Good Friday Agreement

Clintons Cat

Can i ask you if you consider the good friday agreement to be a progressive move towards a lasting settlement in the north. Or a stalling measure on the side of the london and dublin governments trying to accomodate as pragmatically as possible two irreconcilable diametrically opposed factions of their respective communities.
Power Sharing Assembly, Good Thing Or Bad Thing?

Clintons Cat

btw the spell checker exploded when i submitted the above post.

Celt

To be honest cat, a bit of both

bugler

Well I'm sorry to say that I think it's doomed.The percentage of unionists who support it now is often portrayed at different levels,but I'd say it is at best 50%. This is not nearly enough.Aswell as this,the UDA is terrorising and pipe bombing Catholic families like theres no tommorrow, and the Unionists insist on the IRA's guns being given up.I thought the main problem Unionists had with Republican weapons was that they were killing and wounding.Apparently not.The biggest problem is that they are lying underground somewhere.Thats all bullsh*t.The reason they want guns given up is that they can then go to the unionist community at large and claim to have defeated the IRA,and they'd be right,it would be a shattered organisation.This means essentially that loyalists would have nothing to "fear" should the Agreement break down.After all,Cathloics do not in general trust the RUC (NIPS) or the army to protect them or be impartial.And who can blame them? Once(repeatedly??) bitten, twice shy.
Hate to be pessimistic(and I'd love to be wrong)but basically, the Good Friday Agreement is gone down the sh|tter.

DadaKopf

it's great that nobody down here cares too much about the north. In fact, many middle class people in the north dont care much either - they want to get past all the crap and enjoy life.

If you ax me, the best thing that could happen up there is if everyone started making money. It would erode differences and resentment and create a driving apathy that would pacify the whole area.

That depends on the right state institutions being in place (laws, committes etc.) but that's that Northern Ireland needs. They should take an example from the apathetic south!

Clintons Cat

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by bugler:
oooops.That "UK" didnt come up under your name before,i swear!</font>

No offence taken.I updated my profile.

bugler

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Baz_:
Why I think its time wasting is that if/when they are handed over, the IRA won't have been defeated, they just won't have any more weapons for at most a couple of weeks if the need more.</font>

Not likely.The IRA are still using the weapons Gaddafi gave them,all two tonnes of them.They cannot afford as a militant organisation to give these up.And as for their semtex,not a chance.Where will the new weapons come from? Re-arming the IRA is not exactly a proposition likely to attract many candidates.It has never been so unfashionable to support conflict in N.I.

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">The violence has to stop though but still it hasn't and that in my opinion is the biggest problem facing the peace process.</font>

Partly right I believe.I think thats a symptom rather than the problem, though.The fact that support for the agreement among unionists is at an all time low is the main problem.
I just can't see either side giving way on the de-commisioning issue.

Clintons Cat

there are signals coming from David Trimble
that there is signs of progress/reconcilliation/fudge on the decommissioning issue.If he can pull it off without splitting his party is another matter entirely.
http://www.nics.gov.uk/press/ofmdfm/010116e-ofmdfm.htm

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/opinion/2000/0320/edi1.htm
http://www.ni-assembly.gov.uk/index.htm

The NI Assembly may not be perfect but the alternative...

bugler

Sorry Clinton,I'm not sure where your from, mabe US maybe Ireland, but my point is this.
I think the replies(or lack thereof) to this thread are evidence enough that southern Irish people don't really care about the north.Not in the sense they couldn't give a toss if everyone up there died,but it highlights the sense of removal from northern politics most people in the republic feel.Look at my Taliban thread,look how many replies that drew,and the arguments it sparked, and here a thread concerning our own relatives(in many cases) and country is practically ignored.Says it all really....

bugler

oooops.That "UK" didnt come up under your name before,i swear!

Baz_

hmmm that is pretty pessimistic alright. I for one think that somebody is stalling for time by insisting that weapons be handed over, but that's on track now so it shouldn't be too long now. Why I think its time wasting is that if/when they are handed over, the IRA won't have been defeated, they just won't have any more weapons for at most a couple of weeks if the need more.

The violence has to stop though but still it hasn't and that in my opinion is the biggest problem facing the peace process.

bugler

no one cares it seems.

FreaK_BrutheR

Real IRA/32 county Soverienty are holding a general meeting in Dublin soon, can't mind when, if anyone's interested I'll post dates etc later. There's obviously alot of controversy over the whole thing not least by the victims of, and relatives of the Omagh bomb. Alot of people are travelling down to protest and see how many people have the audacity to show up at it when they know their victims and victims families will be present and to press the Gardai into some sort of action again. What you all think of this? Personally I think freedom of expression/speech etc. issues have to be taken into consideration. But are these people by default criminal? I mean during internment IRA being mentioned by an individual meritted locking up, albeit by a gestapesque controlling force. What you think should be done? Anything?

(emotion is high)

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http://run.to/pile

Megatron

From what i can see the unionists are insisting that the IRA had over there guns,
that is not goinging to happen.
And everytime the news is on it's always the IRA to hand over the guns noth both sides of the paramilitries.
I don't see anyone releasing there grip on the one thing that has got them this far. ( you can disagree but it IS the truth) and i do not agree with how they got where they are today. It just P1sses me off that everything has come to a grinding halt, partly because of the forth coming elections in both Ireland and England.
I really don't see anything resolution apart from what was said earlyer, about the North making Money, but there will always be the hardcore people who no matter what will always find some reasone to fight the other side !!!

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No !!!!! I will crush you with my Bare hands

bugler

They can't do anything really.You can show up and try the guilt trip all you like, but to be honest I think its just a sign of frustration on behalf of the relatives,which is completely understandable.
I remember reading about this type of thing before,at these meetings they have guest speakers on topics such as socialism,revolution etc. So its not like they plan where they will bomb next in these meetings.I can picture myself being interested in some of the topics that might be discussed,and believe me I'm no R-IRA sympathiser by any means, but what would happen me if I turned up at one? ( I probably wouldn't anyway but still..)
I don't see what purpose it serves to be honest.I know its not easy, and I don't know how I'd react if I was a relative of one of the victims but I think they should try and let it go.

bugler

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Megatron:

And everytime the news is on it's always the IRA to hand over the guns not both sides of the paramilitries.
</font>

Well loyalists don't really have a problem with decommissioning.If the IRA gave up guns then they would too,otherwise they would be completely shown up and the wrath faced wouldn't be worth it.They would give up the guns after the IRA for the same reason they called the ceasefire after the IRA.