A form of financial abuse?

BabyGrogu

Around a long time, going anon for this one.

I’m in a long term relationship 10+ years, not married, no kids together, we have 1 each from previous relationships. I own a house and we live together there. Generally it is a good relationship, we get on well, supportive, fun all that good stuff. There are some mental health issues on his side, fairly well managed but when he has episodes he uses that to manipulate situations.

On to the problem which I just can’t get my head around. I literally pay for everything, like slice up the household budget any way you like and I pay for everything. He had a MH episode a few months back, driven demented with work due to burn out and working so much overtime, when I asked how I could help he suggested financially so I took on a share of some of his bills. The thing is, his contribution to household finances is travel, he pays for our travel and it’s not mad flash 5* trips to Dubai or anything like that, it’s short European city breaks. Not to mention this is an expense you don’t need to have at all.

He was so unbelievably stressed at work, I have taken more bills, now he is not stressed but continues to work overtime, accumulating sizable savings and I don’t have 2 cents to rub together at the end of the month. I am the higher earner on base salaries but we earn about the same when you take in his overtime etc. Something doesn’t feel right here and I don’t know how to approach it. We keep our finances separate but very transparent. I feel it’s a form of financial abuse but in a sense that I am being taken for a complete mug. Fundamentally I know I would be much better off financially if I wasn’t in a relationship with him but in the past when I have tried to outline how I feel, discuss issues, not happy, he has threatened kill himself things like that, the manipulation I mentioned earlier and I always back down. I just feel I am being used. What would you do?

NattyO

You need to be careful that he is not building up a pot of "running away money" or worse still, getting himself into a position where he has the power to manipulate you financially (which he seems to be doing already to some extent).

You need to nip this one in the bud, and not be put off by threats. A relationship where he holds the ability to decide what is or isn't discussed is not a healthy one.

Neyite

If he's building up his "running away money" then frankly, he's doing you a massive favour.

Yes it's abusive behaviour. He uses the threat of suicide to force you to back down when you want to reset the balance - and that's incredibly manipulative. And it works, doesn't it? You care about him and you don't want him to hurt himself so you back down every time.

In truth, if he did commit suicide - or even go as far as to attempt it, that's HIS decision and HIS choice and you are not in any way responsible for his actions. So you are allowed to end the relationship. You are allowed to say this system of money isn't working for you and you want to change it. You are allowed to say you aren't happy and ask a partner to work with you on the areas that would make you happier.

He won't change, he'll just find other ways of using you and hurting you. He doesn't respect or love you as he clearly shows in his actions. So you are faced with two choices - accept this is the way it will always be, or break up with him. Do you want to break up with him?

spaceHopper

When you say you own the the house, is there a mortgage. If not then your expenses shouldn't be to bad. Where are kids, with you and his ex, shared...

Where is their money going, why are they stressed about money, because you taking one more bills isn't really helping them. Have they hidden addiction to gambling or coke..

It could that he's just terrible with money. What I would do is say that the current arrangement isn't working for you and you are flat broke. Suggest setting up one joint account that you both pay and equal amount into that is used to cover shopping, bills.

Setup level pay one electricity and gas, get on to your broadband provider and get a discount... let them see you doing this so that it isn't just about them.

Set up a second small saving account that is used for other big bills and holidays. Each of you keep your own saving and current accounts too.

The upside of this for them is that they should have to do less over time.

If this stresses them out to much then it's time to see Dr if they threaten to kill themselves then it's time to hospital.

YellowLead

Aside from the whole unfairness here regarding finances - he threatens to kill himself when you try and talk to him about how you feel. This scenario is great for him with you paying for basically everything - so yes you can be sure he wants to shut down such conversations. As another poster mentioned - he does it because it works. You are still in a relationship with him and still paying for everything.

The scary things from your side is that you are the higher earner and you own the house - if you split he will be entitled to a share of the house once he can prove he is financially dependent on you.

He doesn’t sound like a great guy - accumulating savings that isn’t part of a joint account instead of contributing his share???

It’s hard as an outsider to see how his good traits could possibly outweigh the way he treats you financially and with threatening suicide - pure manipulation.

TheadoreT

Really bizarre tone to your post. Starts fluffy saying how good your relationship is and how he has a handle on his mental health.

Then turns out he's threatening suicide for fairly innocuous reasons. That's the furthest thing from "well managed". If you take him at his words, he needs immediate help. If he's trivially using it to manipulate you, you're dating a psychopath OP.

The money isn't the issue here.

Panthro

So he's getting a roof over his head, a bed under his arse, all bills paid...and in return you're getting...the odd weekend away in Paris or wherever??

Yeah he's going to say just about anything to keep that gravy train chugging along.

Time to figure out your average outgoings each month, open up a joint account in goes a 50/50 split. If he plays along there's hope if not there's the door.

BabyGrogu

Sorry, haven’t been able to respond in ages.

Yes, house has a mortgage but all things considered it’s fairly affordable. My child lives with us and his child lives with the mother and visits us, he pays maintenance. I even pay private health insurance for his child.

I tried to bring the whole situation up with up and all I get is the poor mouth story which I know not to be true. After a lot of back and forth he has agreed to pay for the grocery shop every other week. I suppose that’s something, although far from equal.

