Accountant or solicitor

Newanda

Hi, judge me as you like- I’m looking for advice.

Husband has been up to very dirty tricks emotionally and financially. Have found multiple judgment mortgages have been put on the home by revenue and other agencies ie gambling and business issues gone wrong. Mortgage approx 80k , his debts approx 60k (judgement mortgages).

I want to secure the money I have managed to squirrel away over the years. Either way- what’s the best way to hide 50-100k to secure future for me and kids- older teenagers and one adult child

I have also bought the family cars from my own cash. He says these are “ours”. Can I put any in kids names?

I want to act now before it’s too late and before he realises how much I know.

TIA

skallywag

Where is this money currently, and is your husband aware of it's existence?

Newanda

He’s aware of approx 10-20k.

it’s in following -my own bank accounts sole name, credit union own name and state savings own name. Am petrified he’ll get to.

When you apply for separation or divorce you will have to provide bank statements for all of your accounts for a number of years. I am not sure how back will be requested but if he suspects any thing he can ask for multiple years bank statements which means there is likely to be a paper trail of you moving funds.

It is a very large amount of money to hide, its not as if you can take out cash every week, claim you spent it and lodge it to a different account. Unless you have years before your separation etc.

You could set up a trust fund for your children but i do not know if you can access that before they are 18 or if he will be entitled to some of it when they access it.

At the end of the day he is entitled to up to half of all assets and you are liable for half of all debts. His debts are your debts, your assets are his assets.

I would assume your children would have to be a legal age to drive before you can transfer cars to them but i am a not expert.

Thank fully you have enough funds to hire a good solicitor and account to help you!

"At the end of the day he is entitled to up to half of all assets and you are liable for half of all debts. His debts are your debts, your assets are his assets."

I think there could be some nuances in that. "Proper Provision" can be very flexible. Read from p. 8 onwards in this 2019 Law Society report: https://www.lawsociety.ie/globalassets/documents/submissions/divorce-in-ireland-april-2019.pdf

Further, my understanding is that in Irish law there is a thing called "presumption of advancement" which is explicitly sexist against men. She might, therefore, get to keep everything by virtue of being the woman (it would almost certainly lead to a constitutional challenge, however). The Law Reform Commission has this to say about it: "Under present law, the position is that, normally, where a man purchases property in the name of his wife or transfers property to his wife, it is presumed that he intends to make a gift of the property to the wife. This is because of the equitable presumption of advancement. As the presumption appears to have applied only where a husband made the purchase, it may well involve discrimination proscribed by the Constitution." [https://www.lawreform.ie/_fileupload/Reports/rLRC1.htm]

However, "The general principle was stated by Malins VC in Re Eekyn’s Trust: ‘The law of this Court is perfectly settled that when a husband transfers money or other property into the name of his wife only, then the presumption is, that it is intended as a gift or advancement to the wife absolutely at once.’(1877) 6 Ch D 115, 118. The Irish courts today still proceed on the basis that the presumption of advancement applies prima facie unless it can be rebutted by evidence which demonstrates a di#erent intention. See H. Biehler, Equity and the Law of Trusts in Ireland (Thomas Roundhall, 2016) 181-184. Again, however, the logic of the Supreme Court’s decisions in The State (Director of Public Prosecutions) v Walsh (No.2) [1981] IR and McKinley v Minister for Defence [1992] 2 IR 333 suggests that the presumption of advancement must either work in a gender neutral fashion or else be found unconstitutional as contrary to Article 40.1."

daithi7

Big proviso, I'm not a solicitor or accountant.

Possible solutions:

Put it into your /a pension maybe, or otherwise into an investment such as a property, etc.

Given that you'll likely be losing income & support, a yielding investment may be left with you in a settlement.

Other possible solutions

- Gift to the kids

- Trust for the kids

Etc, etc

Don't try to hide this though as you'll be found out imho.

Newanda

Thank you…

1- I have a pension, he has a very small one. I thought I read where my pension is halved to him if it get legal.

2- I wondered about CAT to kids, 3K a year and wondered could I put it in retrospectively? Kids have indicated that they would withdraw as needs be so effectively I could still use it. They are aware of the situation as we have all been impacted with his gambling

tjhook

I think you need to talk with a solicitor or accountant, or better still, a specialist who knows both. I imagine a judge won't look kindly on one spouse putting significant funds out of reach in the run-up to the court case. They see it as their job to make those decisions. But somebody who knows what they're talking about (i.e. not me) can advise you better.

