carnevale

cajun_tiger

on fx anyone watch it yet?

TCamen

Watched S1 on TG4, which started around this time last year. Excellent series. Season 2 is starting this coming Sunday in America, so hopefully TG4 will get it soon!!

Basq

Heard it's very good... slow-moving but good!

Ain't caught an episode of it yet.. might buy the Season 1 DVD!

weerez

Ya Ive heard great things about it. Will give it a look if I remember

callmescratch

very good show.
i only caught about half the series here and there between TG4 and FX.
it's a dvd i'd definitely consider buying.

Agent Orange

The main storyline moves slower than a slug through treacle but it's definitely worth a watch. But Ben and Brother Justin not even meeting at the end of the first season was a bit of a cop out, and the season finale was very weak.

damien

It's a cool show. Slow is the word though. I liked the ending.

ixoy

Agent Orange wrote:

The main storyline moves slower than a slug through treacle but it's definitely worth a watch. But Ben and Brother Justin not even meeting at the end of the first season was a bit of a cop out, and the season finale was very weak.

The story is slow moving but I disagree about them not meeting being a cop out. The creators are on record as saying they've planned out the series like a novel, with each season representing chapters or sections. To have Ben and Justin meet too early on in the "novel" wouldn't make sense from a construction point-of-view. So it won't be happening yet. I assume Season 2 will move all the pieces closer together (I'll start finding out on Monday).

Oh and the finale was absolutely fantastic - not even remotely weak and left me very eager for more...

doh.ie

callmescratch wrote:

very good show.
i only caught about half the series here and there between TG4 and FX.
it's a dvd i'd definitely consider buying.

It's expensive, so shop around. You should be able to get it for about €50 from Amazon.com. Was a little disappointed by the dearth of extras, but it's not the worst, and the episode transfers are excellent, and in 5.1 surround.

Agent Orange - based on the trailer at www.hbo.com/carnivale, the second season should give more of the same, but no sign of a "meeting" just yet either. In any case, that's part of the mystery - the longer it's prolonged, the better. Wouldn't surprise me if it didn't happen in season two at all, in fact! And technically, I suppose Ben and Justin have met several times - in their shared dreams.

Harry2001

ixoy wrote:

Oh and the finale was absolutely fantastic - not even remotely weak and left me very eager for more...

Agreed, great ending to a great show

Can't wait for season 2, only hope they get to finish the story and not get cancelled

doh.ie

Harry2001 wrote:

Agreed, great ending to a great show

Can't wait for season 2, only hope they get to finish the story and not get cancelled

Shhhh! Don't say the C-word! You'll jinx it!

Basq

They've a review of the first two episodes over at Ain't It Cool News (http://www.aintitcool.com/display.cgi?id=19077)

As i haven't seen the show, i'm not too sure if there's large spoilers contained... so best beware if you don't want to know much about the start of the next season.

Quint has seen the first two episodes of CARNIVALE Season 2!!!
"... So it was that the fate of mankind came to rest on the trembling shoulders of the most reluctant of saviors."

Ahoy, squirts! Quint here with my opinion of the first two episodes of CARNIVALE Season 2. The first episode is called Los Moscos and takes place just where the season finale left off.

The above quote is from Samson (Michael J. Anderson) and is the prologue to this episode, much like his speech before the first episode of the first season. They are clearly setting this series up to be a massive collision between Ben Hawkins (Nick Stahl) and Brother Justin (the awesome Clancy Brown).

So, the fire rages and if you've seen the trailer for Season Two, you know that Clea DuVall (Sophie) makes it out. Her unfortunate, silent and super-psychic mother does not... Although there is a scene later in the next episode that shows she might not be 100% gone.

So, Stahl succeeds in bringing Adrienne Barbeau (Ruthie) back to life, but only by murdering Lodz (Patrick Bauchau). "A life for a life." We've seen that part, but like I said above, the new season starts off without missing a beat. Newly murdered, Lodz lies dead on the floor of Management's trailer. At this point, Management and Ben

Hawkins have a little talk where much is revealed, including Management's identity. That's right, we don't see behind the curtain, but we now know who Management is. I won't give it away, but I will say that you've seen Management's face before in Season 1.

It's also set up that Brother Justin and Ben Hawkins are both searching for Scudder, who seems to be integral to either side winning. Hawkins is searching for him through info he gets at the Templars ("Don't tell him you got it from me! He ain't human! He ain't human!") and Brother Justin gets set on the path by a satanist/occultist listener who heard him speaking on the radio and recognized him for what he was. Speaking of, Brother Justin is gathering a bit of a following due to his radio access. Much like Randall Flagg in THE STAND, he's drawing like minds to him as the pieces start moving in the battle between Dark and Light. It also ends with one of the coolest effects of the series... think POLTERGEIST.

