Good fences make good neighbours

anndub

We removed a very large shrub from our garden last summer. It had been planted inside our property rather than on the boundary line with our neighbour. Our neighbour has a hedge on his side also planted in his own property rather than on the boundary line.

It looks like the bush we removed had grown through part of his hedge significantly and in removing it we have caused one section of his hedging to sag towards his garden.

A fairly straightforward question in that this section of my neighbours hedging requires some kind of support structure or "fixing" so am I responsible for paying for all or some of this?

The houses are around 60 years old and the boundary is clearly marked by a very low wooden fence.

Yeah Right

in removing it we have caused one section of his hedging to sag towards his garden.

You damaged his hedge and are asking, with a straight face, if you are liable to have it fixed? What sort of an answer are you expecting here?

Ask yourself, if he had removed his hedge and made a balls of your one so it was falling into your garden, would you expect him to make it right?

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115395#Comment_122115395

I dont believe the OP "damaged" anything. The neighbours hedge was relying on the OPs bush to stay upright, I dont see any obligation on the OP to maintain that bush or provide alternative support.

10-10-20

If the shrub had died of it's own accord and caused his hedge to sag, would you be liable to repair the hedge on his side? I would think not.

Yeah Right

OP did something that caused the situation they now find themselves in.

Their actions, their onus to rectify it, IMO.

elperello

He should have cut back your shrub when it started growing into his hedge.

What remedy is your neighbour suggesting at this point ?

If it's agreeable to you and not overly expensive it might be worth considering in order to maintain goodwill.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115410#Comment_122115410

The OP isn't in any situation, two trees grew into each other, one is no longer there and the remaining now has a sag.

The neighbour can choose to prop it up with a stake, like you would do for any other tree that starts to sag, or they do nothing and it sorts itself out, or breaks.

Nothing to do with the OP at all.

Ted222

The OP would always have had responsibility for any impact of a shrub/ tree originating in their own property.

If for example, a tree fell into a neighbouring property, the owner of the property in which the tree originated would be responsible for any consequential damage.

The same principle applies to the OP’s shrub.

anndub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115515#Comment_122115515

does it though? Yet he's not obliged to come into my property and trim the hedging, that he has planned and that encroaches beyond my boundary? That is my responsibility.

I mean according to this logic I was not really entitled to remove the bush on my property. From a legal perspective

anndub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115395#Comment_122115395

well no I wouldn't. I'd say that was unfortunate and fix it myself. If I thought it were a clear case I wouldn't be asking this question.

I'm not really looking for a lesson in morality here. I posted in the legal discussions category for solid advice as regards the legality around ownership/responsibility of hedging

Yeah Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115468#Comment_122115468

Why is one "no longer there"? Who removed it, causing the issue and, therefore, being responsible for the current state of affairs?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115769#Comment_122115769

You're more altruistic than most. I also suspect you're not being entirely truthful here.

If you'd done nothing, there would be no problem. You did something, caused the problem, and onus is on you to rectify it, IMO.

Could you technically claim that it's their problem to fix and nothing to do with you…..? Maybe.

Is it worth potentially falling out with your neighbour for decades over the sake of €50 worth of repairs…..? Definitely not.

I'm not trying to give morality lessons here, or anything of the sort. I'm speaking practically. What's your long term goal with the boundary? Are you putting in a new fence? New hedges? If you're going to be installing something else in it's place, then what's the problem with fixing the sagging hedge (that you caused, remember?) at the same time?

Or is the plan to use his old hedge as the new boundary? Which is a) a bit cheeky and b) not fit for purpose now that it's falling into his garden.

Ted222

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115761#Comment_122115761

His obligation is to ensure that his tree/shrubs don’t have the potential to cause damage. By allowing them to grow into a neighbouring property, he’s somewhat exposed in this regard.

Similarly, you are responsible for the impact of any growth originating from your property. You were wise to remove any overgrowth into other properties but if you’ve caused any damage or harm in doing so and if the neighbour insists that you make good the impact, you probably should.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115515#Comment_122115515

100% if they had damaged it during removal of it, but arguably they didnt. Their shrub was growing into the neighbours property and they rectified that issue.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115804#Comment_122115804

Is a leaning shrub "an issue" though?

The cause of the issue was the neighbour not maintaining their hedge so that it grew on its own terms and didnt rely on the OPs shrub. OP is free to remove things growing on their own property so long as they dont damage anything that is not their in the process. The hedge is not damaged.

anndub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115804#Comment_122115804

I suppose the neighbour could also ask himself if it's worth falling out over a tiny section of hedging, couldn't he?

Cheeky considering an existing, established, 60 year old hedge as an adequate source of privacy? Now you've completely lost me. I suppose I better make him install a second wall out the back because he's been happy to rely on the wall I have built on my property.

the entire hedge is roughly 8 metres. It's a single section measuring around 1 metre that has sagged. We haven't managed a whole hedge

I think you've gone completely off the point.

Again, no interest in morality. Just legality/responsibility.

Yeah Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116034#Comment_122116034

Is a leaning shrub "an issue" though?

Yes. A hedge (not a shrub) sagging into a garden where once it stood straight is most definitely an issue. Not only is it unsightly, it makes the neighbour's garden smaller and could have a potential H&S impact if it's full of thorns or brambles etc.

The cause of the issue was the neighbour not maintaining their hedge so that it grew on its own terms and didnt rely on the OPs shrub.

Absolute poppycock. The cause of the issue was OP removing their shrub. If that didn't happen, there'd be no issue now.

OP is free to remove things growing on their own property so long as they dont damage anything that is not their in the process. The hedge is not damaged.

