Miele Dishwasher

islanderre

Hello,

I fitted a new to me Miele Dishwater on Saturday last; I bought it 2nd hand during the summer. It was installed in a kitchen and ran only a few times. It's mint condition.

It is wired into a normal house plug.

Ran it with no dishes on its ECO setting; no problem.

Loaded it with dishes and ran it on the 'Intensive' setting and it blew the plug 13Amp fuse within 3 min of the program starting. The wall MCB did not trip

Reviewed the manual and see it has two different means of wiring depending on the fuse fitted

From my reading of the above; if I fit a 32 Amp fuse; all will be good.

I am reluctant to do this as I fear a draw on the mains with a 32Amp fuse may be too much if the Hob, Oven and / or the electric shower is running.

Am I overthinking this?

I do not know if a normal domestic plug will even take a 32 amp fuse.

Reviewing the manual; it simply states to reconfigure the to run with a 16Amp fuse may result in longer running times. I'd have no problem with this!!

I'd prefer to redo the wiring to allow it run with the 16Amp fuse

Any advise on how to reconfigure the connections would be most appreciated.

Thanks!!

kirk.

Looks to be setup for 32A single-phase there , that's why it's blowing 13A fuse

The 4 spade connectors need to be reconnected to the spare terminals by the look of it or else put in a 32A supply

Is this an industrial type machine ?

islanderre

Hello Kirk,

It's a Miele Professional Dishwasher that was installed very briefly in a workplace canteen.

Would you think it better to reconfigure for the 16amp fuse or simply get a 32amp fuse?

Thanks for your input

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121452533#Comment_121452533

There is no such thing as a plug-top (standard BS type three-pin plug) which takes more than 13A. It needs to be reconfigured as @kirk. says for the second option.

The thing that's not clear to me is how you identify this device marked as "Z1" from the cables. Is there a Z1 marking on one of the wires? There appears to be a "N (L3)" on that blue one alright.

islanderre

Thanks for the input 10-10-20...

My understanding is Z1 is likely the electrical load in the dishwasher.... Heating element, pump motor etc.

From the pictures... It is set up for 32amp

Two blue / neutral wires are connected in the dishwasher arse to Neutral

Incoming Live L1 is connected to black, brown and grey cables that go out to the dishwasher electrical load

L2 and L3 are unconnected as per the photo

kirk.

There's about 6kw of water heating total. Disconnecting the 4 spade connectors brings that down to about 2kw

ie: Disconnect black/grey and 2 blue spade connectors and relocate to spare terminals

That leave leaves a brown and blue connected (see behind spade connectors in pic) for 13amp setup

islanderre

Okay...

I understand..... I think!!!

I'll disconnect one of the neutral on the dishwasher side, the black and the grey on the dishwasher L1 side....

These disconnected cables I can leave disconnected and tape up with insulation tape?

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121452776#Comment_121452776

Move the cables kike this as L2 and L3 are now spare terminals as you don't have three phases connected.:

That will leave the light blue and the brown in place at the bottom of L1 and N. This is where Z1 is powered from. Right @kirk. ?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121452722#Comment_121452722

All makes sense now.

kirk.

Ya that's it , there's 3 connection modes

The other 2 modes are just adding in the extra water heating load

islanderre

Gents....

Many many thanks for the inputs...

Much appreciated.

I'll reconfigure hopefully this evening or tomorrow at the latest and I'll report back.

Thanks again.... I'd gladly get ye a beer if our paths ever cross!!!

astrofool

Presume it's also just a standard lead and not the 3x4mm specified for 32A.

I'd guess it could be run at 32A if wired back to the board on its own wiring and hard wired to a 32A switch.

islanderre

Hey Astrofool,

The cable remains as 3 X 4mm...

I did not think it would matter?

I can get an the cable changed to 1.5mm if necessary

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121454492#Comment_121454492

He stated that it was "It is wired into a normal house plug.", so no.

islanderre

As 10-10-20 says above....

The 4mm wire is wired into a domestic 13amp plug.

I'll get it changed to 1.5mm if that's the best thing to do.

I would of thought the heavier cache would not be a bad thing?

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121454854#Comment_121454854

No, don't change it, you're fine with a 4mm^2 and a 13A fuse, no issue there. Astrofool was suggesting that if it was hard-wired back to a 32A circuit then the 4mm^2 would be fine.

kirk.

Seems a bit odd parking the 4 terminals on L2 L3 if there's a 3P connection mode

There's no 3P schematic in pics but I assume it can be used

astrofool

Running 3x4mm into a standard plug would be quite odd (and a tight fit), but seems this was the case, but yes, it can be left this way if using the 13A configuration.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121455722#Comment_121455722

It sure would. I had a challenge in getting 2.5sq pond-flex into a plug before, hate to see how the 4sq goes in!

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121455722#Comment_121455722

Ya I'm actually reading the op now for the first time fully😁

He mentions only 2 connection modes in manual same as pic shows

Not sure why that would be if true, maybe I'm missing something obvious . Would there be a reason that would be sold only as a single phase model ?

islanderre

Well lads,

Thanks again for all the help.

Dishwasher had its loaded inaugural run..... Total success!!

And yes; it's connected into a standard domestic plug.... Tight squeeze for sure with the 4mm wires!!

Thanks again

kirk.

I assume then there's 2 models sold , same machine

Single phase and 3 phase with different leads

islanderre

I've no idea Kirk.....

It's a "professional" model which is a step up from the ordinary domestic model.

On average; the Professional model is twice the price of the domestic model.

Miele engineer who visited in relation to an issue with a Miele dryer we have passed a comment that the dishwasher will out last me!!!

10-10-20

They have thicker steel and a more robust construction, also more powerful pumps and higher powered heater coils (when in 3P mode). Not as efficient as a domestic model though, but a great find if you can get it.

If you're ever stuck, just contact Miele - they're actually excellent for support / manuals / schematics etc.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121469078#Comment_121469078

Ya probably a different machine then the 3P

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121469458#Comment_121469458

I think what they do is that they have high powered heating elements on the 2nd and 3rd phase as the cycle time on a commercial dishwasher is much shorter than a domestic. Some are finished their cycle in just a few mins as opposed to an hour or so.

https://nelsonwashonline.co.uk/blogs/buying-guides/navigating-the-dishwasher-maze-a-comprehensive-guide-to-commercial-vs-domestic-options

astrofool

I'd be totally looking for an excuse to run a new cable back to the fuse board to run it at 32A :)

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121471434#Comment_121471434

Eh charge the car or 2-minute dishwasher cycle... choices, choices... 😂

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121471434#Comment_121471434

Ya me too if I had one I'd be looking to max it out😁

Never saw the use for them for them domestically

Bit confusing there originally but there must be 1P and 3P machines , better pumps , body etc as 101020 was saying