Saorview reception near Ardglass

c2r

Hi all,

I'm new here having found this forum while searching for TV reception advice.

I've recently moved home and live near Ardglass and wondered if anyone had any experience with Soarview reception in this area. I can just about get RTE from Black Mountain and BBC etc. from Divis using a relatively rubbish aerial that came with the house - but obviously RTE is only in Standard Def which is rubbish for sport.

None of the nearby houses have got aerials pointing at Clermont - it looks from the map that Slieve Donard is pretty much directly in the line of sight.

It looks like some houses have massive horizontally aligned aerials pointing at Kippure - but I'd say that these look like VHF aerials.

Has anyone had any success with getting RTE across the sea from Kippure? the radiation pattern map on ukfree.tv seems to indicate that it is possible as it shows some green in the coastal area between St John's Point, Downpatrick, and Strangford

Thanks in advance,

Chris

coylemj

Would the OP have any chance of getting a decent signal from the 200W Saorview transmitter in Greenore? Distance from Ardglass is 43 kms.

It's possible that the east side of the Slieve Donard range (where it comes out to the coast, south of Newcastle) could block the signal from being received in Ardglass but it might be worth giving it a go.

Elvis Hammond

The Greenore mast is practically at sea level, & probably radiates next to no signal northwards, so waste of time, I'd imagine. Kippure could be worth a shot, though I'm not sure of the situation WRT potential co-channel problems.

c2r

Thanks all, yes, I think Greenore might be a non starter because itts so low and the Mournes are still a bit in the way - as is St John's Point itself.

Three Rock is also a non starter because it transmits on the same frequencies as Divis, but Kippure might be ok - I wonder if, again, St John's Point is too high though... It doesn't look like anything from GB's west coast transmits on 34 or 35....

Perhaps it's easier to put a dish up instead and point it at Saorsat, though I'd rather not if I can avoid it as I'm guessing I'd need a fairly big one here in south down like 80cm?

Elvis Hammond

Darvel (Ayrshire) & Winter Hill (serves Manchester) are high powered transmitters that use those freqs. but would only cause occasional problems.

Saorsat I'd say would need more like a 100cm dish.

c2r

Just to close off this thread - in the end I managed to get reception from Kippure using a XB16 type aerial pointed across the sea.

bagonua

That's really interesting. Reception over water can be tricky, is it working reliably? What sort of signal strength / quality are you getting?

c2r

It seems to be over the last few weeks - it says 100% quality, but the TV I've got it connected to doesn't seem to have any further information about the underlying strength - I've got some additional internal wiring to do to connect the lead to the main distribution system, and some of the other devices give an improved breakdown...

Digifriendly

Glad you can get Saorview as most sports on RTE2 are geo blocked on NIMM from local NI transmitters e.g. Black Mountain/Carnmoney/Newcastle.

c2r

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121039735#Comment_121039735

Yes, because it's not from an NI transmitter, so you get all the programming from the south on RTE, as well as Virgin Media, etc. etc.

Other houses, from Downpatrick, you can see they've got vertically aligned aerials pointing at Clermont Carn to achieve the same results - but for Ardglass the High Mournes are in the way and are higher than Clermont.

mrdtv2010

That is an interesting reception area I am familiar with from years ago. Along that stretch of coast pre-DSO Three Rock was reliable as there were no CCI issues with Divis. The switch to high power post 700Mhz transmissions has made the situation more complicated. Kippure is now effectively a Group A station which has better propagation characteristics across sea paths, the ERP is high and COFDM has good antifading characteristics and its a very high site. The only snag in the ointment is that Winter Hill is now also a Group A station cochannel with Kippure. However depending on the location there could be useful shielding provided by the Isle Of Man between that reception location and any ERP restrictions in place at Winter Hill. In East Down round Strangford and the Ards peninsula there are regular signals from Cambret Hill, Caldbeck, the IOM repeaters and Moel-y-Parc. These too will suffer from CCI due to the much more crowded UHF spectrum post 800Mhz clearance. Clermont Carn provides very good signals to East Down and the Ards peninsula where the Mournes are not an issue. Prior to DSO Strangford and South Down could use either Kippure VHF or in favoured locations Three Rock. A very interesting reception find and hope it holds up in the exceptional tropospheric conditions. Of course there are other means to receive RTE and the Virgin channels but these are outside the scope of this thread and not free...

sbranagh

I have been looking recently and found this thread.

I am based on the east side of Downpatrick (heading out toward Ardglass) and had put an aerial on Clermont Carn a while back after it was moved down to B band.

I used an XG9BK with masthead amp. It worked but the signal was never great and I would often lose it completely in very clear weather. Looking at the line of sight 90% is blocked by the Mournes.

