Another Vogue Williams type plane incident.

Passenger wouldn't move to accommodate family on a flight. The mother started giving him abuse. He stood his ground. Fair f**ks to him for doing so.

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/flights-family-passenger-seat-plane-b2168614.html?utm_content=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=Main&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1663316095

Jequ0n

“The man claimed that his seats were changed a few days before the trip and that when he got through to the airline’s customer service, they said that the seats had been changed as a mother and baby needed them.”

If true this would have been the last time I’d have flown with this airline.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119625549#Comment_119625549

Yeah would you ask to speak to the manager too?

Strumms

If I book and pay to sit in seat 4A I expect to sit in it and so should anyone else who thinks ahead to acquire their own comforts by either paying or by checking in, in advance.

this IHKB (I have kids brigade) and their ‘22 levels of absolute entitlement has gone far enough…. kindly fûck off, the world doesn’t revolve around you, get the ferry instead, loads of room ;)

SuperBowserWorld

Why can't people book seats with their kids ?

Also, nobody cares about your kids except you. Hard truth.

Also, less flying as it contributes to climate change. So, people should not be flying with their kids at all, if they care about their kid's future.

People want their cake and eat it.

🤣🤣🤣

Wanderer2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119626440#Comment_119626440

Exactly. There is this horrible presumption that a single person giving up their seat to accomodate a family is as expected as holding a door open for someone. No way. If you want to sit with your kids or family then book it properly and if you dont have a seat next to them just put up with it.

Its not as if you dont see enough of your family anyway. You sleep with them and have to spend the next x number of years with them. Is it such a big deal to go a few hours without them??

SuperBowserWorld

When we flew with our kids we'd either book together or have them sit near us or at least together somewhere else on the plane.

But if you have one small kid then book together or very near each other. Eg across the aisle.

Edit

If this was a mother and a baby booking then ... a baby would not have its own seat OR the mother should have booked the seat when she was booking. OR who gives a crap 🤣

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119625599#Comment_119625599

Why should I be inconvenienced just because someone else feels the need to sit in a specific place which I already paid for? It’s not like you need a front row seat just because you are travelling with a **** screaming spawn.

elperello

I think that people should book seats together for their family.

Perhaps airlines should insist that people booking flights for children should book seats beside an adult companion.

I certainly wouldn't like to be put in a position where I was seated next to an unattended under age child.

Having said that I would move to facilitate someone who was stuck.

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119626816#Comment_119626816

Maybe they are deliberately “messing up” their bookings to have their kids sat elsewhere to enjoy some peace and quiet

I had an altercation on a plane before in a similar situation.

Two youngones get on the plane and some bint with a kid is sitting in their seats already. The older one checks her boarding pass a few times to make sure she's not mistaken and lets the 'lady' know that she's in the wrong spot. She immediately says "well I'm here now, you better go find other seats". The poor girls don't know what to say and are completely taken aback by the hostility.

Karen pipes up again "our original seats were in rows 15 and 19, you'll see the empty ones when you walk back, now piss off" and starts listening to music. At this stage, there's a huge hold up and the cabin crew comes over to see what's happening. Your woman changes completely, puts on a smile and says "well me and my son weren't sitting together and these two lovely girls very kindly offered to swap......here's our seat numbers, they are sitting in those now" and hands over HER boarding pass.

The crew member is turning to walk them back to their new seats when they both shoot each other a look that I've seen far too often growing up. It's 100% a "we're getting shafted here and we haven't got the confidence to do anything about it". The amount of times something like that happened me as a kid/teenager is not funny. So I stood up and collared the air hostess as she's going past.

"sorry, but what she's said is not true. They never agreed to anything, because she never asked. When they got on, she was already in their seats and told them to piss off when it was pointed out to her. Now she's acting as if it's all one big misunderstanding when she orchestrated the whole thing." Your wan starts telling me to mind my own business when some little old hero in the third seat in their row backs me up. She says "yeah, he's right. You never asked them anything and now you're trying to bully them into swapping. using your own kids like that is shameful". The husband then shows up and claims "he's too young to be sitting on his own", but our hero in seat 3 says "should've paid for your seats, so". Legend.

The crew member turns to the older girl and asks her if she minds swapping. She looks like she's about to say she doesn't mind, when the younger of the two pipes up and says she doesn't wanna be sat on her own. The two girls get their original seats in the end.

About halfway through the flight I went to the jacks and the front one was busy, so had to go down the rear of the plane. Cue your woman in the middle seat in row 15 and the husband in the middle seat in row 19, both giving me the filthiest looks ever. Never did see where the little one ended up. My guess is there were 4 of them and the auldfella was sitting beside the other kid, and had to put both kids together in the end.

Archeron

I imagine Vogue will be delighted to see this particular type of mid air wankeriness has been named in her honor.

