Car Purchase History Check

Peter256

I was viewing cars on Done Deal recently. Finally decided on a nice clean 2011 Honda listed with 1 previous owner. The add also lists the car spec features and says that it has been reduced the asking price and no offers.

When I did a car tell history check under the amount of owners it states that there is 3 owners not 1. It had 2 previous owners up until January this year when it was then sold to the latest owner who is under garage. I didn't know the owner was a dealer as his add is down as private on Done Deal and it is the only add he has on there.

Now I am a bit suspicious about the car even though everything else seems to be ok on the history check.

Is it still possible for the car to be genuine or should I stay clear.

Peter256

Just to update the man who is selling the car has informed me that the reason why it is showing current owner as trade sale is that he was going to trade the car for a new car in a garage but he didn't get good enough deal so he has decided to sell it private. And he also said that he has the log book.

I am thinking now would there still not be a problem here for a new ownership change if the car is still down as a garage as current owner ?

User1998

1 previous owner means it has two owners in total. Garage owners don’t count towards the total number of owners so the car is infact 1 previous owner.

That story is highly unlikely. A garage wouldn’t transfer the car ownership until after the deal was done.

The seller is a trader and is listing as a private seller to avoid giving warranty etc.

There won’t be any problem with the change of ownership. You just sign the logbook like normal and a new logbook will be sent out.

Eyes wide open if you do go ahead with a viewing. I’d recommend a mechanical inspection

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119345210#Comment_119345210

Maybe I should question him on that about the garage wouldn't transfer ownership if there wasn't a deal done?

I really like the car but I don't want to waste a 2 hour trip to view it if the seller isn't genuine. I know it's possible to have a mechanical inspection but that's not a guarantee that the car won't have some hidden problem later on.

Atlantic Dawn

If the status of the car is traded in to dealer since January that would raise alarm bells given the current car market it must be a complete basket case not selling.

If someone is taking you for a fool pre-sale I'd not be bothered looking at the car.

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119345496#Comment_119345496

The owner said :

"I was trading it in off my new car but deal wasn't good so decided to private sell it must be still in garage name I have log book"

bazz26

Out of interest how well priced is it against other similar cars being sold by dealers?

The story the seller is giving is horse **** imo.

Normally the seller would only hand over the logbook to the dealer on the day they are actually part exchanging the car and collecting the new one. The deal would have been agreed before then so cannot see how the seller wouldn't be happy with the deal at the 11 hour. Also the garage would not do the change of ownership of the trade-in until they are in possession of the car. Again why would it be at that stage it if the seller wasn't happy with the deal?

What it sounds like to me is that the seller has some connection to the garage (possibly an employee or the owner) and is selling the car on the side to keep the transaction out of the garage's accounts as well as declaring it to Revenue. They are also removing their obligation to you under the Sale of Goods Act. You have on protection under a private sale.

If this guy cannot be honest about why he is selling the car then how could you believe a word that comes out of his mouth about the car itself or it's history.

Walk away would be my advice.

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119345788#Comment_119345788

There is only 1 other dealer selling similar car of same year and it for around 2k more.

I asked the seller of the car I am interested in to how was there an ownership change to a garage when he didn't do a trade deal on his new car like he said.

He replied that he did do it then changed his mind and took his car back because he was advised he could get more selling privately.

bazz26

He has a convenient answer for everything you ask him and I'm not buying it. Again you only hand the logbook over to the dealer on the day you are actually dropping off the old car and collecting the new one. If he was advised to sell privately then why turn up with the logbook and give it to the dealer? The only reason I could see him changing his mind at the last minute is if he actually had a private buyer lined up who offered him more. The fact he is advertising the car suggests that is not the case.

I don't have as much a problem with him selling an 11 year old car privately rather than through the dealership but more the story he is giving for doing it and the fact that if motortax.ie is showing ownership transfered to a garage then the logbook he has may not even be valid anymore. The fact even if the story was in anyway remotely valid he hasn't sorted out ownership which makes me believe he his story is not truthful and more about telling you what you want to hear. If he cannot be trusted on that bit then how can he trusted about the car he is selling? Just remember if you buy the car under these circumstances the as soon as you drive away, the car and everything associated with it (ownership in a garage name) become your problem too.