I disagree with this completely. The structural support of the hedge has been compromised by the OP's actions, nobody else. She caused the damage, it is hers to repair. Put yourself in the neighbour's shoes for a minute. If you came home from work and your once perfectly straight hedge was now falling into your garden because your wan next door (arguably) made a balls of their own work next door, would you really just handwave it away and take ownership of the situation? Anyone who says yes is a liar.

anndub

Simply removed a shrub from within my own property. I mean if removing items from your garden that you no longer wish to have is considered "making a balls of it" fair enough but it's news to me.

Thanks to these who gave measured responses and apologies to those who felt triggered and gave overly emotive responses - I'll likely ignore those as I'm not invested enough to get all worked up. I'll probably just get my husband to put in a couple of stakes and prop it up so we can all move on with our lives

Pod123

I often look at these topics about different things that has happened with neighbours here on boards and the first thing that always crosses my mind,why not go out and talk to the neighbour about what ever has happened and see if a solution can be got by both neighbours.

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116108#Comment_122116108

"Makes the neighbours garden smaller and could have a potential H&S issue"?

If the neighbour has a dangerous hedge due to thorns and brambles then its hardly suddenly a safe hedge if its standing a bit straighter? Unless the hedge is now pouncing on unsuspecting harden dwellers I think you are slightly over egging the pudding here.

If the neighbour had maintained their own hedge then it wouldnt now be sagging as it wouldnt have used the OPs shrub for support. Perhaps the OP should demand payment for structural services rendered over the last few years? Poppycock indeed.

The hedge is sagging, hedges and trees sag and need to be maintained. If the hedge is sagging into their garden then the neighbour is free to provide support for their hedge or they can trim the bits that are sagging and the hedge will fill in, as hedges do.

Then I guess call me a liar gov. If my hedge was leaning on my neighbours wall and they removed their wall and my hedge falls over, thats my hedges problem. My hedge was clearly not self supporting and in fact was a potential H&S issue, especially if it had thorns or brambles. If I remove the hedge and their wall falls down, thats their problem.

What if the hedge was leaning against a trailer or caravan in the neighbours garden and they decided to move it and the hedge sagged? Its a nonsense to suggest that this is the OPs fault or that they are to blame.

The neighbour would have a case if the OP had damaged their hedge causing it to sag, clearly this is not the case. The hedge was not structurally sound so its the neighbours problem to deal with.

Yeah Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116098#Comment_122116098

I suppose the neighbour could also ask himself if it's worth falling out over a tiny section of hedging, couldn't he?

You're the transgressor here. He has every right to take the hump over your actions and failure to redress the problems that YOU caused.

Cheeky considering an existing, established, 60 year old hedge as an adequate source of privacy? Now you've completely lost me. I suppose I better make him install a second wall out the back because he's been happy to rely on the wall I have built on my property.

Cheeky considering the fact that your attempts to increase the usable space in your garden has resulted in him having less usable space in his own garden. You're also looking for ways to abdicate responsibility for your actions, which is also cheeky.

I think you've gone completely off the point.

Because I'm not saying what you want to hear. I've done nothing but stay exactly on point, but you don't wanna hear the truth. That's okay, happens on Boards all the time. People come on here looking to have their views validated and get the hump when others point out their shortcomings.

Again, no interest in morality. Just legality/responsibility.

Again, I'm not giving any lessons in morality. You are responsible for what happened. You need to take responsibility for your actions instead of looking for a way to weasel out of doing the riught thing.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116511#Comment_122116511

Simply removed a shrub from within my own property. I mean if removing items from your garden that you no longer wish to have is considered "making a balls of it" fair enough but it's news to me.

Arguably made a balls of it is exactly what you did.

I can simply remove slates from my roof all I want but if, during the process, I manage to fcuk up the neighbour's gutter then that's on me.

Thanks to these who gave measured responses and apologies to those who felt triggered and gave overly emotive responses - I'll likely ignore those as I'm not invested enough to get all worked up.

Translation: "thank you to everyone who said exactly what I wanted to hear and fake apologies to everyone who didn't follow the script, I'm now going to accuse them of being overly emotive and triggered because that's how I feel, and I'll pretend to ignore them, even though my solution will be to do exactly what they said and remedy the situation I caused in the first place".

More power to your neighbour, you sound like an absolute dose to be living beside.

Toby22

interesting replies. I have a 5 foot hedge in my front garden which I would like to cut down. I mentioned it my neighbour and she nearly had a fit as it is a support for her climbing plants. I didn’t bother in the end.

Havenowt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122117527#Comment_122117527

She needs to install timber trellis for her climbing plants.

magicbastarder

If neighbour A has plants which are dependent on plants in neighbour B's garden, surely that's up to neighbour A to rectify? Otherwise A is holding B hostage as to what B can do in their own garden?

GreeBo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122119692#Comment_122119692

No, its 100% B's problem as otherwise B could be leaving vicious climbers on A's lawn, which would be a trip hazard….or something.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116694#Comment_122116694

If the neighbour had maintained their own hedge then it wouldnt now be sagging as it wouldnt have used the OPs shrub for support. Perhaps the OP should demand payment for structural services rendered over the last few years? Poppycock indeed.

From the OP

It looks like the bush we removed had grown through part of his hedge significantly

It's the OPs bush that entered the neighbours garden and grew into their hedge, nowhere does the OP say that the neighbours hedge crossed the property line. The OP let their bush get out of control and it grew through the neighbours hedge, when they removed the bush they damaged the neighbours hedge on the neighbours side of the property line so the OP needs to rectify the damage they caused.