Kofi handling the relief effort from the ski slopes?

TomF

I didn't realise Kofi Annan, Secretary-General of the U.N. was skiing in Jackson Hole, Wyoming, U.S.A. when the death-dealing waves hit Asian beaches last week. It seems he elected to handle the U.N. response apres ski.

"Q: Mr. Secretary, picking up on Richard's question, I think a lot of people are asking exactly why you waited three days on vacation in Jackson Hole, Wyoming, before you decided to fly back to New York in the face of this extraordinary crisis. Could you give us a full explanation of your thinking on that? Secondly, what kind of signal does that 72-hour delay send to the nations to which you are now appealing for greater help?

SG: First of all, there was action. It wasn't inaction. We live in a world where you can operate from wherever you are. You know the world we live in now. You don't have to be physically here to be dealing with the leaders and the Governments I have been dealing with. You don't have to be physically here to be discussing with some of the agencies that we have done.

I came back here because we have reached a level that I wanted to have meetings with all the people that I have met with today. So, we have taken action. And I don't have to be sitting in my office to take action. I think the same goes for you in your profession."

"http://www.un.org/apps/sg/offthecuff.asp?nid=660

Moriarty

What, just like bush waiting days to make a speech because he couldn't be arsed to bother himself over christmas?

If you want to target the UN, I'm sure there must be better ways to do it than irrelevancies like this.

DadaKopf

You don't think, for example, that the wonders of instant electronic communication might mean that Kofi Annan was on constant contact with his colleagues in the UN when the disaster happened? And you don't think that there are probably dozens of people in the UN who could do the job in his absence?

In any case, contingency operations like this are implemented by the UN's specialised agencies like UNICEF and the WHO, and I remember those guys on the TV nearly instantly.

Plus, it takes time for any huge organisational structure like the UN or the US government, to emerge with a policy-line. It's like playing a game of world championship chess.

I've just got back from America and the mainstream media is already using this terrible, terrible tragedy as a weapon to criticise the UN, villify Kofi Annan and the administration and 'experts' are using it as a clever (but painfully obvious) ploy to get back into the world's good books. I don't remember foreign aid volumes ever being such an issue of public debate.

In any case, the American press is lying about US aid. A lead article in the NY Times yesterday said that the US is the world's most generous donor in terms of percentage of GNP. This is a lie, America is one of the worst performers of all the world's richest countries. Sure, absolute volumes are bigger than any individual country, but the EU, an economy comparable in size to the US, on average contributes three times as much (US 0.1% GNP versus EU 0.35%). Then, strangely, the NYT editorial in the same issue corrected the lead article, but who reads editorials?

Who cares if Annan was skiing? Who cares if Bush is dumb and needed time to develop a policy-line? These debates are not helpful right now.

chewy

well said dada

Hobbes

I rountinely have conversations/meetings with people from various parts of the world at the same time. Don't see what the big deal is. From what you posted sounded like he was doing his job.

TomF

Well, I didn't really mean my posting of Koffi Annan's apparent discomfiting by the question of a reporter to be a trolling run, but I seem to have netted at least a few fish.

Hobbes

I'm confused, you said your not trolling but you caught fish? That would mean you are trolling? Or do you have a point to the whole cut and paste post?

Not sure how you read things, but he didn't seem discomforted at all in replying to the reporter and was just pointing out how easy it is to control things without actually having to be at the center.

Now if you got us something like Kofi continued to keep skiing after being told what had happened. Good luck finding that.

In any case, the American press is lying about US aid.

Didn't they up the aid to 350 million after the 35 was pittance compared to everyone else who was donating. It will probably be in leaflets saying "You shouldn't of annoyed God and he wouldn't of done it to you" :rolleyes:

TomF

I suppose what surprised me is the reaction that points the finger at George W. Bush in every case: i.e. "Kofi was on the ski slopes"..."Yes, but Bush was on vacation in Texas!" Can't a comment about Kofi be made without comparing him to another world figure? Must every thread on this board be tortured into a rave about Bush and American duplicity?

Hobbes

Ok there is a slight difference.

a) Someone taking a short holiday skiing, who then turns it into a work holiday due to a national disaster.

b) Someone who takes a few months of a holiday and is given documents during those holidays that could of stopped a national disaster had he of acted on it then.

Unless your claiming Kofi had prior knowledge of the earthquake and didn't act on it?

smiaras

This post has been deleted.

sovtek

smiaras wrote:

This post has been deleted.

Crap someone beat me to it.

gandalf

Errr weren't George Jr and Tony Blair on holiday as well.

TomF whats your point. Another pointless and weak thread Tom. I am getting sick of these!

Zombrex

TomF wrote:

I suppose what surprised me is the reaction that points the finger at George W. Bush in every case: i.e. "Kofi was on the ski slopes"..."Yes, but Bush was on vacation in Texas!" Can't a comment about Kofi be made without comparing him to another world figure? Must every thread on this board be tortured into a rave about Bush and American duplicity?

Hate to agree with TomF (really really hate to agree ) but after just watching the pretty good OutFoxed documentary I think it is important that people stay "fair and balanced" and on the issue of the original post.