Subzero3

Ryanair make you pay at the time of booking so you have no choice to book a seat next to the kids. Maybe other airlines should copy.

ButtersSuki

As a parent I simply cannot understand why any other parent would not book their child/children into the seats/seats beside them when flying.

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119626816#Comment_119626816

I’d agree with you there, E, but there are times when people book tickets that turn out to be “unsuitable” for kids. Like the emergency exits.

Was on a flight before where this happened. The family had booked but weren’t aware of the emergency exits. On this occasion the flight attendant asked a man in another row if he would switch. He gave a firm no, kind of expected it considering the guy was wearing cargo shorts and a band T-shirt. He seemed to enjoy dismissing the request, allowed himself a little smirk.

Anyway, long story short, I moved seats and got a few freebies from the attendance and a lot of thanks from the parents. I actually think the flight attendants were overly generous to me just to “irk” the grump who wasn’t for moving. A few of the items I received gratis were, suddenly, unavailable when he asked. Karma, I suppose.

ButtersSuki

I was flying to Barcelona alone a few years ago and I was sitting in the Emergency Exit Row Seat I had paid for. When I got to my seat there was a father and 2 kids sitting there. I politely and apologetically said "I think you may be seated in the wrong seats" to the father as the children were much to young to be seated in that row, and he was in my seat. Cue him semi-aggressively saying "Can you not sit somewhere else?"; and I explained that no, I couldn't and given my height (I'm just over 6'6") it's actually nigh on impossible for me to sit in "regular" rows. So he moves with audible sighing and tutting and an under his breath "For fux sake" to the row just behind me - which as it tuned out wasn't his row either. Then his daughter starts kicking my seat from behind - not once or twice but non-stop. So I asked him could he please ask her to stop doing this and he screams "she's only 8!" at me. 8? WTF? That's much too old for a child to be behaving like that. So with his scream the air hostess comes down and asks what's going on and how can she help etc. And he starts "this lanky pr*ck here made me move and now he's givin' out to me daughter" pointing at me. I said "you were in my seat, and I asked your daughter to stop kicking my seat from behind without once shouting or raising my voice". So she asks him to refrain from using bad language and asks to see his tickets. Of course he hadn't booked them together to save what - a tenner? And then just wanted to bully his way into taking someone else's seat. Not only that, but he wanted the extra legroom seats too - which the children couldn't even sit in. So the air hostess said she'd try to accommodate him but couldn't guarantee it. Eventually she did manage to get some people to swap, but again the sense of entitlement and "I'll do whatever I want" from this lad was unreal. She did say to me afterwards that this type of behaviour is quite common these days.

At the baggage carousel he stood facing me staring at me I assume trying to intimidate me in some way as his little angels ran around crashing luggage trolleys into each other like bumper cars. A lovely man, I hope to see him again some day.

ThreeGreens

A comment from the linked article hit the nail on the head

"If it was really about sitting together, why didn’t they ask the people 20 rows back if they’d like the better seats upfront? They’d still all be together"

If the family had a number of seats at the front and were one short, why didn't they offer those seats to someone further back in the same row that the other parent was in. It's much easier to get someone to do something if they are getting an "upgraded" seat (at least one at the front with more leg room and quicker to get off the aircraft even if in the same class).

Clearly they wanted the "upgrade" rather than willing to offer it to someone else in return for the inconvenience.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627021#Comment_119627021

An absolute toe rag he sounds like!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119626978#Comment_119626978

Agreed. I thought this was common practice these days. I travelled with an infant recently and wasn't allowed book seats unless one of them was a window seat. Not sure what happens when they're all gone.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119626983#Comment_119626983

A ghastly combination of being scabby baxtards who don't want to pay for something and being pig-ignorant enough to be able to bully others to do what you want them to do. Years of not having anyone stand up to them means they're as brazen as can be and couldn't give a monkeys about stuff that would cause a regular person to die of embarassment. They just do not give a flying ffffff.......

The only way is to stand up to them, shine a light on their behaviour and sometimes they back down. I've called people out for making inappropriate jokes and comments before.

A simple "what was that, hmm?" and they're left floundering for words.

"ehh, don't worry about it, twas just a joke"

"oooh, I love jokes, try me....?"

"uhhhhh......"

"Go ahead, repeat what you said, we can all have a chat about it then and see if it's funny"

"......"

ButtersSuki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627086#Comment_119627086

He was a delightful individual alright.

