Looking for assistance for PC build

pinkfloydian

Hi,

I'm looking for advice to help me build a desktop PC. It's not for gaming. Also, where is the best place to get the parts and is assistance available to make the actual build (mainly what connections to use from the motherboard).

I have a file attached and I'm hoping it is not confusing. I've made some assumptions about the type of drives but I'm not confident enough to follow through without expert assistance. Also, I've no idea what criteria to use when selecting power.

(ATTACHMENT Removed (See comment 2)

Coyler

I'd copy and paste the text into the post directly. Word files are not unknown to have security issues.

Edit: also if this is just for basic use (internet browsing, word, excel, etc.) I suspect you'll be hard pressed to do better than a pre-built. Gaming rigs benefit from being built from parts for a few reasons but simple machines benefit from the scale that the likes of Dell and Lenovo can leverage. Also you get warrenty and support

So, first thing first, what exactly is the PC for as opposed to what is it not for?

pinkfloydian

Thanks Coyler

I hope the below makes sense. I have tried to do some research, but some of it bamboozles me and a lot of the PC Builders sites seem to be geared towards gamers. It may be over the top, but it's an aspirational list (It's my 70th. birthday in January and I'm planning on treating myself). I'm looking for longevity, as I won't be buying again for quite a number of years and would simply replace parts as I go. I currently have (and am happy with) a Dell Optiplex 3050 and I'd be happy to keep, but the processor fails the W11 requirements. My plan to spend now and simply replace parts as I go along would not be possible with e.g. Dell.

The PC is for everyday use as follows:-

Microsoft 365 apps (Outlook, Excel, Word, Powerpoint)

Web browsers (Edge(Default), Chrome, Brave)

WhatsApp Web app

Web browsing is for Social Media, YouTube and Streaming (e.g. C-Span)

I do not game, but might want to in the future

What is the most important attribute I want from my new PC?

Speed is my key requirement (fastest drives and connections)

Fast download and install for Windows updates

Fast data backup and restore (to external backup SSD – recommend one please)

As future-proof as possible

Build spec:-

Case             No see-through side panel

Black

No RGB

I/O Front    Headphone jack

USB C

Min 2 x USB (fastest speeds)

I/O Rear      Ethernet 2.5Gb

Display Port

HDMI (fastest)

Audio/speaker out

Min 4 x USB (fastest speeds)

Motherboard             Micro-ATX

Must accommodate bootable M2 drive

Processor    Intel Core i5 (12-13 Gen)

Built-in Graphics

Memory      DDR5 (2 x 16Gb)

No RGB

Drives          1 x 500Gb M2 (NVMe) for OS

1 x 1Tb M2 (NVMe) for data

1 x 1Tb M2 (NVMe) for backup (RAID?)

Fastest possible Read/Write speeds

External Backup SSD              Fastest possible read/write speeds

External CD/DVD Drive          Fastest read/write connection

Cooling        No water cooling

No specific preference for CPU cooler

Wi-fi & Bluetooth     Latest specs.

Power          No specific preference (but reliable)

UK/Ireland (3-pin) power plug

220V mains

OS         Windows 11 Pro

Spear

It'll depend upon how future proof you want to be. The socket used by Intel 12th/13th gen is already due for replacing. If you want a longer term option, then you'd want AM5. It's unknown how many more CPU generations that will get, but it'll be more than the Intel sockets do.

If external backup is really important, you may want to look at a NAS with 4 drives in a RAID setup. Simple external pluggable drives are no more reliable than internal single drives.

pinkfloydian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889327#Comment_120889327

Thanks Spear. That's exactly the kind of guidance I'm looking for.

What is AMD equivalent to 12th and 13th Gen Intel processors (given my requirements above)?

Also, the only reason I am opting for an external drive is that I come from an age where backups were traditionally kept "off site".

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120889403#Comment_120889403

The AMD equivalent is the Ryzen 7000 series on the Am5 socket.

