Pregnant ex

irishmankiid

 I’m just looking for some advice, my ex girlfriend and I split up about 4 months ago I know she is 5 months pregnant through friends, she believes me to be somewhat of a narcissist I believe our relationship was just toxic due to her controlling nature which led to me becoming resentful and disrespecting the relationship which eventually led to a the relationship breakdown. I sent some messages after the breakup which I do regret the usuals “I can’t live without you” “the one for you never leaves” and that I’d call to her house to fix it and I wasn’t worried about the police. After about a week I left it alone the damage had been done I gave her a ring during the relationship which I attached sentimental meaning too and emailed maybe a month later to post it as we had agreed and she got someone to give it into my workplace (childish on both our behalf’s I know)Since the breakup I’ve started the gym therapy and a new job, when I heard she was pregnant I sent her an email basically saying I was aware and that I would like to be involved in the child’s life and that I would be seeking legal advice she did not respond. I’m just confused as where to go next as the child is unborn I’m not sure if you have any rights this being the case until the actual birth anyone able to help me out? I am of the belief because my counsellor said im a people pleaser and I believe her to be too we just got so caught up in trying to please the other we just forgot our own needs really she obviously wants nothing to do with me which I respect that’s anyones right and I have not contacted her since. There was no physical, sexual, I don’t even think verbal abuse I can’t remember raising my voice in the year and a half we were together all the fights were over text does anyone have any advice/have you been through a similar situation?

I have no previous convictions and a steady job

tinytobe

That's a difficult one to give an answer to as there are so many parts to this.

Legally you would be the father, that is if the child is really yours, I'd say and this would mean certain rights as a father in terms of visitation and spending time but also certain responsibilities, mostly financial I take it.

But then there would most likely be the problem when a couple drifts apart, moving away, taking jobs or opportunities in different cities, and even different countries.

Princess Calla

Would you not arrange for a face to face conversation!

I'll be honest and say if I was pregnant and my ex started talking about legal advice etc my heckles would well and truly be raised.

I do find it weird that she never contacted you about the pregnancy. While I hate when people say "Paternity test" , in this case, the fact she hasn't approached you and she's doing it (as far as you know) on her own, I would question if you are the dad.

So until you get paternity test results I'm not sure what advice can be given!

The legislation for unmarried dad's that aren't living with the mum, isn't great.

I think the website treoir might give you more up to date relevant information.

irishmankiid

there’s no way to get a face to face conversation i literally cannot even get a text back, like I say I believe she thinks I’m a narcissist which I don’t believe nor does my counsellor I’m just at a loss really I will try treoir Monday, thanks calla

Tippbhoy1

Regarding access to the child, you have rights. However your rights will be secondary to what are perceived the needs of the child and also the ability of the mother to spin things should she so wish to be difficult.
Three things for a father, right of guardianship, access, and maintenance. All three can be agreed via court application should the mother not wish to engage with you. Even if amicable, it would be sensible to cover off guardianship after the child is born. This gives you a right to a say in the child’s life in terms of key decisions such as religion, schooling etc. the court will prioritise maintenance over access as this will be viewed as in the best interests of the child.

Wait until the child is born, consult a family solicitor and get moving with proceedings if it’s a case you want to exercise your rights. You should demand a paternity test as part of the process, if she disputes you are the father it will have to happen regardless.

Be aware even if she ignores you for now, she could come back at a later date looking for maintenance, even years later, after excluding you in the first place. On the flip side, even after court ordered access she could continue to make life difficult for you eg child is sick, child doesn’t want to see you, poisoning the child against you, and many other much worse things.

The best course of action is amicable discussion and agreement way in advance. Disagreement via legal routes will just have solicitors licking their chops. Easier said than done of course.

89897

Can you be absolutly sure the child is yours? First and foremost you need to seek proper professional advice and then look into getting a paternity test.

heretothere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122264381#Comment_122264381

The word narcissist is thrown around so many of the women's groups I'm in, I really don't think anyone actually knows what it mean.

Do you want to be involved in the child's life? If you don't pay your way but leave them alone. If you do, you need try and get face to face with her, use an intermediatory if you need to even a counsellor. When the child is very small your access will be very limited and you should respect that. The more respectful you are the more she should see that what you are doing is in the childs best interest.

Running in saying your rights and wanting the child 50/50 isn't going to be helpful. But saying you want to be there to support her and be part of your childs life should be a good start

spaceHopper

Leave her alone, let her be. Look back over your post.
When you broke up, you called her, you emailed her....
When you found out she is pregnant, you emailed her, not saying you want to be there for the baby but, I WANT TO BE IN ITS LIFE AND IF YOU SAY NO I'LL SUE.

She pregnant, she's focusing on herself and the baby, you are causing problems for her, you are stressing her out.

Let her be, let her have the baby and then contact her as say sorry I was such a prick, I'd like to be involved in the baby's life, how can we work that out. Be gentle with her not hard because she will push back against that. She'd be right to she has to protect the child from a guy who's been aggressive and scaring her. Put yourself in her shoes

Ezeoul

If she doesn't want to talk to you now, then leave her be. She has enough to be dealing with, with the pregnancy and preparing for the birth.

