I just meant that I don't think its a matter of clinical depression. Someone did ask me to talk to a doctor about it but I don't think it adds up. I've always wanted to fight my troubles but its taking longer than I assumed. I never had any intention of giving up, I know what's wrong with me but didn't know what to do.

CathyMoran

It could be a combination of things - being bored with the slow pace of things and people can get on anyones nerves. I think that you may just need an outlet.

nesf

Karsini wrote:

Well I just meant that I don't think its a matter of clinical depression. Someone did ask me to talk to a doctor about it but I don't think it adds up. I've always wanted to fight my troubles but its taking longer than I assumed. I never had any intention of giving up, I know what's wrong with me but didn't know what to do.

Clinical depression and suicidal tendencies are not the same thing! GAH! Educate yourself on the matter kid. :mad:

(Edit) I had a very long post written here but I thought it was too hostile for this thread so I cut it. I'll post my views in a new thread so you won't take them as a personal attack on you or anything.

One thing I will say is this.

Karsini wrote:

I'm very intelligent but because I was depressed around the time of my LC I only scraped 180 points. I didn't bother repeating because I saw school as the root of my problems. Before secondary school I regularly outperformed other students in the class but I dropped downhill from around 3rd year onwards, my JC was excellent but that means nothing now.

Pretensiousness, arrogance and other such negative qualities as displayed in the above story are probably alot of what inhibits your interaction with others. Clinging to how well you did in primary school is most definitely not going to help you.

I'm too angry to post more, I don't want to attack you, it's just some of the things you've said have gotten under my skin.

Then again I'm a pretensious arrogant git, and maybe I see too much of myself in you for your own good

No offence taken, you've got a point there.

Miles

The new age gurus would tell you to practice positive self-imagery.

nesf

Karsini wrote:

No offence taken, you've got a point there.

None intended either, I just had a similar situation, if worse in some regards, but I got very bitter and angry about it. from there I just got to be totally arrogant regarding the whole topic. It took a long time to drag myself out of the situation after losing a few friends over it. Am just trying to nip things in the bud so to speak.

I certainly don't want to be seen as if I think I'm "better than everyone else." I have to cheer up a bit though, I doubt that anyone likes a negative person.

Victor

nesf wrote:

(Edit) I had a very long post written here but I thought it was too hostile for this thread so I cut it. I'll post my views in a new thread so you won't take them as a personal attack on you or anything.

Thank you for your honesty and decorum.