Noted, yes I started the post a bit fluffy, I was trying not to be super negative. The relationship has its good points and when it’s good it’s very good. The problem the last while is that I am starting to resent him so much and my tolerance is just not there. I feel like if he asked me what time it was it would annoy me so that’s not a good place for my head to be in.

Even writing everything out helped a bit, just to get it off my chest. I know realistically I need out of the relationship but I am just trapped. Can you even fathom a situation like that? Telling someone how you feel and giving them XYZ reasons why you want to end the relationship and they just refuse. Madness.

Str8outtaWuhan

If you are together 10 years then there is a good chance in the eyes of the law that it ain't all you house anymore, married or not.

Dial Hard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120608917#Comment_120608917

In the eyes of the law it doesn't matter how long they've been together, only how long he has lived in the house. If it's 5 years or more, then yes, he has the right to seek an interest in the house should they break up. But it's not a given and the percentage he's granted (if any) will be directly proportionate to his contribution to their joint finances. I don't really see what's to be gained by scaring the crap out of the OP by posting half-facts.

OP, I know you feel trapped but you *can* leave this relationship. People who are far more entangled than you two (i.e. married with kids) do it every day.

BabyGrogu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120608917#Comment_120608917

The whole crux of my post is that he doesn’t contribute to the household finances. I’m not sure what claims he would be making.

Anyway, that is something I know he would never do in any circumstances. He just wouldn’t do it.

I do indeed feel very trapped and I feel my own mental health slipping a bit over the last few months.

Im very grateful for the advice.

Str8outtaWuhan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609398#Comment_120609398

If he never contributed a penny but lives with u long term that doesn't matter. His attitude could change if you split hence my warning, spite makes people do horrible things

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120609398#Comment_120609398

Concerns over finances and perceptions of fairness or otherwise are fairly critical in most relationships. You are quite right to feel taken advantage of according to the scenario that you've outlined. Ten years though is a long time to figure this out - did it start equitably and then slip?

You've a couple of choices 1) suck it up on the basis that the good outweighs this and you can live with it or 2) sit down and make it very clear that you are upset about the inequity of this and that things must change. Don't accuse him of being stingy, let him figure that. Get clear commitment as to how you'll proceed in the future, who will cover what. Why not have a joint account, that you both pay into equally etc., that you draw all living expenses from.

If he refuses to engage with that, do what you need to do to be happy again.

Tork

OP, be careful that him buying groceries every now and then isn't an attempt to paper over the cracks. What exactly is a week's groceries anyway? It could involve him going into Lidl and spending €20 on just enough to shut you up. He doesn't sound like much of a catch TBH but then again I have no time for manipulative people who are obsessed with money. It's time for you to decide what your red line is.

1874

edited for reply to wrong poster

1874

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120554042#Comment_120554042

This is poor and no offense, naive advice,

If they are bad with money, you automatically assume they still wont keep spending money out of the joint account AND still squirrel money away (assuming thats what they actually are doing, or not spending it on something else, even if potentially genuine spending, it should be brought up in a relationship).

What I have seen with someone who is bad with money or wont explain where money is going is, empty not just their own contribution to a joint account, but my own. Having a joint account with someone like that who is bad with money and trying to ensure there is enough for mortgage (there wasn't in some instances), can be an ongoing battle, but necessarily managing a domestic budget to ensure essentials can be paid for, could also be interpreted as controlling, in this case not so much but where the person good with money is the man, then very likely. Not only that, aside from tie-ing themselves further to the person, the Op would need to get permission from the other person to close the account or remove them. Best case scenario is the person contributes a mutually agreed budget amount to the account where DD or SOs are taken from, they can still show they contributed easily. Shopping every other week and the occasional holiday isnt making the grade, some people have that attitude, you pay for this, I pay for that, and it muddies what someone isnt paying for imo.

I wouldnt be paying for their childs private healthcover for a start. Next there needs to be a frank and open discussion about money (something I never got myself, but openness about finances is critical in my opinion and experience, but that discussion may never be forthcoming or raised without problems or arguments). I'd suggest the OP makes up the monthly costs and splits it 50:50 or if they are ok with it, pro rata per earnings at worst.Then insist the other person contributes that fair share (what the OP thinks that is may differ from what others think), simply paying for certain things like the occasional trip away doesn't sound fair to me. Each others earning should be open for the other to see, while I think a joint account makes sense for two sensible reasonable people, I think it can go wrong where one person is being secretive, or at risk of spending what has been put away for month to month essentials. Id hazard a guess the person at best may only ever have contributed what they decided was ok and may even have not been able to contribute on occasion.

If the person refuses to come clean and be open, then Id tell them straight up they can contribute, if they protest, Id tell them (it sounds like the OP is considering anyway) you want to take a break and let them pay their own way elsewhere with the view to finishing it, but thats me, I wouldnt countenance someone talking about suicide and living with my child even if it is a manipulation tactic, maybe thats what it would take to make them come to their senses and maybe the OP and the person can fix the problem?

How likely that is to work might depend on how long they have lived together in the OPs house.

I think the person has a terrible case of selfish entitlement, and rather than something sinister (drink or drugs) its possible the other person is squirreling money away or possibly subsidising his other child or cant say no to another family member or even so called friends, seen it happen.