Coyler

Just to remember that the entry point for the Intel is lower. The i3 CPUs in the 12th/13th are cheap and yet very capable. And I'd stick with Amazon UK/DE as they will deliver for free and returns are relatively simple. PC Partpicker is a great site for builds btw. Choose the T option (short for text) and paste in the text to show what you have configured.

When you go to pick your parts they are listed by popularity first so you get some idea as to what the community is checking out.

Here are two quick ones I've done. Nothing set in stone. PSU might be a little overkill but will cover all your potential needs. The case, the Fractal Design North, is just my favourite case right now but you can swap that our for most things.

PCPartPicker Part List AMD: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/VMDVd9

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor (£199.99 @ Amazon UK)

Motherboard: ASRock B650M-HDV/M.2 Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard (£140.71 @ Amazon UK)

Memory: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory (£90.98 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£98.19 @ Amazon UK)

Case: Fractal Design North ATX Mid Tower Case (£120.62 @ NeoComputers)

Power Supply: SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply (£118.78 @ Amazon UK)

Total: £769.27

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-07-24 20:18 BST+0100

PCPartPicker Part List Intel: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/jVgybK

CPU: Intel Core i3-12100 3.3 GHz Quad-Core Processor (£93.17 @ Amazon UK)

Motherboard: ASRock B760M Steel Legend WiFi Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard (£167.93 @ Amazon UK)

Memory: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory (£90.98 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Crucial P5 Plus 2 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£98.19 @ Amazon UK)

Case: Fractal Design North ATX Mid Tower Case (£120.62 @ NeoComputers)

Power Supply: SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply (£118.78 @ Amazon UK)

Total: £689.67

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-07-24 20:17 BST+0100

I keep forgetting that bbcode no longer works.

pinkfloydian

Thanks so much Coyler

I really appreciate the effort you put into this.

Tommy

Flinty997

Is there a reason you want a tower pc. If you are not gaming you can have the same power on a small mini pc with less power consumption.

How much storage do you currently use? How much are you expecting to need going forward.

pinkfloydian

Hi Flinty997

My preference would be for a case similar to the Dell Optiplex that I have (W155 / H350 / D270). I want a fully enclosed case with no glass side panel). Zero interest in anything with RGB (including fans). Also, do I need case fans, if I have a cooler fan? If not, then a case without fans.

Regarding storage, I have no idea what size Windows 11 Pro is, but I know that Windows 10 Pro takes up 238GB on my existing desktop. My data Libraries currently take up 195Gb. I am thinking of gaming into the future, so understand I will need quite a bit extra. I would only be gaming one or 2 games, so nothing heavy.

I am looking to have 3 drives (OS, Data, Backup).

This is where my knowledge is not great. I'm looking for the fastest possible drives and I understand that is made up of not only the read/write speeds, but also the connection type. I'm assuming NVMe is the fastest connection. Am I right in these assumptions? If not, I would appreciate clarification.

If I am, I would be looking for the following sizes

OS - 500Gb

Data - 1Tb

Backup - 1Tb

I also understand that this effects my choice of motherboard and this is why I'm looking for help. Every time I change something, I'm worried that I will have a compatibility issue, or change the power requirements.

Tommy

Spear

NVME drives are the fastest by far these days. If you want two of them, then'll you either need a motherboard with two slots (very common now), or put the second drive on a carrier card in a PCIe slot, and those are cheap and easily available.

In the long term, if you want to go gaming, you'd want to have a full x16 lane PCIe slot to add a GPU card into if you don't want to rely upon an integrated GPU.

Coyler

Made a few changes. Added slightly better RAM, dropped the case for a more standard tower design as you don't want glass side and swapped in 3 NVME drives which both motherboards will support as both have 3 M.2 slots for the drives. There is 4th M.2 on the Steel Legend but that is for WiFi/Bluetooth modules which is strange as it come with it built in Intel WiFi/bluetooth but just be aware of it.

The NVME drives I picked are decent but not the absolute best. Truth to be told, in day-to-day use it's impossible to tell the difference once you get particular level but at the same time don't get cheap ones either.