Has he any other cars for sale on dd?

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119345969#Comment_119345969

No he has no other cars on Done Deal . I asked him how was the ownership changed over to the garage if there was no deal done and he has replied:

"Look I'm sorry but I've explained myself I don't know what they did but the car is mine at my house I have all the paperwork maybe if your that weary you should look for a different car"

I know it still looks dodgey if he hasn't really got an explanation over the garage ownership change but I am disappointed because I really want like car and there isn't any others for sale at the year and price at this time and I am in need of a car as my last car got wrote off. I am fed up browsing Done Deal for the last week's.

bazz26

I'd just move on to be honest. Even if his story is remotely genuine he is still getting annoyed with you for highlighting the fact the car is in the dealers name, to him. He as the seller along with the garage in question should have sorted out the logbook/change of ownership with Shannon before putting the car up for sale so that there are no awkward questions to be annoyed about. It was always going to be flagged by a potential buyer who runs a history check.

So say you go ahead and buy the car and he sends off the log book with your details, what happens if Shannon reject it because it shows to be registered with a dealer? I don't know if they will or won't but where does that leave you if the don't? Why should it be you to sort that out? I'd bet he wouldn't answer your calls and your left then with the hassle.

User1998

Just to clarify, Shannon will definitely not reject the logbook. It’s completely normal for ownership to change to a dealer and for the dealer or who ever is selling the car to post the logbook to Shannon once the ‘dealer’ has sold the car, and a new logbook is issued.

I dunno, me personally I think if you REALLY want this particular car you should just get it inspected by a professional, especially considering you live 2 hours away. Thats your best chance of avoiding a lemon.

Generally it is better to buy from a private seller who has owned the car for some time and has looked after it, but just because a seller is a trader doesn’t automatically make it a bad car imo.

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119347403#Comment_119347403

Yeah I am really interested in the car but it's just a worry why the seller is not showing as dealer on DD and his that advert only. I know you previously said it could be to avoid giving a warranty, but I don't see many cars of this year and price sold by dealers with a warranty. There is one other car same year for sale on DD through dealer with similar mileage maybe 20k less but he is selling it for 2 k euro more than the one I am interested in and that dealer isn't giving a warranty.

So if the seller of the car I am interested in is a dealer then he is selling cheap at nearly 1k below it's market value.

Maybe the seller is a relative of the dealer and is looking for a quick sale. I did notice the advert posting date refreshes every few days so it looks like it hasn't been posted long, like for example today it's says it was posted 2 days ago but I noticed the ad for weeks now on DD. Maybe this is just paying a bit extra for the ad to stay up in the listing.

Also he says on the ad that the price was 4800 and dropped it 200 so no offers and then the price on ad is 4600. Most other ads on I have seen on DD that have reduced their price, it shows the old price in red text and stroked out and then the new price in black larger txt, so why he didn't show the price reduction this way.

User1998

There are hundreds of traders on Donedeal trading as private sellers, all for a variety of different reasons. The car could have been traded into a garage and sold to a small trader, the car could be too old to sell in a garage, maybe it’s just not worth their time, maybe its to avoid paying tax, to avoid consumer protection, to avoid hassle, etc. Maybe the car is a complete lemon.

Each individual car is different hence why I think the only logical thing to do is to have a professional look at the car before travelling 2 hours to see it. At this price range you are buying the car not the seller. Also sellers don’t get to decide about the old price being crossed out or not. And even mentioning it is just over thinking things imo

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119348286#Comment_119348286

Would it still not be better if I view the car first before paying a professional to look at it. Maybe I will find something with the car that's wrong and not want to buy it.

zg3409

You never get a good deal off back street traders. They buy cheap sell high and do as little work as possible. They give no warranty. It may not have been driven for months and battery may be gone. Servicing records may be faked. Mileage may be clocked.

