[Advice] Career Dilemma

FinneganE99

Folks, I’m looking for some advice… I would really appreciate some input from current pilots. The summary is that I would appreciate any info on the lifestyle that being a short haul pilot brings in Europe these days.

Background: I work in finance, and already in my early 20s make a nice living for myself. If I were to stay in this industry I would be set for life, earning nice money - I would have an easy life in terms of finance and career stability, as well as work-life balance. But I don't really think the office life is for me long-term.

I have had a huge passion for flying since I was tiny and it hasn't gone away. I have some hours under my belt and hope to have a PPL in 1.5yrs. I am concerned at the idea of foregoing so much money to fund a modular route to the right hand seat, essentially putting me ~5-7 years behind where I would be if I stayed in my industry in terms of buying a house, car, having savings, all that. The financial hurdle is massive (not insurmountable), and I don't know if it's stupid going through this when I have so much earning potential as it is.

Do people find the job to actually be conducive to a healthy work-life balance? I see a lot of pilots that seem to dedicate their everything to it. Whilst that’s cool, I want to disconnect from it as well and live a normal life! Can you really live a life with a family and kids easily? I don’t see how 3-5am starts and 7-9pm bedtimes can work as a future Dad/partner - it really concerns me!

To narrow down my questions:

1. Is it generally a sustainable career in terms of work-life balance? (or can it be?).
2. I’m willing to forego the ground I’ve gained with where I’m at now to follow my (brace) “dream”... but I am concerned about the financing problems. Even though so many pilots do it, surely once you end up forking out for a type rating you can be crushed in terms of finances? In my case I'd be in my very late 20s with zero savings and a low enough income as an FO. How have people dealt with that?

I appreciate that following your dreams and all that is important, but I'm just trying to be realistic. Any wisdom, no matter how rambly, would be really appreciated from people who have weathered this path... Thank you so much!

Noxegon

There are two other data points with respect to family life – (a) the prospect of having to work for at least a few years in a different city/country to where you call your home, and (b) if working long haul, being away from home a lot.

sparrowcar

Work hard in Finance and fund yourself with a private light aircraft. Lots of free time and stability financially as you say to enjoy your own aircraft. Lots of options to rent, per hour, part own etc.

The career of being a pilot has hugely changed in recent years and not for the better. However, I rarely if ever come across miserable pilots so there is obviously a huge plus to the job.

If I had had the health to become a pilot my own little dream job would be the likes of flying the Aran Islands routes, getting to know my regular pax and operating those reliable little workhorses which have nice flying habits. Not exactly financially rewarding, but personally so. I got as far flying solo before failing a medical so that put paid to that. I do enjoy the odd flight in the well mannered Cessna 172 where supervising pilot allows me to conduct entire flight.

sailing

It all depends what you want in life. If it’s just a flying fix and you earn good money in Finance then maybe get yourself a PPL and a share in an aircraft.

I came from a Finance background many years ago into aviation. Have always wanted to be in aviation. Took lessons at a very young age, saving up doing weekend jobs etc. The 9-5 office job wasn’t for me post my degree.

My salary now would be similar to what a High Court Judge would be paid, maybe a little more. But it comes at a cost. I’ve missed so much over the years due to being away. I spend a lot of time in hotels every month, crossing different time zones and jet lag take their toll. I try to do things healthily when I’m away and it does make it easier.

The industry has changed over the years. You work a lot more. You spend more time away, including Christmas at times, you don’t have the weekends off like in most jobs. Having said all that, would I do anything different? Absolutely not. I don’t regret a single minute of starting out in this career.

donkey balls

If i was you I stay in finance built up savings and pension contributions(AVC if you are earning a lot) And get the PPL and see about doing the training modular.

My mate did it the modular route between flying in the US and here, When he qualified in 2011 he was set up for an interview with FR but that was cancelled

Due to pilots wanting to join a union so for 5 years he had no job as in flying, He went back doing engineering, And in 2016 got into FR..

My advise and I've had to do it myself during the last recession?Always have a back up plan in case things don't work out.

I no longer work in aviation and you do miss the buzz around it (I'm Monday to Friday man ) Again when working in aviation I was doing nights weekends early mornings and I missed out on a lot of things with friends.

Also the industry as a whole is very fickle just look back over the last 3 years, My mate was flying 1/2 sector's a month if he was lucky,Another mate of his went back driving artics just to pay the bills.

Myself personally would love to finish my training but as you get older parts start to fall of the body,

FinneganE99

Thanks for the responses guys.

It's a tough one alright. Like you say @sailing I find a lot of pilots do focus on some of the negative aspects, but then say that they wouldn't change it for the world. I can imagine the feeling.

@donkey balls Thanks for the reply. At least you can go far enough (PPL, hour building in the States for a change of scenery, ATPLs) before you need to hit the CPL, ME/IR, and essentially go past the point of no (easy) return. I think with the backup of a degree and professional qualification I wouldn't be overly worried about that side of things. More so the opportunity cost I'm having with giving up such a good career to change for the complete unknown (and I won't know for myself until I am sat flying on the line, we all have different ideas of what it's really like until we're doing it!). Anyways, on balance, I think that if I don't end up doing it I'll regret it for life, and I can always fall back into finance if it doesn't work out or isn't what I thought it was...

