Unexplained Use Jump - End of My Tether Here

happyplants

Hi all,

Would anyone have suggestions here? We were on Electric Ireland 24hour plan (non smart) on Smart Meter for 2021-October 2023. I'll spare you the spreadsheets, but the average daily use was 22 units a day. We switched to Energia Smart Data in October 2023 and "activated" the smart meter. It gives us TOU between 8am-11pm, 11pm-8am and a peak of 5-7pm in between. However, from the very day we started this, the average use moved from 22 units a day to 29.

We changed nothing. Nothing new, no patterns of use nothing.

Now, I understand Energia only take from the ESB and the HDF file from the ESB supports the present use, but what I just cannot get my head around is now entirely contemporaneous with shifting to time-of-use, and ever since, a very, very consistent average daily use has jumped on average 7kwh.

Obviously Energia say it can't be on them, and the ESB have to come out, but has anyone ever seen anything like this?

If there was something new were doing, I'd know. I've checked all pumps. All devices are on Tapo monitors and nothing has changed. Its shown how boring we are really, but all I know is that pre-activation our average was 22 a day over 2.5 years and since activation over 4.5 months its now 29.

I'm pulling my hair out.

10-10-20

In my experience the only reliable way of getting to the bottom of these types of cases is to carry out some measurement and analysis over time by looking at your baseload (the consumption overnight or when the house is empty) and also looking at device consumption during a normal day. Unfortunately in most cases it just turns out that either a routine or device was modified and the consumption then rose as a result. Do you have the overall house consumption reporting back to the Tapo device and does the Tapo result then correspond with the ESB reading?

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121788189#Comment_121788189

Thanks

Yes, you'd have to expect that no matter, I've missed something. The Tapos are only on 13amp socket devices, you know like fridges, freezers, PS5's, tvs, phone signal booster, quooker, dishwasher. I don't have them on the "fused" things like the cooker, hob or in the plant room. So, no I don't have overall house consumption monitored save aggregating what I can, but it leaves huge gaps. We are being told we now use about 1000kwh a month and I just can't account for it.

But what you're saying is actually a great start for me - as I didn't really think to focus exclusively on an empty base-load. I know the night time is quite high. Just looking at HDF for 17.2 between the 00.30 entry and 06.30 entry my read is about 3.1kwh. That may be high for a "dead" period. I don't know. I'll see what I can gather that way.

10-10-20

1000kWh/month is what my house consumes with an EV and a very dryer-happy wife as well as multiple IT devices, etc.

3.1kWh over 6hrs = 516Wh running continuously. My house would average from 280Wh to 360Wh overnight!

Have a look at an Owl meter.

niallb

Are you basing the 22kWh average on your old electricity bill listed usage or just the Tapo attached devices?

If you have 2.5 years worth of data, how does it compare if you calculate for the same 4 month period from the previous year from Oct - Feb ?

Rexell1

Our kW usage had a large jump when the smart meter was fitted too. It's not in a full month yet to fairly compare but the daily averages are way up on the previous readings. Coincidence or no?

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121788738#Comment_121788738

Oh no.

That's exactly the point. I'm only taking the use here from the HDF file and what I'm billed. Not monitoring devices.

As to your specific question this is again, the point, so the present October to Feb period would show 594 units for the 13 days of October I was with Energia, then 990 November, 986 December, 1001 January and so its looking like heading to 960 February.

For last year when on EI and Smart Meter (but not Smart Plan) the use would be 650-700 a month. I can work out exact monthly comparisons later, but I'm just briefly looking at the my present monthly figures and looking at the older 2-month EI bills for this post. This is probably a bit off.

So, yes, this is the whole point. Since I've gone to TOU the use has leapt up about 6-7kwh a day or about 200 a month.

Like its now a standard 1000kwh a month house, when historically been 650-700kwh and maybe when a pump broke and ran a bit long one month, 750kwh. Its a huge jump really.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121789103#Comment_121789103

Well, I'm not saying the Smart Meter is the issue. I've been on a Smart Meter for billing for three years. I've been on an activated Smart Meter for a Smart Plan only since 18.10.23 the same day the use moved up.

I just can't help but feel its not the Smart Meter, but something has happened when its shifted from just a 24 hr report period to having to report over three different time with (I am guessing) some overlap, but its all just speculation but I literally have no other explanation. Nothing else has changed and certainly nothing to account for 200 units a month. We are boring like that!

Rexell1

Yes literally the usage jumped here from the date of installation. We 'used' more units on a day we were away from home than on a busy day prior to installation

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121789363#Comment_121789363

I've no idea what can be done. The ESB data is what it is. Energia say they rely on that, but its just an absolute correlation that my use rocketed the second we moved to TOU and not just in a little way that could be explained by a PS5 being left on etc.

John.G

Are you actually monitoring the meter "on the wall" itself??.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121798290#Comment_121798290

You mean actually using a secondary monitor on the meter? No. But I do have an efergy clamp thing somewhere around I could use I suppose if I wasn't afraid of touching a live feed!

CoBo55

Have you got a well or septic tank? Either of these could be running more than they should. I have an owl monitor and find it very good.

