no sleeve on gas pipe through cavity wall

thewanderingwhistler

Mod's please move this if it's in the wrong category.

Our house was built in the 2003 - 2004 timeframe and has had a number of owners since then. GMC replaced the gas meter recently and left a notice of non-conformance to safety requirements of current Irish standard for domestic gas installations, I.S. 813. The problem being, no sleeving visible on the copper pipe through the cavity wall. The guy from GMC figured that the sleeving had been concreted over and just wasn't visible. He said I should get an RGI to remove some concrete to expose the sleeve. With some concrete removed it turns out that there isn't a visible sleeve on the pipe through the cavity wall. So I'm looking for opinions/ guidance on what to do next please.

I'm wondering if it wasn't a requirement when the house was built...Although, I looked at one other house in the row and i see the pipe in the cavity wall is sleeved. So I guess it wasn't checked/signed off on correctly when installed (i don't know if the builder is still in business). Our house was sold numerous times with this non-conformance and it didnt seem to be a problem for the sale, maybe nobody noticed it!. Legally, do i need to do something about this, now that there's a paper trail? 

From a safety perspective, I guess I have to do something about it. The question is how to fix it?

The RGI suggested re-routing the pipe from the meter, to have it outside the house (along the side of the house) and into the kitchen by the gas boiler. Since then, I'm wondering is it possible to retrofit the gas pipe with the sleeve, the problem is I don't know if it needs to just be around the pipe as it goes through the cavity wall or if it needs to be fully on every gas pipe in the house? Not even sure if it could be retrofitted..

I'd appreicate any thoughts, recommendations, potential solutions on this.

Thanks.

10-10-20

I'm not an RGI but... You could retrofit the pipe and reuse the existing entry point, sure. It would just require that the pipe be removed, redrilled with a suitable diameter and then the ~320mm liner installed followed by the pipe at that entry point. It's not a requirement that the whole pipe be lined, but I think that the preference is that the internal section is as short as possible to eliminate the chance of internal leaks.

looksee

Likewise not RGI but just had this same issue with a pipe that was only fitted 4 years ago. Got a new gas hob and the fitter said he had to put a sleeve on the section through the wall, which he did. He re-drilled the hole to make it a small bit bigger. Afaik the max length of pipe that can be fitted between supply and appliance is 1 metre, it is only sold in 1 metre lengths.

thewanderingwhistler

thanks for your replies. The RGI didn't suggest sleeving the existing pipe and i think i now know why based on the replies. The gas pipe enters the outer wall and into the cavity at footpath level, at the side of the house near the front. There's a step up into the house so I'm guessing the pipe is buried in concrete under the hall floor, so he wouldn't have access to other end of the pipe to sleeve it. Would that make sense?

Two interesting comments from the replies. (not sure how to quote parts of a reply)

It's not a requirement that the whole pipe be lined, but I think that the preference is that the internal section is as short as possible to eliminate the chance of internal leaks.

Afaik the max length of pipe that can be fitted between supply and appliance is 1 metre, it is only sold in 1 metre lengths.

The gas boiler and cooker are at the back of the house, on the same side that the gas pipe enters the house from the meter. The distance between them would be almost the length of the house. I assume there's a pipe running the length of the house to the kitchen, either in the cavity or under the hall floor. There isn't any visible pipes entering the house where boiler is. Would that be another hidden problem?

looksee

My comment was in reference to appliances attached to cylinder gas, not mains gas, so there may be different rules there.

10-10-20

The gas boiler and cooker are at the back of the house, on the same side that the gas pipe enters the house from the meter. The distance between them would be almost the length of the house. I assume there's a pipe running the length of the house to the kitchen, either in the cavity or under the hall floor. There isn't any visible pipes entering the house where boiler is. Would that be another hidden problem?

I'd like to think that it's not a problem per-se, but for specifics like that, you'd have to refer to an RGI.

coylemj

OP said ... Our house was built in the 2003 - 2004 timeframe ....

What typically follows that opener is a tale of rushed build/shoddy workmanship. There was a housing boom at the time and they couldn't build them fast enough. Standards went down as fast as houses prices were going up.

I remember hearing all sorts of tales that went around at the time and that was before the problem with (non-compliance with) fire safety regulations came to light. You could hear a baby crying in the house next door because of paper-thin walls, water pipes in the earth froze during a hard frost because they were not buried at the regulation depth etc. etc.

Pinoy adventure

It’s it’s copper pipe I’d insulate it but if it’s wicu pipe it’s grand.

Calahonda52

So I take it you can only see the pipe enter the cavity wall but not on the other side so the external route is the only viable solution

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121069072#Comment_121069072

Its not a question of insulation, its a sleeving requirement

thewanderingwhistler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121069101#Comment_121069101

thats correct. the pipe enters the cavity and can't see where it goes after that.