What ever point you think TomF was making about this to me it is pretty clear that he should not have been on vacation at a time like this, even simply as a very bad PR move if he actually could do everything he need to do from where he was. People are dying around the world and he is skiing. Now I have respect for The SG, I think he does a good job, but this was not a good thing to do, and has been pointed out if George Bush did it people would be up in arms.

If you agree that it looked really bad say so. If you don't think it was really bad say so based on the actual even not the actions of other political leaders.

Moriarty

Afaik Bush did do it. He didn't make a speech until the 30/31st iirc, because he didn't want to interupt his holiday.

Further, who the hell cares what the perceptions are. If he did the job, then there's no problem beyond a non-story. The people who want to deride the UN will deride it just like before, no matter what the facts are.

Hobbes

Wicknight wrote:

What ever point you think TomF was making about this to me it is pretty clear that he should not have been on vacation at a time like this, even simply as a very bad PR move if he actually could do everything he need to do from where he was. People are dying around the world and he is skiing.

Please show me where he was skiing after getting to work where he was. This is what the US newspapers are trying to imply but I can't find it. The holiday ended when the disaster started, he just didn't move from his location.

Btw, the only newspaper I can find this reporters comments on is newsmax.

TomF

Apparently there was a "secret" meeting in New York City just recently with Kofi in attendance to discuss his performance as Secretary-General and why he is in such trouble with the U.S. leadership. It appears that recent U.S. criticism is based upon a perception that he was trying to influence the election in a sovereign (and host) member nation of the U.N. I'd say he will soon be issued a golden parachute.

"Their larger argument, according to participants, addressed two broad needs. First, they said, Mr. Annan had to repair relations with Washington, where the Bush administration and many in Congress thought he and the United Nations had worked against President Bush's re-election. Second, he had to restore his relationship with his own bureaucracy, where many workers said privately that his office protected high-level officials accused of misconduct.

In the week after the session, Mr. Annan sought and obtained a meeting with Condoleezza Rice, the nominee for secretary of state. United Nations officials said afterward that it was an encouraging meeting.
...
The United Nations faced charges of corruption in the oil-for-food program in Iraq, evidence that blue-helmeted peacekeepers in Congo had run prostitution rings and raped women and teenage girls, and formal motions of no confidence in the organization's senior management from staff unions."

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/03/international/03nations.html

Sparks

Ah, the New York Times, that bastion of international journalistic balance :rolleyes:
(Tom, you do know that the SG doesn't answer to the US, right?)

Hobbes

While the congo thing is a mess, the oil for food program is probably something the US shouldn't be harping on about. They shut pretty quick about the french profitting from it when it was realised it was a french subsidary of Halliburton listed as one of the companies abusing it.

Simple fact is the US doesn't like the UN because it is probably the only thing standing in its way from doing anything it wants carte blanche*. So best to belittle it, after all it worked for the French. I'm sure the new organisation will be called "United Freedom" or something like that.

* US can do pretty much what it wants, but tries to preach moral high ground in doing it. Hard to preach it when major bodies are pointing out your clear breaches of human rights and international law.

David Office

Wicknight wrote:

Hate to agree with TomF (really really hate to agree ) but after just watching the pretty good OutFoxed documentary I think it is important that people stay "fair and balanced" and on the issue of the original post.

What ever point you think TomF was making about this to me it is pretty clear that he should not have been on vacation at a time like this, even simply as a very bad PR move if he actually could do everything he need to do from where he was. People are dying around the world and he is skiing. Now I have respect for The SG, I think he does a good job, but this was not a good thing to do, and has been pointed out if George Bush did it people would be up in arms.

If you agree that it looked really bad say so. If you don't think it was really bad say so based on the actual even not the actions of other political leaders.

Bad bad bad message to send to the nations. This is the biggest disaster to hit the world in a long time - perhaps ever. This is bread and butter stuff for the SG. I dont think that Bush should be included in this conversation - this relates to the UN of which most (maybe all) of the affected countries are members of. The SG should be on the ground in the region!!!

Zombrex

Hobbes wrote:

Please show me where he was skiing after getting to work where he was. This is what the US newspapers are trying to imply but I can't find it. The holiday ended when the disaster started, he just didn't move from his location.

Btw, the only newspaper I can find this reporters comments on is newsmax.

I am not saying he was skiing, I am saying that that is what it looked like. In this modern age it is probably perfectly possible for him to temperarly do his job anywhere in the world. The issue here isn't if he could do his job, it is the perception that he stayed on holiday for 3 days after it became clear that this was a massive massive event.

Redleslie2

Early contender for most useless thread of the year. All it needs is for someone to bring in WW2 and the usual slaggings of the shinners (and maybe the French) and it's a cert.

David Office

I heard Gerry Adams was skiing too - in France!!

Victor

TomF wrote:

The United Nations faced charges of corruption in the oil-for-food program in Iraq, evidence that blue-helmeted peacekeepers in Congo had run prostitution rings and raped women and teenage girls, and formal motions of no confidence in the organization's senior management from staff unions."

... and the 1,500 people UN troops killed in Somalia in one day... oops that was Delta Force and the Rangers.