Riddle101

I f*cking hate the chancers who take people's seats on transports and then start giving people sh*t when they're called out because of it or reluctantly move when confronted. Like they know it's not their seat but act some damn self-entitled at the same time. I've had similar experiences with these types of people years ago on the trains and it's made me hate these people with a passion. The article in the OP and the story about Vogue Williams is no different. Just people who act some damn self-entitled and then get disrespectful when they don't get their way. F*ck them all.

thegame983

People think having kids with them is a free pass to inconvenience others.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627336#Comment_119627336

It really has got to that stage

you probably see a mother and child Q for security screening at the airport soon.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627011#Comment_119627011

Yes there does seem to be some misunderstanding among the travelling public about the emergency exit seats.

I once witnessed a woman who had successfully managed to get her elderly mother onboard from a wheelchair putting up a long battle with cabin crew to be allowed to seat her in in an emergency exit seat.

Anyway as you found out virtue can be it's own reward and just going with the flow can be the best way.

As for me, I go into a state of almost zen calm from the time I enter an airport until I exit at my destination (hopefully).

I allow nothing to upset me and go along with any instruction or request.

Potential-Monke

Just +1'ing that people with kids who think they should have automatic entitlement can get fcuked. Kids are your problem, no one elses. Be a parent.

Spanish Eyes

Knowing the rules is a good start. On a flight a few years ago to London City Airport a crew member offered to upgrade us to an exit row seat. Nice.... except I had a broken foot and was in one of those mad boot things. I said thank you so much but I don't think I'd be allowed in the exit row with this thing on my leg! Crew member thanked me for saying it and not chancing things.

We got free champagne (or prosecco or something) and goodies all the way across. Had to neck it quick as the flight was only an hour. I don't think that route operates anymore, it was a dream for getting to London.

ButtersSuki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119628643#Comment_119628643

You can still fly into London City, I was there last week.

Funnily enough I was actually on a flight back to Dublin from there a few years ago….and Vogue herself - pre kids - was also on it. Small world.

rob316

Pay the tenner to sit together ya scabs and theres no problem then. I have 2 kids they aren't a free pass to inconvenience others, if you were sincere and polite I'd gladly accommodate but entitlement I hate.

anewme

Think most people would be amenable to change seats in case of emergency. I did swop mid flight with a lad on a flight in Vietnam. I was aisle and the lad was window. It was clear he was unwell. I asked him did he want to swop to have easier access. I don’t think he would have asked himself, but was delighted.

But the others who just sit in peoples seat or try to get you to swop to a crap seat are another story.

I find others are too polite with these people and try to over explain themselves.

Would you like to swop seats. “No.”

and that’s it. No need to say you need the seat because of x,y,z. You don’t owe them an explanation and by doing so allows them an opportunity to argue back which can escalate the situation. By just saying, “No, I’ll stay here”, conversation closed.

lawred2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627655#Comment_119627655

It really hasn't

Ignorant entitled people were that way before kids and will remain to be so long after their kids have grown up

Spanish Eyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119629733#Comment_119629733

That's good to know thanks. What airline, is it BA? Just did a rather confusing search there and none the wiser!

ButtersSuki

Yes. BA.

mailforkev

BA. London City is very handy, you don’t even need to take your liquids out of your bag going through security these days.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119629972#Comment_119629972

the parent and entitlement IGK gang in my experience being absolutely pricks has really shot forward the last decade…. In terms of how routinely and frequently people have to suffer them and their entitled antics.

you’ve got it in travel experience and scenarios of as discussing here, in workplaces as relates to shifts and more besides….which I’ve seen happening with my own eyes..

Naos

How does crap like this make it into the news? It's an article on a reddit post that was posted nearly 2 weeks ago. Crazy.

anewme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119631878#Comment_119631878

The same thing has been regurgited in many forms over the past couple of years.

Lazy journalism, robbing rubbish from the likes of Reddit, Mumsnet etc.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119629972#Comment_119629972

I think people HAVE become more self entitled. Yes of course there have always been self entitled types but I think it's worse now due to: the "boom", then the recession making people angry, then Covid making people angry, now the inflation hike making people angry. And polarisation via Twitter and Facebook and the tabloids. Just a theory.

I could be wrong, but it seems to be what I'm observing.

The absolute scumbags in the anecdotes here are just disgusting.

Don't give a fack about vogue Williams or anyone else. Will give up my seat if it doesn't effect me and can help someone else out or accommodate someone else but if it doesn't suit me I won't..it's a fuckin crappy seat....who cares?

Jequ0n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119631833#Comment_119631833

Totally agree with the last paragraph regarding workplace behaviour. And then they wonder why they don’t get that promotion and cry discrimination, because it can’t possibly be that they are less efficient than your colleagues who do more work. It’s a joke.

AckwelFoley

I'd likely give up my seat. I don't feel like I'd want to babysit someone else's child on a flight. ..First time on a aeroplane timmy?

Yes.

2 mins later timmy goes pale

Timmy barfs all over my tray.