Anymore thoughts welcome

Noxegon

One more salient point I'd throw out there.

Do you really want to work for Michael O'Leary? :)

donkey balls

What about EI or ASL or Emerald ?

FinneganE99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120066689#Comment_120066689

Yeah would just have to hope that the timing of finishing training and one of them being hiring would work out.

martinsvi

Sorry to dig this one out from the dust, I don't visit this site very often but I think I can share my 2c

I'm not Irish, but have lived in Ireland for nearly a decade, I was a software engineer and at similar age as you, also being well off, when I wondered into the field of aviation. Much like yourself, the interest has always been there but initially I never really considered flying as a profession - partly because I always doubted myself and partly because at the time when I had enough money to go and comfortably do a PPL, aviation market was in shreds. Nobody was hiring, we are talking the outcomes of 2008 crash, late in the 2013-14 ish still the only people getting the jobs would be 1500h+ guys with either instructing time or those who got their hours in the likes of Botswana/Indonesia etc flying safaris.

So I went and did my PPL simply for myself with the ultimate goal of getting my own plane and flying around for fun. So I did. And the more I was flying the more I was realizing that for me the motivation to return to the office is dropping every minute. You could even say that my office job was blocking me from enjoying my flying - Irish weather can be tricky, in winters it can happen that for months you cannot have a single decent weekend with nice weather - so sometimes I had to ditch work simply because the sky cleared up on a workday... With expenses piling up on the aircraft I decided to sell it and put the money into CPL. It was a ridiculous idea at that time but I had to do it. I couldn't stand a thought that at some-point in the future I would be kicking myself for never following a dream.

I guess I could say that mindset was a bit different than yours. I wasn't looking at this as an investment that needs to be earned back. For some reason I have noticed this in people who come from finance sector - you have no problem spending 60k for a premium German car that will lose about 45k its value in first 5 years, but when it comes to pilot licenses, you have to have a solid business case behind it otherwise it is not worth it.

So I took my "BMW" money and spent it on a CPL with theory done remotely with Bristol and practical parts out in Greece. Let me tell you, even if I hadn't landed a job, these were the best months of my life. I've never felt so motivated, moved... the people you meet, the adventure. Would do it all again in the heart beat.

Fast forward - just as I finished my MCC, 2017, market turned overnight - suddenly I was in interviews with AerLingus, Ryanair, some cargo folks, some southern Europe operators, but I landed a job in my home country with a pretty decent operator flying a turboprop. Then covid came, I was let go. This is the part where having a second/previous career is super beneficial - went back to software engineering without a worry. You always have to keep in mind that aviation industry is very volatile. Upon any crisis it is the first one to shut down and last one to reopen. And reopen it did, after 2 years on the sidelines I have now moved on to a jet, for the same operator, better conditions, things are looking good. Generally you need to spend some good 5-7 years in any company and then you should be safe. Before that be ready to pack up any time.

About the work/life balance, it really depends on the operator -it is February, I have enough time to bore you with my life story only because I'm off more than I am at work (but I'm paid full salary anyway). It will change next month with summer schedule arriving. We do spend a lot of nights in outstations, some months it can be just 1 or 2, some months all the way to 20... but we have a bidding system through which we can impact what flights/rotations/layovers will get. That one not so pleasant layover for you might be a home town to your colleague so swapping works too. Other layovers can be quite nice, I have spent my fair share in some of the winter sun destinations. Similarly you can bid if you want earlies, lates, days off etc. I generally get weekends off as I prioritize them. Other colleagues go for different things so things work out for most people.

Generally only you have the answer - if having a settled life is more important - go for it. If following passion is more of your thing - do just that! Also keep in mind that this is not a binary thing, it's not strictly one path or another. I think I'm a living proof that you can keep one leg on each path for as long as you see one either collapsing or other one taking you to a place you like.

My last thought is this - you speak about disconnecting from your job and to be honest with you, aviation gives you exactly that! In an aircraft you close the door and leave it for the day, and that's it. You don't carry this work home. Most office workers don't have this luxury, most engineers, project managers, consultants etc have deadlines, meetings they need to prepare for, issues to solve... it never really is 9-to-5... I've had cases when my brain would still work on an issue and suddenly at 2am I have to jump out of bed just to write notes... crazy times... hopefully never again...

MarkN

Money is only one aspect OP. I was like you in my 20s, major obsession with it and apart from a lesson or two, didn’t pursue it. I’m now 41 and my circumstances have changed allowing me to financially train to fly but it’s a huge road ahead at a mad age to be starting. Just achieved a Class 1 today and the relief is immense but wish I’d done it 16/17 years ago. Don’t have regrets, there’ll always be a house to buy, there’ll always be another car, if you feel it is your dream job then don’t waste the next two decades wondering.

smurfjed

I guess that it comes down to what you really want to do with your life, there are so many different types of flying jobs, those that will get you home every night and those that will have you living in a hotel for 1-2 months without ever getting into the plane. The lifestyle can be very rewarding but very hard on family life, you really need a supportive partner.

But the challenges of going to a new country, new airport in a place that you would never visit by choice is such a challenge and so mentally rewarding.