Once baby is here safely, give her a few weeks to recover, and then you can try contacting her again.

Then, if necessary, you can get the legal ball rolling.

Raichų

as far as I know because you were not married you actually have no right to anything whatsoever without either going to court or having her sign guardianship forms.

GerardKeating

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122301884#Comment_122301884

The only "right" the OP has is not to be listed as father without agreement/consent.

Ezeoul

Normally, births have to be registered within three months. If there is a dispute over paternity, up to twelve months.

This is one of those things that will have to be dealt with after the baby is born safely.

tinytobe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122264414#Comment_122264414

The issue will also be the law. The law doesn't treat mother and father as equal even though everyone will say it is. Father is always the "evil one" who has to pay regardless, mother can do what she whats. Courts are always favouring mother, and less the father.

I honestly have only irony for this one, and for the rest, I don't envy your situation at all. It's the kind of fatherhood no man would ever want. Chances are you have no influence over key decisions such as religion and schooling if the mother refuses to give you access to the child and even in the case if, chances are not too good that you might agree with the mother on anything.

Also the OP doesn't know for certain that the ex is actually pregnant. She could also be playing a game. Women with evil minds do that.

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122262728#Comment_122262728

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122264414#Comment_122264414

There are no legal rights granted to an unmarried father unless he is both listed on the birth cert (which requires both him & the mother to acknowledge his paternity of the child in question) and if he has lived with the child's mother for 12 months in a row, including at least 3 months with the mother and child following the child's birth. If he is only named on the birth cert but hasn't satisfied the second criteria, he does not automatically have legal rights over the child and would have to either go through the courts or sign a statutory declaration which is also signed by the mother.

From what the OP has said, the ex is not chasing him for support and is not looking for him to pay anything. She can not name him on the birth cert without him either attending with her to register the birth or getting him to sign certain forms. So it's not like she can just stick him down when the time comes & chase him for money.

Look OP - there's no proof here that your ex wants you involved in her childs life or that you are indeed the father. We can't judge here whether what she said about you is true but one thing I will say - no where in your post did you mention anything about her feelings on the child or in fact there wasn't much consideration to the child itself. It was all about what you wanted. That says a lot. If you do want to be a parent to this child (if you are in fact the father), then you need to be putting the child first & not you or your rights. That means trying to establish a good rapport with your ex and maybe enquiring after her health considering she is currently growing said child.

Norrie Rugger Head

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122302545#Comment_122302545

Our family law is broken in so many ways.

I mean was horrendous 20 years ago when a friend of mine nearly broke himself to get custody. To get to 2024 with not one politician having the courage to tackle it (and hearing some actually hinder it) is just saddening

OP: You will have to wait until the child is born and, then, be prepared for a long long battle

tinytobe

It's not known if the OP is really the father, or if the ex is really pregnant at all.

Maybe the relationship wasn't going well, and she was already in bed with the next guy and doesn't want to admit that. All possible.

Hannibal_Smith

Also the OP doesn't know for certain that the ex is actually pregnant. She could also be playing a game. Women with evil minds do that.

Maybe the relationship wasn't going well, and she was already in bed with the next guy and doesn't want to admit that. All possible.

@tinytobe that's enough with the disparaging marks against this woman. You know nothing about her. If you cannot offer advice without slinging insults please do not post.

HS

HildaOgdenx

Mod - Please bear in mind that PI is a not a discussion forum.

As per the charter, PI is an advice forum. Posters are required to offer advice or opinion to the OP in their replies.

Thanks.

Raichų

OP I have to wonder if there’s a part of you that’s just trying to do the “right” thing? The problem is she’s not interested in having a relationship with you one way or another, clearly and the fact she personally did not tell you about the pregnancy suggests she really doesn’t want anything to do with you.

My advice is to just express your willingness to be a part of their life (the child) when it’s born, explain you are happy to support them and help however you can. But you need to be aware that you have no automatic right and dragging the mother through the courts may not be the wisest move. If she makes you out to be an awful B word to a judge he/she may refuse any access entirely and perhaps bar you from being near either of them.

I would be very mindful of the messages you are sending also. I mean it wasn’t the best idea if you ask me to in the same breath as asking about the pregnancy mentioning you’re seeking legal advice. You are trying to build a relationship with this person whereby you can have access to (what you think is) your child. Getting litigious or even hinting at it is just not a good start. It may also be worth approaching close friends or family to see if they have any insight or could they speak to her on your behalf.

As has been mentioned also there’s the potential it just isn’t your child but that’s another matter. I suppose you should ask yourself are you doing this because you want to be a part of the child’s life or are you doing this because you either

1. Think it’s the right and proper thing to do
2. You think you can get back with the mother this way

Just be aware you’re on the back foot here and you have not much going for you in terms of custody and access as you were not together very long and she’s spent the majority of the assumed pregnancy separated from you.

Raichų

also I would not advise you to harass the mother, her friends or family about this matter. It will just push her further away.