CrazyEric

Get an OWL monitor. I have one and I can almost recognise what is on by looking at it now. There is always the possibility that your old meter was faulty so make sure before complaining.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121815491#Comment_121815491

I have both. With the wet conditions due to more infiltration to the tank the chamber pump is running more than it should, but I have it accounted for and it's not a big amount in the scheme of things.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121820898#Comment_121820898

Sure but it's not an old meter issue. I've had a smart meter all along. The use amount up the day we changed to smart *plan*. Two years of smart meter (the same meter) before that at average 22 a day and day after smart plan and since average 29 a day.

CoBo55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121822325#Comment_121822325

On the well side have you an outside toilet gone faulty calling for water continuously or something like that? Did you mention earlier you've seen a big draw during the night of around 3Kw? That to me would match an immersion coming on. It's very frustrating that a change of provider has brought on this problem.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121822435#Comment_121822435

No. First thing I looked for. Even if there was a fault on the toilet, we'd see it on the stats on the well system and there's no continuous draw there.

We don't have an immersion. Oil boiler only (which is another frustration).

It's driving me mad. I understand I only have correlation and not causation at this point, but its to the day we changed that the use leapt.

John.G

If your smart meter has a flashing LED then 1000 flashes is 1 kwh. Suggest switching off all pumps, fridges, TVs etc to get the electrical load down as low as possible, fill your electric kettle and switch it on, start your stop watch exactly when you start counting the flashes, after exactly say 25 flashes stop your watch, note the exact time taken, check the wattage on the bottom of the kettle, it might give something like 2850W at 230V & 3100W at 240V, ideally you should monitor the voltage when the kettle is switched on but you will still get a good feel even if you havn't a M.meter because your apparent usage has increased by over 30%, 29 kwh/day vs 22. If it takes exactly 30 secs to give a 25 flash count then the power is 3600*25/30, 3000W, if the count is 25 after say 23 secs then the apparent power is 3600*25/23, 3913W or + 30% which would be a good pointer if something "wrong" with the meter. The only other thing I can think of is that the smart meter is only measuring kva and not taking the motor power factor into account, both these scenarios are a bit unlikely IMO but you can check out the first bit relatively easily and take it from there.

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121822331#Comment_121822331

Hi OP you've not said whether this extra usage has resulted in higher bills?

What was the reason for switching, was it supposed to result in lower bills due to the new plan?

I don't have a smart meter, does anyone know if a smart meter can be manipulated to show extra usage from the supplier end? It would be extremely coincidental that switching to a plan designed to save you money would actually result in no saving at all.

SteelyDanJalapeno

Can you just read the meter on the wall?

No fancy gadgets, just poll it daily or hourly for a few days if you think they're may be overlap or something awry, if the meter hasn't been swapped then that should tell you fairly quickly.

I recorded mine for a few months last year with the big hike in prices, pen and paper and jotted it down at the same time every day, took a note of the big consumers on that day, dryer, shower, washing machine, dishwasher, electric heater etc

CoBo55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121835009#Comment_121835009

That's what I'd be doing, you can cycle through the three time zones to get exact readings, take the readings at the same time every day for a week and see do your readings tally with Energia's.

tomslick

Go to the esb networks website and you'll get the half hour breakdown of your usage. That should show when the power was used. Might help.

happyplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121929284#Comment_121929284

Thanks, I have all that. I don't think I'm being clear enough. The data will correspond with the billing. The point is for two years so or my daily use averaged 22kwh (smart meter billing, not active) and from the very day of going on a smart plan, its now to 29kwh day in, day out. That's what I am wondering about - has anyone else ever seen that - literally the jump (nothing else changed) on the very day - to the day - of the activation of the smart plan. I.e that there is something as between reading from an MCC01 and MCC12 that is different whether its some doubling up on the change over from the various times in the TOU periods or not. As I say, nothing has changed. Nothing and the use shoots up on the day the smart plan starts (18.10.23). My only option here really is to change back to a 24 hour rate and see what occurs. At least I can cut off my own tinfoil hat that way.

TheSunIsShining

Out of interest, how many Tapos do you have? I have the 4 but been hesitant to buy more. I had one on the freezer for a couple of months - and could see I was using circa 27kw a month. But once I knew it across 2 months I didn't see much more value in it so I moved the Tapo. As in, what could I do with the data - not like I could turn the freezer off....

Re your usage issue. That would drive me nuts too. But can you look at the HDF file in Excel and see if the jump is at a particular time or what? Can you graph the 7 days before and after your switching and see if anything stands out from visualising it? Cause if the extra 7kw a day is just spread right across the 24 hours, then it is bizarre alright.....

John.G

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121977410#Comment_121977410

"The data will correspond with the billing", does this billing/data correspond to the actual displayed meter readings?.

denismc

There have been issues with smart meters here and in the UK.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/thousands-warned-over-malfunctioning-smart-meters-leading-to-overcharging-esb-admits-connectivity-issue/a872442693.html

antoinolachtnai

have a look at the meter and take the reading. Get your closing read from the last MCC01 bill and subtract to find your consumption. Compare that to your billed consumption. Are they the same?

John.G

My billing is Bi monthly on the 10th of the month, I take the meter readings directly off the meter and they are exactly the same as my billed consumption.

Alun

My only option here really is to change back to a 24 hour rate and see what occurs. At least I can cut off my own tinfoil hat that way.

Not an option, unfortunately. Once you go onto a smart plan there's no going back.

It's a puzzling one all right. If you download your HDF file from the ESB site, how far back does it go? I think that currently if you change suppliers it resets, so your old data from when you were with EI is gone, but if it is available you might be able to see what's changed.