Tell me what to buy - Light van

HazeDoll

In the next 12 months I'm going to start getting serious about switching to an EV or PHEV. I'm starting to realise what a steep learning curve it will be.

I currently drive a Kangoo and I'm looking for something in roughly the same category. I'll probably end up buying a new vehicle but I'd really rather go second-hand. I like the Ford Transit EV but it's a bit big for my modest needs. I don't place any value on prestige or luxury where driving is concerned! I love my Kangoo but I have learned that the electrics on a Renault can be a bit tricksy and I don't know if I'd have much faith in a fully EV Renault.

I do a daily commute of roughly 50km round trip and the odd longer drive.

I rarely carry any serious weight in the cargo area of the van, in fact it's usually empty.

I've begun the process of installing solar at my house, if that's relevant.

Part of the reason I'm so uncertain about going electric is that this is a single-car household. I keep thinking that I need to know that in an emergency I can get into the van and drive to Dublin (250km) at the drop of a hat.

So… EV or PHEV? And which one?

User1998

Theres not much of a learning curve. You just get in and drive. Just do your research on real world range.

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122105406#Comment_122105406

Right so.

maidhc

I have a proace city. The electric one is about 10k more. You won’t make it back on running costs given they are as cheap as chips to run to start with.

There are no commercial phev options I know of. I think diesel is the only realistic option still for light commercials.

User1998

2022 electric Opel Combo seems to be around €6k more than diesel version. Based on 20,000km a year it would probably take less than 3 years before you start saving.

yermanthere

What kind of mileage/year do you do?

If it's 10k you'll be a while seeing the extra spend back tbh. Regarding the electrics of Renault, the EV part will be fine, but the " car" parts will still be Renault! EV battery and motors are more reliable than fuel system and engines.

So if you're doing tiny mileage, EV van could still be expensive unless you spot a bargain. But I wouldn't be worried about reliability.

AMKC

Look out for a second hand electric Maxus EV van.

Otherwise there is not really any cheap EV Vans.

Citroen and Opel probably offer the cheapest new EV Vans.

Ir3

You mention you dont carry much so is a Car van an option for you?

https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/peugeot/208/fpa/3628985?journey=Search

HazeDoll

Thanks for the suggestions.

I should probably clarify that I'm looking to switch to an EV because of the environmental benefits. If it saves me money in the long-run that's a bonus. Similarly, I'm not necessarily looking for the cheapest van available, I just don't want to make an expensive mistake.

I kept going back to look at the Transit PHEV but I've pretty much ruled it out. The more I think about it the less sense it makes, as this paragraph in this article https://www.parkers.co.uk/vans-pickups/best/plug-in-hybrid-vans/ suggests: The disadvantages of hybrid vans start with their complexity. This makes them more expensive to buy and heavier, which reduces payload – though 100% electric vans are inevitably heavier still as they have bigger batteries. If not used correctly, hybrid vans aren’t especially fuel-efficient, either. Using a petrol engine to drag around a reasonably big van is already a bad start even before you add the extra weight of the hybrid technology. 

A car-derived van doesn't appeal to me at all. I don't know why. I just… like vans.

I've tried asking people about their experiences of owning various EVs but I often think that people can be very reluctant to admit that their phone, their car or their children are a disappointment. "I've shelled out a lot of money, I'm committed to this, I can't possibly admit I don't particularly like it."

There are reasonably good deals available, like this https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/renault-kangoo-van-e-tech-auto-fully-electric/35228483?campaign=3

Here's what'll probably happen: I'll fall for the first EV Van I testdrive and that will be that.

loopymum

You mention single car household? Did you mean single vehicle?

If you have a car then you could probably go for a env200?

18 reg upwards has 40kw battery.

My 28kw ioniq is far more efficient than it though but it is grand for our round trips of 50kms

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122119382#Comment_122119382

Sorry, that wasn't very clear. Yes, this is a single vehicle household, it's just me and my van!

Redfox25

I think you might be best served sticking with what you have and wait another 12 to 18 months for new options in that space

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122128560#Comment_122128560

That was kind of the plan; wait until I have the solar in place and then go electric. It's really just that I know so little about it. For example, when I see people mentioning kws I am baffled. That's how little I know! I can understand the jargon of ICE vehicles but I'm lost when things get technical with EVs.

I have formed the impression, probably wrongly, that a lot of EV vans are really intended for city driving, which I do very little of. My very rural postman drives a diesel van but I see urban post vans are almost always EV.

I'm a little wary of making the leap and finding myself pootling along the motorway or navigating twisty country roads in a glorified milkfloat that was designed for urban traffic.

I have always bought ex-fleet vans but when the ex-fleet EVs come on the market will they be outdated technology with depleted battery capacity?

prawnsambo

What's your issue with understanding kilowatts? It's just a thousand watts. Kilowatt hours (kWh) is a measurement of electrical usage. If you run a fan heater that uses 2kW of power for an hour, you've used 2kWh. Your electricity provider charges for your usage in kilowatt hours. And an EV has a battery with a capacity of set amount of kWh. If it's a 50kWh battery and the car consumes 20kWh per 100km, you'll have a range of 250km; 50/20*100.

There are some EVs that are designed purely for urban driving, but they are very like ICE cars with the same design spec. Anything that can do more than 200km (arguably even 150) is pretty much fine for extra-urban driving. Post vans are pretty much the worst use case for any type of propulsion because of the constant stopping and starting. So diesel is still used for rural areas where it's a mix of short and long hops. They are phasing out the diesel though, something like 1/3rd of their fleet is electric.

I haven't changed my driving style since I went EV. I certainly wouldn't potter around like a milk float in a car with 476bhp and 350nM of torque. And still have a range of 350km+.

As for used EV vans, no idea. Like any used vehicle, you look into the details on a case by case basis when the time comes. But battery degradation is becoming less and less of an issue as time goes on.

MojoMaker

I smell a very subtle FUD post from the OP.

HazeDoll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122129691#Comment_122129691

I had to look that one up but I can promise you that's not what I'm doing. I'm in the process of installing solar with a view to getting an EV. I've made up my mind that my next van will be EV. I just don't want to make an expensive mistake because I don't know what I'm doing.

If my uncertainty and lack of knowledge has upset you I can only apologise. Maybe there's another thread somewhere you should focus your energies on, save yourself the discomfort of viewing this one.

Ir3

Recently added a Citroen e-dispatch to the fleet and have been very impressed by it. A nice drive with a range of roughly 250km so far, that’s with a lot of motorway driving.