Episode 2.2 is called Alamogordo, NM and has Ben Hawkins finding the man who painted the mural up at the Templar offices, you know... the one of tattooed man in the cornfield. The artist is a priest who is confined in some priest sanctuary/nuthouse, surrounded by his sketches of the man with the tattoos. He's also stuck repeating the same prayer while quickly crossing himself over and over and over again.

All the while, Brother Justin is busy setting up Temple Jericho, his main base of operations (spot picked because of a twisted tree we've seen before in visions). The reporter traveling with Brother Justin suspects Irene in the orphanage fire (that we know she did start) and begins asking questions. Might not work out too well for him, methinks, but he's doin' the asking.

Ruthie (Barbeau) is seeing people from her past, who turn out to be dead... I'm not sure where they're going with this, but her more than near death experience is probably catching up with her. Oh, and Libby and her mom put on another Cooch show, which is good news for us. Damn if that Carla Gallo isn't cute as a button.
Meanwhile, Brother Justin has a rather odd experience with a half-naked asian woman as his body is... altered. But I'll let you see that scene for yourself.

Without giving away every single beat of both episodes I better stop here. But Management's revelation of who the tattooed man is and what he means is a great ender to the second episode! I can't wait to see just how and when Brother Justin and Ben Hawkins meet and what'll happen when they do. Looks like we CARNIVALE fans are in for a helluva ride. Look to HBO this Friday for your first new CARNIVALE of the year!!!

I got lots of cool stuff coming up, squirts! Keep your eye on the site!
-Quint

Harry2001

Anyone else seen the season two opener? Got my cousin to send it to me

Fantastic episode!!!!! I won't give anything away

If the rest of this series follows the first episode we are in for a treat

Easily the best thing on TV right now

Raoul Duke

Seen it as well. If it's been a while since you've seen season 1 then I'd recommend that you watch the season closer before watching this or at least reading up about it somewhere. Maybe it's just my terrrible memory though I found myself going "who the f#ck is that?" and "who are they talking about?" alot.

doh.ie

I really enjoyed 2x01. Anyone else think they've decided to reveal a hell of a lot more earlier this year?

We now know Management is the Russian guy we kept seeing last year and he's the opposite of Scudder ('there's a person of good and evil') - but this suggests Scudder is the evil one and Management is 'good' (though I expect there may be some twist here in the future).

Ben's seen the fate of mankind - nuclear holocaust - and Justin's on course to build his church. Since they're both now looking for Henry Scudder, it's possible they will meet this year. They can certainly face each other more clearly now in their dreams than before.

The apocryphal gospel - this seems to be a prophecy of how these 'end times' will go. Must check if that's a real text, but I don't think so. Justin's got some kind of subliminal thing going on his radio broadcasts. I suspect Tommy Dolan will catch on before long - the increased radio broadcast signal was pretty cool.

Now, I may be going out on a limb here, but the inclusion of the Templars from last season again (they're long said to hold some secret going back to biblical times, most involving the Holy Grail) makes me wonder if Ben/Scudder's bloodline is a divine one - as in descended from Christ himself. That element of destiny and 'the heir' came up a few times in the premiere. Which would make Justin's bloodline - and Management's - something very unholy. Basically, I reckon Management is Justin's father... But that wouldn't explain why Management was helping Ben - unless he's doing exactly the opposite, setting events in motion for a final confrontation he hopes Justin will win...

Anyway, all very interesting and unlike shows like The X-Files, we were given a LOT of information on the arc in this episode. Can't wait for the next one. This truly is one of the finest shows on TV at the moment.

Harry2001

anyone following this, fantastic stuff in 2x07, seems to be moving along much faster now

top class TV

pickarooney

How many episodes in a series? I've only seen the first episode, and when I missed the second one I didn't bother any more (can't stand knowing I've missed an ep of anything, sad I know). The eh, Post Office was complaining about getting too many parcels this month, so I don't know if it's worth risking their wrath by asking cousin Hank to send all the first series.