You could swap the i3-12100 for an i5-12400/13400 which will increase the price of the Intel far closer to the AMD one. At that point I'd get the AMD platform as they historically support theirs longer, as Spear says, as well as being the better performance wise.

You could look at get an after market cooler but for you current requirement that would be unnecessary. However if you do want to game a non-stock cooler is quieter and allows for better performace. Personally, I'd cross that bridge when you get to it but just giving you all the options.

PCPartPicker Part List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/2QQWY9

CPU: Intel Core i3-12100 3.3 GHz Quad-Core Processor (£93.17 @ Amazon UK)

Motherboard: ASRock B760M Steel Legend WiFi Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard (£167.93 @ Amazon UK)

Memory: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory (£99.98 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Case: Fractal Design Focus 2 ATX Mid Tower Case (£64.98 @ Amazon UK)

Power Supply: SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply (£118.78 @ Amazon UK)

Total: £678.01

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-07-25 22:08 BST+0100

PCPartPicker Part List: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/Gd73cb

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 7600 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor (£199.99 @ Amazon UK)

Motherboard: ASRock B650M Pro RS WiFi Micro ATX AM5 Motherboard (£167.39 @ Amazon UK)

Memory: Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-6000 CL36 Memory (£99.98 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Storage: Western Digital Black SN770 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive (£44.39 @ Amazon UK)

Case: Fractal Design Focus 2 ATX Mid Tower Case (£64.98 @ Amazon UK)

Power Supply: SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply (£118.78 @ Amazon UK)

Total: £784.29

Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available

Generated by PCPartPicker 2023-07-25 22:06 BST+0100

pinkfloydian

Thanks a lot Coyler.

There's one issue I would like clarification on.

I read somewhere (and I've lost the article) that it should not be assumed that a motherboard can accommodate booting from an M2 drive. Is this something you are aware of and does it affect the lists above? I plan to have one M2 for OS and one for Data.

Tommy

K.O.Kiki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120896745#Comment_120896745

That is not a thing.

Every mobo can boot from M.2 drives - M.2 just denotes the form factor, same way as 2.5" or 3.5" HDDs.

Flinty997

If there's a M2/nvme slot on the board it will boot from it.

Old machines (and motherboards) without a nvme slot you could put a nvme in an appropriate PCI slot to get a fast drive but you (mostly I assume) couldn't boot from it. Least the ones I had couldn't.

pinkfloydian

Thanks to everybody (especially Coyler) for their support.

This is what I think is my final list and I would appreciate if I could get some help with some other questions.

1) Can someone confirm that the CPU includes a stock cooler (and that it is fine for everyday use)

2) I changed the case, as I wanted USB-C on front panel. How do I check if there is enough headroom for the cooler and RAM (see note below)

3) All of the items are available from Newegg UK except for Seasonic Core (they only do Seasonic Focus). Is Focus OK and should I go for Fully Modular or Semi Modular? It would be better to order all parts from one place.

4) Lots of the "tech" YouTubers are promoting Windows Licence Keys (In the region of €40). Is it possible to install Windows 11 Pro as "unlicenced" and then just buy a Licence Key? That would knock a substantial amount off the overall cost.

5) Is the list fully compatible? No issues. Here are the compatibilty notes from pcpartspicker

Note: The MSI PRO B760M-A WIFI Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard has an additional 4-pin ATX power connector but the SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply does not have any available. This connector is used to supply additional current. While the system will likely still run without it, higher current demands or extreme overclocking may require it.

Disclaimer: Some physical dimension constraints are currently not checked, such as CPU coolers and RAM clearance.