Thanks timmy, meanwhile mammy and daddy, childfree in row Z are having flashbacks to their honeymoon while I'm having flash backs to Thursday nights in college with the smell of puke.

Larbre34

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119632653#Comment_119632653

No, you're absolutely correct in my opinion.

The basic decency and manners - even while dealing with a grievance - that I saw from my parents and grandparents, is fast disappearing.

People are becoming very poor communicators, for many reasons and it leads to the type of interactions that we're discussing here.

And I regret the person it has made me frankly. I would always have had great patience and been very slow to anger, but more and more I see these interactions, these displays of entitlement, harassment, unnecessary anger and I end up intervening where people are receiving entirely unjustifiable abuse.

My wife told me she wanted to see no more of it, when I was almost detained in the Airport early this summer for weighing in where a young woman was being verbally harassed.

It's funny that air travel is nearly always involved!

It's funny that air travel is nearly always involved

People turn into animals in the airport. Like a bucket of crabs clawing at each other, trying to gain even the most insignificant of advantages over each other, it's quite frightening. Watch how they crowd around the baggage carousel next time, blocking everyone else's view so that nobody else can shuffle in front of them. I shudder to think what it would be like in a real emergency.

Flew home from Faro once and the shuttle out to the plane is almost full. Only pax left to get on are an elderly couple and a young lady with two kids in tow. They look like they're all in the one family. We're near the front of the bus, doors are in the middle. Young lady is trying to stop kid 1 from running away while holding the infant in her hands and fold the buggy at the same time. Nobody even hints at making a move to help her.

I say to the missus, in a loud enough voice that they can all hear me, "You'd think someone near the doors would give her a hand".......followed by loads of silence and looking out the windows. "I s'pose I'll have to do it so".....so I start pushing past others to get out and assist her. As I'm getting off, the two ladies sitting just inside the door stand up and move further into the bus, presumably to let the old couple sit down.

I tell her to get on, fold the buggy, then get back on with buggy in hand as she's completely overloaded already. While I was off, two pricks in golf gear had bailed into the seats vacated by the two ladies, leaving the pensioners to stand (they weren't with the lady and kids). I'm about to start giving them grief when someone else scolds them into letting the lady and kids sit down. They agree reluctantly. I have to move towards the back of the bus and it's then that I spy some sh1tebag with his hand luggage on the seat beside him, airpods in, staring out the window. This sends me over the edge.

I tell him to move the bag and he points at the earphones. I tell him again, in a loud enough voice that the whole bus can hear, him included. He takes one out and says "sorry?", so I tell him if he doesn't move the bag so I can sit down, it's getting fcuked out onto the runway. He starts mumbling but moves it. I gave the seat to the wife from the elderly couple mentioned earlier.

The bus takes off and 90 seconds later we're all getting off to get on the bleeding plane. Took me longer to figure out how to fold the buggy.

Hell is other people and the airport is like the 7th circle.

facehugger99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119633209#Comment_119633209

Timmy, do you like movies about gladiators?

When I flew to Guernsey earlier this year the senior of the two flight attendants deemed that the aircraft was unevenly balanced for flight on the turboprop, so a big swap around was ordered or else the airplane couldn’t fly, simple as. Apparently some cancellations had arisen causing the imbalance. It necessitated dividing people up whether they liked it or not for the short flight.

I remember bringing my elderly mother on the quick flight to the Aran Islands, she wasn’t used to light aircraft and I’m sure she would have appreciated sitting next. She was a tiny woman so put on the rear most seat by herself without a window, often used for parcels.

Also flying back from Lisbon a fortnight or so ago, there was an elderly man by the emergency exit and when the flight attendant asked him did he feel able to operate the exit in the event of an emergency he just stared blankly, totally confused, so they got him to swap with a big strong young guy. On booking systems it should be flagged in a big orange pop-up box “I am capable of operating an aircraft emergency exit…” and not be seen just as a means of getting more money from passengers.

Brucie Bonus

I like an aisle seat and book an aisle seat. If I'm asked to switch I don't mind, once its for another aisle seat.

I was on a flight once were this child was roaring and crying. It was a nightmare, but **** happens. The gombeen beside me smelled of drink and kept turning around to give the mother dirty looks. Complete arsehole.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119630791#Comment_119630791

I use to fly that route a lot BA to London city as I had an ex who lived in London. The staff were always lovely, they used to give me a wee bottle or two of prosecco when I was leaving ha.

rosmatt

I flew transatlantic with a child a couple of months ago. I did not pay to get adjacent seats because airline policy stated we would automatically be placed together. So if the airline bumped people out of 'our' seats to allow that to happen, I wouldn't have known about it. I would've been just like the woman in the article who boarded and found people sitting in the seats assigned to her and her child per her boarding passes. I would've kicked up a stink, just like her. Would I have been in the wrong? I don't think so.