Repointing of Patio

pinkfloydian

My patio is in need of re-pointing (see attached). It is missing in some areas and loose in others. The actual pointing material seems to be pretty poor generally.

I have some questions.

What is the best way to repoint? e.g. brush in dry materials and allow to harden, or mix wet and manually repoint every joint. I would be worried about staining the paving, which is Black Indian Limestone with granite edging.

The installers invoice says that he used Easy Joint & Rompox. Should I scrape out the entire patio and re-do or should I just do the areas where there is missing jointing?

What is the best pointing mix?

T

Alun

No replies yet, I see. I'm in the same boat but with Indian Sandstone paving where the original pointing was very variable, with some areas still perfectly OK, some starting to crumble and in a few places completely disappeared, probably due to power washing. I tried to repoint some of the worst affected areas with sand and cement but wasn't very successful. I think the best approach would be to remove all the existing pointing and start again, but that's a huge job and one I'd not be able for myself. Not sure if a paving contractor would be either.

anewme

following as in same position. Indian sandstone with very wide joints

phormium

I don't know about those fancier paving options, I only had bog standard 30 yr old concrete patio slabs but after redoing it several times over the years with all the suggestions, brush in sand/cement dry, do it wet etc I finally did a bit of research a few years back and bought JointIt, expensive at 50 quid at that time for a bucket and took 2 buckets to do small patio but it's a great job!

I have not had any issue since with any bits coming up and it looks as good as when I did it about 4 yrs ago, will even endure a power washing of slabs, now I avoid it as much as possible when washing but the old options always came up or broke even with the lightest touch.

You must though clean out the gaps really well so that you can fit in as much as possible and compact it well as its being pushed in. I used one of those wet/dry hoover thingies to clean out cracks well after loosening up everything that was in them. I found patching never worked and better to just clear out all the old stuff and start again.

My sister has just done her patio with same stuff over the past few weeks, mind you hers had never been filled day one for some reason, she has the sandston sort, those big random size slabs. She admits now that it looks much better after filling, had been encouraging her to do it for years!

Dr_Colossus

I've quite a lot (~200m2) of Indian sandstone patio in a similar layout to that in the OP. Was originally laid with the brush in compound below and have used a couple of buckets since over the years to re-do sections and patch others. It's easy to use, quick, looks great and sets hard but it's mad expensive and afraid just doesn't last the test of time. Patio requires power washing at least once a year to maintain and no matter how careful with the joints the power washer degrades it quite quickly plus the joints themselves do need cleaning.

https://www.goodwins.ie/products/joint-it-simple-neutral-buff-20kg-min-3-25mm-4020200.html?filter_set%5B%5D=21,2169,2210

In recent years I've taken to redoing sections in dyed concrete. It's incredibly slow work, hard on the knees and back but should last years and it's a joy to wash making that process so much faster and convenient just blasting over everything. I mix up a bucket at a time relatively dry and compress into the joints and smooth over with the back of a spoon (have tried various different trowels and tubing but found the teaspoon for narrower joints and dessert spoon for wider joints the more consistent).

pinkfloydian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120820390#Comment_120820390

Thanks for that and forgive my ignorance. Can you explain "concrete" to me. Is that a sand/cement mix? If so, what proportions. Can I buy concrete ready made (link for woodies or B&Q would be great). Also how do you define "relatively dry"?

phormium

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120820390#Comment_120820390

That's the same stuff I used and have found it the best of all the things I tried, not a budge on it since I did it and have power washed carefully with no issues. It doesn't do though to just brush it in, the guy I bought it from said to compact it well in when filling the gaps, brush in but compact down with something and brush in more and keep doing this until joints are filled and solid.

Dr_Colossus

@phormium agreed that's the correct process and what I did and in fairness sections of it have lasted a number of years but I don't think there's any of the original install from about 8 years ago now remaining. It does last better when the joints are wide and deep but then equally as likely to wear to the elements and power washer.

@pinkfloydian Yes, sand/cement mix. In my case I went with the premix at 3:1 for convenience, that's a strong mix so could add extra sand to stretch it out more. Stay away from Woodies for any building materials as their prices are eye watering, B&Q not as bad I find. This is the stuff I got which I found ideal as it has very fine aggregate throughout making it stronger. Prices for that have shot up also, was €7.60 per bag 2 years ago and €8.75 last year and now €9.25 I see unless buying big volumes. Should be able to get similar in any builder providers depending on your area.

https://www.goodwins.ie/products/o-brien-sand-cement-drymix-3-1-25kg-4000023.html?filter_set%5B%5D=1,3016

Mixed with water in a large bucket but had it dry enough that it was still crumbly and water didn't readily come to the surface when troweled leaving a shiny/wet surface. Made application that bit easier as could be brushed without staining. Also laid when the paving stones and ground were dry.

With the Black Indian sandstone, the natural concrete colour would probably look well enough in terms of a match but a darkened or near black joint might work very well and emphasise the natural stone so worth testing. In my case I used buff concrete dye and a 1kg tub did a decent section as think I mixed using 200g per 10kg mix.

https://www.goodwins.ie/products/everbuild-mortar-dye-black-1kg.html?filter_set%5B%5D=1,1056,1084

pinkfloydian

Thanks for the comprehensive reply Dr_Colossus