Tippbhoy1

Right now the only comfort for the OP here should be the fact that he can go to court to exercise his rights should he so wish, which based on his description sounds the most likely outcome. I don’t know why you are talking about unmarried people in relationships and the process there which is not pertinent to the OP, automatic rights which I have never talked about, birth certs and the like, it’s all irrelevant to him if he wants to go to court. It is also irrelevant if the mother wants to chase him for maintenance at any point in the next 18 years.

OP - you can go to court to get access to the child and guardianship, which is very unlikely to be declined but will almost certainly require a maintenance commitment. If paternity needs to be proven, it can be arranged by the courts, and can be at the request of either party. I hope that gives you the comfort you need to hear.

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122307777#Comment_122307777

I don't know if you're just being willfully ignorant or just ignorant. The entire piece around unmarried fathers directly would relate to him. As he is unmarried & claiming to be the father. He does not get any automatic rights as such. And yes he could go through the courts but there is a high chance that the ex could say it's not his. It would be a long & costly battle I would presume and I think the OP really needs to think about the overall picture.

Also the courts thing isn't exercising his rights, it's applying for them. He has no automatic legal rights at all.

OP I would caution jumping to the court aspect - instead maybe trying to engage from a much more civil space with your ex in regards the child and your ex's health and go from there.

marilynrr

It was a bad move going straight in saying you're seeking legal advice, she was probably terrified of you contacting her about it and then you went in with that.

like I say I believe she thinks I’m a narcissist which I don’t believe nor does my counsellor

It's great that you at least considered it. Maybe you lack self awareness and your counsellor can only go off your version of events though. My ex is an absolute nightmare but I guarantee a therapist wouldn't label him as anything except amazing and lovely because that's how he paints himself 😂 and he's very believable.

But I'm not saying you are either, you said you believe that you and your ex are both people pleasers, sometimes two people really bring the worst out in each other in a relationship and it's toxic but if you are both two decent people who were wrong together then there will be a chance for a civil co-parenting relationship.

Yes, you are correct, you have no rights now, get onto citizens information and they'll tell you when exactly you will be able to start going through the courts if it comes to that. I've no idea about the timeline or when you could expect overnights etc with a small baby but presumably overnights wouldn't be for a while.

You really need to try to be as civil as possible with your ex when you do get to talk to her. Don't be banging on about your rights. And if it's not until after the baby is born then please, please, please don't forget that you are dealing with a postpartum woman who is most likely exhausted and massively sleep deprived, and she will have a huge connection and bond with the baby and he/she will feel like a physical extension of her… If you're only allowed to see the baby for a short time try your very best to make it all go smoothly, you want to show her that you'll be a positive in the babies life and that to your ex you're going to be a supportive co-parent and a help, not a hindrance.

Did your ex get on with anyone in your family?

irishmankiid

Thanks for the advice guys appreciate all of you. Heard nothing back respecting her right to no contact I did mention in the email I sent that I just wanted us to have some relationship for the child nothing romantic, she is definitely pregnant and has told everyone I’m the father but just not me I’ll give her time like you guys say she could be high risk or anything don’t wanna draw any unnecessary stress thanks again!

Tippbhoy1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122309074#Comment_122309074

You continue to talk on about stuff I’ve never said in some sort of an effort to prove your original point, which was irrelevant in the first place as you were providing advice on your experience in an existing relationship which is not comparable. Three different people here including myself have advised your advice is incorrect and is giving the wrong information to the OP based on where he finds himself right now.

In a final effort to explain this to you, and provide a relevant example to the OP, I can confirm I have never been on my child’s birth cert, was not in a relationship with her mother when she was born, have been through the courts, have proof of paternity, have guardianship and cyclical agreed access, and pay regular maintenance. The child’s mother was unsupportive of all of this. The OP has a right to go to court and demand all the above. Best of luck to him with it.

Ezeoul

No, I applied (and was successful) in winning a maintenance order before I had the birth cert amended to include the father's details. That came later (and was done without his consent) .

There is a different legal avenue in place for this, (actually, two) one being Declaration of Parentage, the other being use of a Maintenance, Access or other Court Order, and it is still in place.

(Notably, a father can use the same avenues to add his name, if a mother refuses or declares father is unknown).

By the way, this is not about mothers rights or fathers rights but about the child's right to an accurate record of their birth. A birth cert actually belongs to them, after all.

You are putting far more legal weight solely on a name on a birth cert than it actually carries. I don't mean to disrespect you, and I don't know who was advising you, but they were incorrect on many points.

I'm on my phone in the waiting room for a hospital appt right now, so excuse the brevity of my reply.

(eta) Apologies, OP - this thread is meant for addressing your personal case. You don't need to worry about this stuff yet.

HildaOgdenx

Mod - Closing temporarily.

As there seems to be a discussion to be had, I will split some posts into a separate forum. Once again a reminder that PI is an advice forum, not a discussion forum. See my note above.

OP, I will reopen your thread asap.

HildaOgdenx

Mod - Discussion thread opened in Parenting. Thread reopened.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058357637/legal-rights-to-child