Doing own forestry work

_Brian

more ramblings

Do any lads do their own forestry work. Sun out the fencing, mounding & planting.

on the face of it the forestry companies are gathering a large chunk of the forestry money up front, would it be worth or even possible to sub this work yourself and hold their portion of the profit.

Vittu

It's possible, whether it's worth it is another thing. You would still need a forester for the paperwork.

blue5000

I think most people get a contractor/forestry co to do the planting. I used a company to plant mine, they fenced it as well, no regrets. But if they are looking for a couple of years premium as well, I think that would be taking the piss.

It's important to get the drainage, layout and spacings right on day 1. What is your site like?

_Brian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120253141#Comment_120253141

“Potential site”, this isn’t a done deal by any accounts

it’s good actually, not my home farm here, 5ha so not massive. Maybe 1ha is dampish but the rest would be good quality land considering it’s Cavan. Just not farmed in any meaningful way in a long time.

I have a guy who is experienced at mounding etc. plenty of fencing contractors about so it got me wondering about the need to hand it over if more of the money could be retained on farm as it were

All reliant on the new payments rates, with the accelerated 10 year double payment it’s €2200/yr

Johnny pesco

In the same boat myself keeping an eye on the new forestry grant scheme thats coming up and wondering if I could do it myself with a forester and not engage a contractor or if there is even any benefit going this route?

893bet

We had 3-4 acres burned 30 years ago.

My father decided to replant it himself father than pay someone.

Never again he swore and he is a man that is made for hardship.

cute geoge

Any one planting reasonable land would want their head examined .If is not being farmed lease it out ,plenty of lads will tidy up the land for you and pay you on top and your land is still there in 10 years time .If its poor ground work away

timfromtang

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120258430#Comment_120258430

Hi Cute Geoge,

I fear I must disagree, perhaps I need my head examined?

From where comes the idea that only "poor land" is suitable for growing trees?

Is it perhaps an idea that farming is somehow more profitable/better than forestry?

Maybe its because we can easily imagine what to do with farmland, but struggle to imagine how to manage forested areas, we do not have the cultural experience of this after all.

As with many types of plants, different species of trees prefer to grow in different climatic conditions and on different soil types.

trees suited to "poor land" as you call it are not suited to better/reasonable land, and trees suited to better land.... you get the point

Fortunately for foresters in Ireland one species which grows on fairly poor land is quite profitable (Sitka).

Unfortunately for small forest owners it is difficult to add value to sitka before sale and you are tied to a few large sawmills as customers, and dependent on mechanical harvesters which make operations expensive. This has the result of making smaller parcels much less profitable to harvest and sometimes uneconomic.

If however a woman wanted to plant a different species to sitka on the same poor land she could too, she might perhaps choose willow and alder and supply coffin makers with materials for basket coffins, alder for the base and top boards and willow for the weave.

If however a man wanted to plant better land he'd have a much wider species choice, higher yields, and many more opportunities for non timber yields from the forest.

My Father (deceased) and I have backed up these ideas with action, we planted quality land (100 ac)(planted 1996,2001,2004,2012), we have 31 different varieties and species (hard and softwoods), we have many non timber outputs from our forest. We strive to add value to all timber products after harvest and before sale (for example Larch thinnings turned to fenceposts rather than sold cheaply for pulp)

tim

timfromtang

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120258421#Comment_120258421

Hi 893bet,

I concur,

we had a go at planting hardwoods in 1996 hardship indeed,

but hardship followed by regret when we noticed how much better the survival rate was from the pro planters and how much faster they were.

Since then we have always used "pro" planters and allowed the forestry co the maintenance grant and risk for the first 3-5 years.

Fencing sure if you can do it cheaper and better, Mounding perhaps.... although given my personal experience in managing a diverse forest that was largely mounded I'd avoid it if at all possible, mounding makes subsequent forest operations significantly more difficult, mound drains are a pain when you are walking or working in the forest.

Talk to your forester, rips or pit planting might suit your site and will make later management easier.

tim

Always.

Fcuked if I'm giving a sizeable portion of the grant away for something I can easily do myself.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120266532#Comment_120266532

I will add that you should know exactly what you are doing if you decide to do the job yourself.I've had on the face of it competent folk do their own planting only to see trees barely in the ground, or planted sideways, or sat on the surface with a sod of earth laid on the roots. Talk it over with your forester and a small area might be fine but leave the larger area to the professional.

_Brian

What sort of feeling to people have on when the new rates will be available to apply for ??

Johnny pesco

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120258430#Comment_120258430

Rent it for 500/ha a year if lucky or 2200/ha in premiums. If the proposed scheme is as good as it looks, it's a no brainer for me.

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120302519#Comment_120302519

For reasonable land 500ha is on the lower end of rent.

And forestry crushes the value of the land per acre.

So short term extra money. But long term potentially less value.

endainoz

I'm planning on planting my own agroforestry plot on 1.5 Ha, recently started working with a forrestry company planting so have a reasonable idea on how to do it. No doubt though, it's tough aul work.

tabby aspreme

Did my own planting here,6ha, no mounding, ripped it myself, planted, then had to remove 9000 ash for dieback, and replanted, and would do it all again if I had more land to plant, don't wreck yourself planting, plant 500 a day and then leave it till the next day, I welded a piece of 1 inch box iron on top of the spade to push against and put a point on the spade also, it made a big difference, tis well worn now

ppn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120303053#Comment_120303053

It may seem far away but the forest premium ends after 20 years Then what..... Surely something that needs to be looked at, otherwise carbon payments would be the way to go. Forestry is not for good farm land in its current format. Beware anyone that says otherwise.