Within the past few months I lost it almost completely so I took the aerial down and checked over everything. Unable to see any issues I gave up on Saorview and decided to try an 80cm dish on 9 East KA instead. This works perfectly but Saorsat is nowhere near as good as Saorview with half as many channels and TG4 not even in HD etc. Some sport is also blocked which I wasn't expecting as the service is primarily for people in the South.

Anyway, I never even though of Kippure for Saorview before even though I remember pointing the old VHF band 3 aerial at it many years ago.

Interested if this is still working reliably in Ardglass and if a masthead amp was used?

Ultimately I am going to give it a go over the next few days anyway.

Glaceon

I remember staying at a B&B in Downpatrick during the analogue days and they had a VHF aerial towards Kippure. Can't say if UHF goes that far but definitely worth a go. UHF channels 34 and 35.

sbranagh

That works, even with the aerial in the loft. Although only with my Satlink ST-5150 meter.

I use USB DVBT2 tuners in a raspberry Pi for my terrestrial channels and those tuners are not getting a lock. No doubt if I put the aerial back outside they will be fine.

sbranagh

The USB Tuners actually work fine. That was a config error on my part. So far reception from Kippure with the aerial in the loft is much more stable than I ever had from Clermont Carn when the aerial was outside. I wish I had thought of this sooner, at least before installing a dish on 9 East! 😂

I was always aware of the old VHF service being available from Kippure but it never crossed my mind as an option for UHF. Mainly because of the distance and every aerial in the area points at Clermont Carn.

Thank you for bringing it to my attention in this thread.

mrdtv2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121273352#Comment_121273352

Result!!! Actually after my earlier contribution upthread I checked the Saorview postcode checker for Minerstown on the coast in that area. The predicted coverage is from Kippure and reported as good. I am not surprised by your result: virtually straight seapath to flattish terrain, high HAAT at Kippure, decent ERP, and probably clipped radiation patterns from UK mainland cochannel interferers. Enjoy.

sbranagh

I wonder possibly was Clermont Carn better in the Downpatrick area back in the analogue days.

There has to be a reason why every house in the area, including ours when we bought have aerials pointed at Clermont Carn.

The only aerials pointed at Kippure are the old VHF ones that people haven't taken down. I have never seen any UHF pointed that direction.

Glaceon

VHF only carried RTE 1 and 2, so if someone wanted TG4 or TV3 they'd need UHF. Maybe Kippure analogue UHF wasn't watchable but Clermont Carn was?

sbranagh

Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking.

Kippure is definitely much better for Saorview now though at least here on the east side of Downpatrick. I don't think you would need to go very far west of here though to get a better view of Clermont Carn past the western Mournes. Interestingly according to the Saorview coverage checker, if I put my postcode in it suggests Kippure but if I put in a postcode about a mile away on the west side of the town it comes back with Clermont Carn. I guess at some point heading a little west the Mournes would start to block Kippure instead. Interesting.

TAFKAlawhec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121277397#Comment_121277397

I'd have reckoned the following...

(a) Up until around the mid-late 90's, the majority of colour televisions & VCR's sold in NI would have had UHF tuners in them only (especially those sold in British chain & department stores) . Therefore if a usable UHF source for RTÉ TV reception was practical then this would have likely been sought, as it would have meant less headaches when shopping around for such appliances.

(b) The UHF frequencies used at Kippure for analogue TV3 & TG4 were Co-channel with that for the Newcastle relay which despite using opposite polarisation might have caused issues, leaving potential usable reception of both channels coming only from Clermont Carn.

sbranagh

Yeah, makes sense and that's what I remember; all the TVs we had growing up that I can remember only had UHF tuners. I wasn't even aware that VHF was a thing for TV until the early 2000s when I looked into it before installing a VHF aerial pointed at Kippure for my mum. I remember having to confirm that her TV had a VHF tuner because most didn't.

c2r

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121280207#Comment_121280207

Glad this thread has helped you - yes, Clermont is definitely blocked by the mournes when East of Downpatrick - I also tried for ages to get it working before I thought again about the sea path to Kippure. I think anywhere west of here though Clermont is so much closer that it makes sense - Kippure must about 130km away!

Interested that you've managed to get saorsat working on an 80cm dish though - I might give that a go myself, just for interests point of view (and I've got a spare input on my multiswitch!) - I'd assumed that I'd need a 1.1m dish so hadn't bothered up to now with it.

sbranagh

Yeah, Soarsat works fine here on an 80cm dish. I suffered a little rain fade recently but it was during some seriously heavy rain. I think KA is just a bit more more susceptible than KU in that regard.

I also added a little bracket and a KU lnb to also get 28 east on the same dish because I had an extra cable and tuner available on my Sat>IP server. Useful for ITV 2,3,4 in HD which are not available on DVBT.

Saorsat is poor compared to Saorview. No Virgin Media channels and TG4 is still in SD. There are also blackouts on sport like the rugby world cup and champions league.