New bill re opening of old safety deposit boxes

Deeec

I thought the following may be of interest to some here from a genealogy point of view. Basically safety deposit boxes held in banks not touched in over 80 years will be opened. These could contain money, jewelary, works of art, deeds, wills etc. Owners/Owners family will try to be traced within 6 months of opening. The finds could be very interesting - it could make some families rich and also cause property rows etc! Im hoping we will hear more about the finds when it goes ahead.

https://www.thejournal.ie/bill-treasure-trove-memorabilia-old-safe-deposit-boxes-6048608-Apr2023/

pinkypinky

Could be very interesting. I didn't think most banks held safety deposit boxes anymore. I wonder how many we're talking about. Are any of the banks from 1782 still in existence?

Jim2007

You think the boxes still exist... Managing the deposit box service was expensive, once the holder stopped paying fees a letter was dispatched to the last known address giving the holder a certain period of time to collect the contents, failing that the contents were destroyed. The same happened when the banks got out of the business.

None of the banks were willing to carry the cost of holding on to all the crap. I'd be surprised if there were a 100 unopened boxes in the country at this stage. The last time I tried to help someone track down a missing box, the bank in question had no record of it and using old news paper clippings we concluded that the most likely thing to have happened was that the contents would have been destroyed when the building were the boxes were stored was flooded in the early 50s. And that is as far as we were able to take it.

Just a politician trying to make himself relevant.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120500507#Comment_120500507

Were the majority though really full of crap?

Hermy

It would be a fun job trying to trace the owners!

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120500513#Comment_120500513

We will never know nor will we know whether it was ever even a big service to start with. The Ireland of that period was a very poor place, so there was not exactly a whole lot of stuff around to be put into a deposit box in the first place.

Deeec

I would be delighted to find out an ancestor had one of these boxes - I would find even so called rubbish paperwork from my ancestors interesting. Paperwork could be valuable from a genealogy point of view - deeds etc. Whats rubbish to one person is treasure to another.

Jellybaby_1

Ooh, did granddad hide away his treasure?? Even an old will, or letters, or photographs, wouldn't it be wonderful!!? Now I wonder how hard they will look for the families or their descendants? Will it be as thorough are the Heir Hunters? My family were in rented flats in the city, so I wonder will they be able to track me down if they find anything? It would be a good idea if they published names or addresses on the very old boxes along the lines of the British Bona Vacantia. Always wanted to ask if there is an Irish equivalent of Bona Vacantia, anyone here know?

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501031#Comment_120501031

I listened to Minister O Cuiv on morning Ireland this morning and he did mention that owners names would be published publicly for 6 months for owner or family to come forward - he never said where this info would be published though. The doubter in me thinks the government wont try to heard to find the families but we'll see. He also never mentioned whether genealogists would be hired to help with this.

I would imagine it was only richer people that had the requirement for these boxes. I dont know how it worked - whether they paid an amount for the box up front or had to pay a rent. I doubt any relations of mine had one anyway but you never know!

It think its something to watch out for.

Jellybaby_1

I'm not holding my breath either, but it's nice to dream! 😊

L1011

I'm not aware of a single bank that offered this service recently; and most of them ejected everyone after a short period of ceasing it. So what is there to be revealed here?

Ulster Bank did them relatively late - my parents used them for house deeds, on a registered folio so arguably a waste of money - but they cut the service quite some time ago.

O'Cuiv has a tenuous grasp on reality and modernity at the best of times, so it is entirely possible that he has proposed this bill without doing any background work to check that its actually worth doing.

Deeec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501162#Comment_120501162

As I understand it these boxes are completely different to the likes of your parents giving their deeds to the bank for safe keeping which was common place. It's unlikely your parents had their very own box just to hold deeds- just a file I would think.

These boxes/vaults are possibly from 1800s and could contain absolutely anything not just documents - basically anything valuable that needed to be kept safe - jewellery, cash, art etc. I would imagine it was only an option available to the reasonably well off. It may even be large city branches that offered this service.

The owners died off and the boxes were not claimed and just forgot about.

I remember hearing someone years back talking about all the unclaimed valuables in the vaults of the central bank - they said it was incredible the stuff that was in there.

I agree that o Cuiv may have a hidden agenda - it was mentioned that unclaimed valuables may go to museums so I don't think they will look hard to find relatives.

Mick Tator

I worked in banking many years ago and back then safe deposit boxes were quite common, often used to hold jewellery/valuables as security for loans. It often was used as a cheap way of storing them as the owners left them there and did not have to worry about insurance.

During the mid-late 1980’s a box was opened by a Cork bank. It had not been touched for 30+ years and was full of silver, at that time worth about £5,000. I followed the story because it had been owned by a person I’d written about (a local history project). The quest to find an owner eventually led to the discovery of a brother who AFAIR was in his 90’s.

Some years ago there were stories about old flintlock pistols and gunpowder being discovered in the vault of Bank of Ireland College Green Dublin but I never got proof/confirmation of this.

VirginiaB

I suppose my experience doesn't count as I'm in the US but safe deposit boxes are pretty common here. I have one and use it to store valuables when I'm away for any length of time. Also back-up flash drives of my genealogy research. My husband's maiden aunt died and hers contained some valuable jewelry which heirs were allowed to buy at a low, estate-value price. I think the state auctions off anything where heirs can't be found. And think of all the cash Whitey Bulger had stashed in safe deposit boxes in many places to fund his years on the run. He even had one in Dublin, according to the New York Times and other sources.

Unknownability

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120502042#Comment_120502042

What you're referring to in the last paragraph relates to when Bill Clinton visited College Green and is a true story.

Having been in the College Green valuts it is honestly amazing.

pinkypinky

I'm aware of a friend who had one until quite recently with AIB but when 2 branches merged, there was difficulty in establishing where it physically was now. There was a lot of hassle but ultimately they did get access and removed the contents.

The likes of the BOI vault in College Green could be exciting.

kildarejohn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120501162#Comment_120501162

I'm no expert, but just from Google I see that in 2022 Regulations were introduced requiring banks to keep registers of Safe Dep Boxes (mainly to control money laundering or criminals keeping assets). So registers are already there or at least in process of being completed. So the Minister probably has a very good idea how many boxes are there.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120504731#Comment_120504731

O Cuiv is a backbencher only, thankfully. It's very very plausible he hasn't got a clue

Lime Tree Farm

While going through my mother's paperwork we came across a Bank receipt slip for a safety deposit box. The bank refused to open it as it wasn't specifically mentioned in her will. They would only do so if requested by her solicitor. He sent them the required letter. The bank said that there was nothing in the box when it was opened. I found it all a bit strange.

Mick Tator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120504731#Comment_120504731

It predates 2022 by a decade or more. Anti Money Laundering has been high on the Central Bank's agenda for ages. the primary legislation is 'The Criminal Justice (Money Laundering and Terrorist Financing) Act 2010, as amended by Part 2 of the Criminal Justice Act 2013 and by the Criminal Justice (Money Laundering and Terrorist Financing) (Amendment) Act 2018" The degree of detail required by some financial regulatorsboth here and overseas is painful, for e.g. the EU passports don't show your address, so you also have to produce utility bills also. A whole industry has been built up around AML compliance.

Mick Tator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120502165#Comment_120502165

That's funny about poor old Whitey having a box in Dublin. I went to Boston regularly when the 'Big Dig' was underway and frequently a cabby would point out "That's where Whitey is buried". Everytime it was a different location!

jj880

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120500513#Comment_120500513

Could make a show out of it

https://youtu.be/U5_cwf6wONU

Used to watch Heir Hunters a good bit. Always interesting to see who gets the tin box!