If it sounds like a cowboy walk away. It could be genuine or it could be a disaster. Plenty of cars for sale.

I used to live next door to back street dealer and he jump started cars minutes before buyers showed up. Naturally the day after they bought the car the car would not start. Cars looked shiny. He put all the effort into washing and waxing..

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119345210#Comment_119345210

Just an update I went to view this Honda Accord today. It seemed in good condition inside and out appart from a few scratches on rear bumper. I took it for a drive and it seemed fine and lovely to drive. Engine sounds good, and no rattles while driving with steering and brakes were sharp. The owner ran it through the NCT last week and it failed on a few things like ball joints, bushings and brake pads worn. He is going to get the work done and retest it this week so there will be a fresh NCT on it then.

I still have a few concerns though. The owner wasn't actually there and left the key with a family member for me and I was told this when I rang him earlier in the day. But it was fairly low on diesel with it been on the light with 80 km left. When I checked the oil it was dark in colour near black so I am guessing it hasn't been serviced in quite a while. I know this could be trouble for Dpf and timing chain in the future but if I purchased the car I would keep the oil changed every 10k km and the fuel above half. The NCT test sheet was left in the car showing whats needed to be done but the owners name on the sheet showed a garage from Cork. As I said initially on this post I know the owner is a garage advertising as private sale, as I found out on the history check so it wasn't a surprise to see the owner on the NCT test sheet been a garage but the car is in Dublin so it's a bit puzzling so see a Cork garage as owner. The Cork bit was writen in brackets after the surname of the garage owner. When I googled the garage name there was a few garages in Cork coming up with similar names but not exactly the same. There is a garage in Dublin also with similar name but it doesn't have any business address in Cork on their website.

So I am thinking now that if the car gets the fresh NCT would you be still turned off by the dark oil and low diesel even if the car seemed to be running fine ? Would it still need check from a mechanic? And if the owner has the log book, would it still be a red flag if the owners name is garage from Cork with the car been in Dublin?

I do really like the car and I would really look after it well with regular serving but even though it will come with the new NCT I am not sure about when the oil was changed previously but as I said the engine sounds grand at idle and during driving. It doesn't have much of a service history though but the car is 11 years old going for asking price of 4.5 k.

User1998

If the car drives good, comes with a fresh nct, gets a fresh service, and the seller has the logbook, then I don’t see any reason not to buy the car.

Diesel oil turns black after a few kilometres anyway, and you can’t assume the DPF is bad because the fuel is low on this one occasion in 11 years. Whenever I buy a diesel I like to put some DPF cleaner in and give it a spin on the motorway.

The reason the address could be showing as a garage in Cork is because the garage probably took the car as a trade in and sold it to the current seller and gave them the logbook with the car to avoid adding an extra owner for when they sell it

Peter256

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119571420#Comment_119571420

Thanks for your response I appreciate it. I use to change the oil on my Mazda diesel every 10k km and it actually never went black to be honest but the Honda could a little over due it's service I think. And I wouldn't know if that was the first time the car was on the diesel light. I noticed the car has clocked up around 3k miles since going on sale in the spring so maybe that's a good thing it wasn't sitting around much even though it doesn't have an insurance disc, but the garage insurance probably covered that. Maybe it was used as a spare car by the garage I don't know. I think the lad who has it now is a smaller dealer. There was a few other cars outside the house he must be selling too.

I understand what you are saying about the latest owner might not have put their name on log book to avoid adding extra owner but garage owners don't show up on the figure as amount of previous owners, but the ownership changes would show on the history which maybe the wanted to avoid like you said. I was actually looking at the history on a Civic la few weeks back and in the last year it had 3 ownership changes by garages which might be a turn off for potential buyers.

But I guess if the lad has the log book and it can be changed over to my name then that's the main thing right? And then after that I will be taking the risk of buying it like most people buying cars 11 year's old cars but at least if it has the fresh NCT and service done there should be a good possiblity it won't be a lemon hopefully.