Harry2001

12 episodes i think in season 2, i'd risk it with Hank it's well worth it

Etain

It's easily the best show on currently. I don't miss an episode.

tvnutz

Carnivale is brilliant,I agree the first season was really slow but the season finale was brilliant.It seems as if season was was the prologue,because season 2 is just racing through and throwing so much stuff at us.its brilliant,dont miss it when it comes on TG4.

doh.ie

Loved 2x07; cannot believe they've reunited

Scudder and Ben already. Didn't expect that until near the end of the season. Plus, things are really moving ahead now.
Looks like I was right in my 2x01 post - Management/The Russian is Justin's father; though there was no explanation for Management's motive - we don't know if he was genuinely trying to stop Justin, or if he was actually aiding him (possibly by bringing him and Ben together). I hope there is a good explanation for that.

In short, this has been a great season so far. Much darker than the first (if that were even possible), and a storyline after much plodding in s1, which has suddenly starting moving in earnest.

I'm judging shows I love these days by how eager I am to see them, and which ones I watch on the day, er, my cousin's deliver them, and so far, Carnivale and Lost win that anticipation hands down. Too bad the series isn't longer, but I'd rather have 12 of this level of quality than 24 which were, well, like 24!

tvnutz

Wasnt ep 7 brilliant?I was on the edge of my seat the entire time,this season has been brilliant.

ixoy

2x07 was very good but, when I saw the running time of 46 minutes on my err.. cousin's tape, I thought I was going to be abruptly cut off - the show's usually longer.

Despite that they crammed so much more into it this week:

I was getting a little frustrated with Ben's endless search for Scudder. I thought "oh here's a hotel and he'll find another clue that'll distract him from finding Scudder for a few weeks". And shocked to find out Scudder was there..

And how neat was Ben's healing of Scudder's acid-scarred face in Damascus? The wave of people he drew upon must surely have some consequence in the future, especially as he seemed to kill a few without caring. If Ben is Light, as we assume, how can he ignore this?

Also enjoyed Justin's OTT firebrand-speech as he separated from the Church. The "Oh sh*t" line was priceless.

Attempting to kill Management - what reprecussions? Management is somehow linked into the Carnivale - it started to die as he did - and may be irked with Ben next time. And is Management Light seeing as it birthed Justin?

Lots of other questions but we finally saw some real movement. And no breaks coming up unlike the month's hiatus other shows are taking...

doh.ie

ixoy wrote:

2x07 was very good but, when I saw the running time of 46 minutes on my err.. cousin's tape, I thought I was going to be abruptly cut off - the show's usually longer.

Season 1 did this in a few places as well. I can't explain it. The running for 2x06 was easily 50-53 mins; I couldn't believe this stopped at 46. If you have the same version as I did, it didn't even end neatly - the credits were clearly the continuation of the same music, but they were chopped out. Still, even at 47:30, the show was a large chunk off what it normally plays as. I'll look into it, but I reckon the freedoms HBO offers causes producers not to worry quite so much about running times (in that HBO isn't affected by commerical spacings.)

ixoy wrote:

And how neat was Ben's healing of Scudder's acid-scarred face in Damascus? The wave of people he drew upon must surely have some consequence in the future, especially as he seemed to kill a few without caring. If Ben is Light, as we assume, how can he ignore this?

I was trying to figure out if people were killed or not. Is it possible he just zapped them of a bit of their 'life energy' but didn't actually kill any of them? I mean, to give life might need another life to be taken, but is "healing" different? (though the plants died in the pilot, and the fish in the lake when he healed Gabriel.)

ixoy wrote:

Attempting to kill Management - what reprecussions? Management is somehow linked into the Carnivale - it started to die as he did - and may be irked with Ben next time. And is Management Light seeing as it birthed Justin?

Wondered this very point myself. If we assume Management wants to prevent the coming apocalypse, was originally trying to stop Scudder and used the Carnivale to ensure he was in the right place for the end times, he may very well be Light to Scudder's Dark. Scudder, we know, killed many men in Babylon and has generally left a trail of destruction whereever he went. However, that said, they're not exactly portraying him in a negative light, but that could be part of the trick. He seems almost too weak, too keen to not use his abilities. The sulphuric acid on the face (ouch!) seems designed to ensure he was not found or recognised by anyone.

There's certainly nothing to say the lineage of Light/Dark doesn't transfer, and it would be a neat about-turn. I love the idea that Management is now tied to the Carnivale itself. Thought that played out well on screen (despite the wonky quick ending). Also, is it just me, or was Management dying weeks ago, and then in another episode, didn't Ben enter the trailer only to find mounds of dust everywhere? I took it from that that Management might have died at that point. But obviously not.

Loving how the story is picking up now.

Thankfully the wandering for Scudder has drawn to a close.