CPU - Intel Core i5-12400 2.5 GHz 6-Core Processor$172.98

Motherboard - MSI PRO B760M-A WIFI Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard$169.99

Memory - Corsair Vengeance 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR5-5600 CL36 Memory$97.99

Storage (OS) - Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 3.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive$32.00

Storage (Data) - Samsung 970 Evo Plus 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 3.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive$49.99

Case - Asus Prime AP201 MicroATX Mini Tower Case$74.98

Power Supply - SeaSonic CORE GM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply$126.40BuyOperating System

Microsoft Windows 11 Pro OEM - DVD 64-bit$144.99

Total:$869.32

Thanks in advance

Tommy

raspberrypi67

Did you say you were 'thinking of gaming in the future'? Graphics card?

pinkfloydian

Hi raspberrypi67,

Yes, I did say that. But it will be at a later time.

Am I going to run into issues with that case and motherboard (power supply?), if I need to add a graphics card?

Tommy

raspberrypi67

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120903009#Comment_120903009

probably not . I'd look at the footprint of the video card but I'll bet it would be ok.

PSU's are usually rated over and beyond the max requirement of the setup. So you'd be fine I'd say.

Coyler

All those parts are just fine. With a 650W PSU you are looking at mainstream GPUs from Nvidia,AMD and Intel (think 4060/6700/A770) and even enthusiast level (think 4070/6800) which more than enough for your needs if you are going to go down that path.

WORD OF WARNING, it's my mistake but you are looking at the US side of PC partpicker. You should be looking at the UK version. See up the top right hand corner there is drop down menu?

Flip that to UK.

And unless someone says otherwise, for your first build please go with Amazon UK. It's just simpler. We all have our issue with the business but their support and returns policies are not the be sneezed at. I've never shopped with Newegg so can't recommend them. Perhaps someone may otherwise.

pinkfloydian

Thanks again for the support Coyler

pinkfloydian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120915892#Comment_120915892

Is there a special area in amazon uk for pc building. When I do a search for Intel Core i5 12400, I get the following results

Amazon.co.uk: Intel Core I5-12400 - Prime Eligible / 2.50 To 2.99 GHz / CPUs / Components & Re...: Computers & Accessories

pinkfloydian

Just did a search on amazon.co.uk for a MSI PRO B760M-A WIFI Micro ATX LGA1700 Motherboard (suitable for DDR5)

There were no matches, so that route is no good for me.

Coyler

I'd look for something similar. Any reason you are looking at the 12400? At that point you may as well look at the AMD R5 7600.

pinkfloydian

Only reason Coyler was that you had initially gone for an i3 in your list and I currently have an i5, so I changed it to the best priced i5 with onboard graphics.

If I change to AMD, then I will need to change the board, I assume (any effect on any of the other parts?)

Tommy

Coyler

The main reason is that you'd be buying into an Intel platform that is going to be superseded soon while the AMD one is going to be supported for far longer. This doesn't even factor in the better performance, better integrated GPU and power efficiency. You might pay a little extra but there is good reason.

Let me tweak your builds for you. I'd also swap out the 500G drive for a 1TB one. The price difference is so small that unless the money is that tight I'd go for the 1TB. Also, 1TB are the best value drives right now on a price per GB basis.

pinkfloydian

Thanks Coyler.

I've taken your original Ryzen list and just changed the case.

But then I run into a caveat "Some physical dimension constraints are currently not checked, such as CPU coolers and RAM clearance"

How do I double-check that I will not have issues?

Tommy

Coyler

You could save a little money and go with the https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/B650M-HDVM.2/index.asp. Very similar board to the Pro RS but has one less M.2 slot with 2 as total. Your call. Zero difference on any other practical level for you

It's giving the warning as it's a MicroATX case. There are coolers that will be too large for that case but there is a way to check. Go to the specs on the manufacturer's website and it will list the maximum size of the CPU cooler https://www.asus.com/motherboards-components/gaming-cases/prime/asus-prime-ap201-microatx-case/techspec/

So we see what are the max sizes of CPU coolers, GPU length and PSU length are. Long story short, the cooler that comes with the CPU is going to be fine. The AMD Wraith Stealth that comes with the 7600 is 54mm.

Anyway, show us your final list before pulling the trigger as peer-review is always nice to have.

pinkfloydian

Thanks Coyler

Will do