Seve OB

so you are calling out your hubby for dirty tricks while at the same time only told him about 10-20% of your savings! 🤣

Anyway, the €3k is a tax free per year gift. you can give it to anyone and not just your kids. you could give each of your kids €3k straight away. Do it again once 2023 rolls around.

You can give each kid up to €320k tax free, but this is a lifetime limit. so eg if you give one kid 100k now, €50k in 2 years time and leave them with €200k(cash/assets) when you die the total would be €350k. they will pay CAT on €30k

putting it in a pension etc doesnt mean he can't get it so ignore that advice. any assets you own include pensions/investments and everything must be declared

you dont really have much choice here but to declare your savings, but i guess you don't actually have to do that until anything official happens

Newanda

Thanks - I want to get my ducks in a row.

Yes, he possibly knows only of 20-30% of my savings for a reason.

This is our second mortgage on the house. He started numerous businesses notching up loans of 100k+ Which are cleared only to restart shenanigans again. We are now at 60k and 80k mortgage when we should have been long clear of it seen as we are both on decent incomes

A few K on the horses in a week is nothing to him and his pal that has a book going on.

So rather than run away screaming and crying - I stopped clearing his debts and let him self limit. He now can’t get a loan. Meanwhile- I’ve been working and saving as much as possible. the time for running will come

My address on the property registry was vague so I wasn’t getting notifications of judgement mortgages. I think it was deliberately vague and his one correct. I have corrected that. Wondering what else I need to do?

You are free to judge and I am appreciative for the guidance though. Some of us are making the best of what we got and what we’ve gotten ourselves in to, I’m not blaming anyone but ourselves and I’m trying to get out of it so any heads up is welcomed.

Widdensushi

Don't disclose anything you are not going to disclose to him to your solicitor, it will put them in a bad situation, if you are going to be dishonest they can't know about it.

mickdw

That money is all officially visible so he will surely claim half.

I'd be getting proper advice to try to put it beyond him. I'd also be taking out money at a believable rate to claim it's spent and properly hiding it.

Transferring shared assets to children is surely not a runner without his permission.

If you have to, take a holiday in Vegas and withdraw about 20k before you go and make that money disappear.

Newanda

Thank you.

Taking it out at a believeable rate is possible- however- I don’t know how to do the second part- hiding it properly. That’s what I need advice on.

re Vegas - he has done that to creditors in past. I Think he might be keeping it as in option to use on me in time.

Wabbit Ears

Go Speak to a solicitor who had a good track record for Divorces. they really are going to do their best to help you. be honest with them and follow their advice for teh best return from this.

I don't think you're being realistic in wanting to hide your savings. They are in accounts so there is a paper trail. Have your solicitor advice you on a realistic amount you will come away with and see if that's a deal breaker or not before proceeding.

laoisgem

I've no advice to offer OP but just wanted to say that I'm sorry you are going through this. Any addiction has such a rippling effect on families.

Newanda

Thank you for the kind words- I’m in a really bad place.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119386237#Comment_119386237

All you need to do is open a credit union account that he will not know about. Go paperless so no bills come to the house, use a new email address and only access it from a device he will not use. Clear your browser history after so if he does go snooping it will not show up.

Get in the practice of using cash as much as possible instead of tapping your card. Pay for shopping with cash and put some of the cash you withdrew for that in your account. Don't take out overly large sums as this will be a red flag.

Saying all of that, at some stage he may get to see your bank accounts so you may have to explain how you spent a large amount in cash over a few years. It's all very cloak and dagger and may prove stressful. As advised by an earlier poster, its better getting advise and seeing what you would be due to pay your husband.

Seve OB

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119386903#Comment_119386903

Yes get proper advice and don’t be listening to this kind of drivel

Newanda

I have spoken briefly with a solicitor who says, in short if I understand correctly

-keep as much of my finances separate as possible re his debts becoming mine.

-spend what I can/need to including redirecting needed funds. I assume where possible to kids/others.

-if I’m found out as dishonest on an affidavit of means it could go seriously against me.

I’ve learnt here - re credit union option and possible CAT for kids from my own funds, cashback options, working with cash.

If I have prize bonds and don’t declare them can I be found out?