Will be interesting to see where the plot takes us from here - I hope they leave enough open for a potential third season, assuming that's in the plan. If not, better to end now than run out of arc and drag it out next year.

ixoy

As good as 2x07 was, 2x08 was even better

Holy crap they revealed loads as Ben spock to Samson for an age, explaining how he had been heralded in.

Ben's a lot *lot* more powerful now and he no longer seems lost - he knows what he's up to.

Justin is about to get his hands on Scudder but also making a gambit to take more serious control of America.

The "cooch" plotline was actually interesting, despite its soap-opera feel.

The ferris wheel of death - how long have we waited for that?

And then they slam it off with an ending that I didn't see coming, even if I should have

Roll on next week....

Harry2001

ixoy wrote:

Roll on next week....

yep, another great episode last sunday - are they rushing towards a conclusion now? Is this season going to be the end? :eek:

doh.ie

ixoy wrote:

Holy crap they revealed loads as Ben spock to Samson for an age, explaining how he had been heralded in.

He "spock" to him, did he?! Freudian. But the logic of the goings-on was spot-on this week. You find yourself nodding as plot points are expanded upon and revealed. I like the way that while everything is falling into place, there are still a few surprises.

e.g. Management wanting Ben to kill him so his 'blood' could infuse the knife and so his abilities could be passed on to Ben, making Ben Carnivale's new Management.

ixoy wrote:

Justin is about to get his hands on Scudder but also making a gambit to take more serious control of America.

This makes a lot of sense considering the shots of Capitol Hill on the opening titles. Good continuity with Templeton and the other councillor back as well.

ixoy wrote:

The ferris wheel of death - how long have we waited for that?

Thought the scene with Ben and the crushed mother asking for her child to be saved was very moving, leading to Samson's accepting of Ben as management. No real explanation for the foetus in the jar in the old trailer. Can we assume this is some representation of Management?

ixoy wrote:

And then they slam it off with an ending that I didn't see coming, even if I should have

Yep. Loved the ending. One of those really cool cliffhangers that delivers a punch. I thought earlier in it, "I wonder if Clea DuVall wanted out of the show for a while...", so I'd kind of decided in my mind she wasn't going to turn up until nearer the end of the series.

Couple of thoughts based on this ep; now Scudder is on his way to Justin's, does Justin have to kill him (as Ben has Justin's father) to have the same level of power as Ben? Loved the appearance of Management's face in the shroud as well. Suitably freaky.

Good to see the Gospel of St Matthias guy back - he seems to have a lot of the answers about where things go from here.

Leaves us with one big question, though. Management seems to have been the Creature of Light of the previous generation. Does this mean that Scudder is the Creature of Darkness from that time? If so, why didn't he become the Usher? He seemed to withdraw from having anything to do with
humanity completely. Did he realise what he was and rather than embrace it like Justin, decided to disguise himself and ensure his fate didn't happen?

He seems so fragile now, it's hard to picture him as the Creature of Darkness.

I like how everything is falling into place. It's incredible now to look back on those WWI images from season 1 - the bear, Lodz, the maimed Russian soldier... - and realise how much information we were given all along. (Not alone that, but a snake biting is clear visible in the early moments of the very first episode.)

Actually, now I think of it, was Belyakov and Scudder's great battle actually WWI itself... Given that the events of the show are chronicling a time before WWII broke out - we hear tidbits that point out the time (like the Austrian chancellor's assassination), newspaper headlines etc. - is WWII the actual cataclysmic armageddon that Justin is working towards...?

Anyway, great episode. Fine series so far. With Dead Like Me having been axed, let's hope there's enough life in this for a third year. It's some of the finest TV I've seen in years.

doh.ie

And another thought... (speculation on the bloodlines of Light/Dark)

With all the Light birthing Dark (Management -> Justin), and Scudder, if indeed he is Dark, being father to Ben, what are the chances (high, I think) that Ben and Sofie conceived a child that night in the rain (the coinciding lightning suggested it), and that this will be a child of Dark as well? I'm very sure that a pregnancy for Sofie will come into play at some point.

Have read some theories that the man who raped Appolonia has some connection to the whole thing (he was protrayed as The Usher/tattooed man in some of those visions). If this was Scudder who raped her (doubtful?) or someone else connected to the Light/Dark bloodline, maybe a child between Ben and Sofie would cancel the whole thing out...

Just thought I'd throw it into the mix... Man, I'll miss this show when it's done.

John R

Just saw an ad on FX promoting series 2 starting in....September.

doh.ie

Could it be further away? Why promote it now?! They could also start it much sooner, considering HBO won't be taking any breaks between now and the end of its run.