Church decline and growth - the prospects for GB churches

homer911

I came across this website the other day and thought it a topic worthy of discussion. The author has done some research into church growth and decline in GB (not UK as stated) and reaches some interesting conclusions, which you may or may not agree with (don't miss the 2nd page if you can stick with it)

The research suggests many churches in GB will be extinct by mid-century. The author compares growth/decline rates with "churchmanship" and "progressive ideologies" (i.e. same sex marriage)

A side note being that the Church of Scotland recently voted in favour of same-sex marriage

https://churchmodel.org.uk/2022/05/15/growth-decline-and-extinction-of-uk-churches/

What's clear to me is that the R number in almost all our churches is running below 1, and we can no longer rely on children replacing those who leave/die - each church needs to be far more outward facing / Evangelical to grow or die

Churches are under increasing societal pressure to "remain relevant" by embracing progressive ideologies - does it make sense to stand firm to centuries-old biblical interpretation or go with the trendy new thinking? Thoughts?

BTW, I'm sure the research could apply equally in Ireland or any other country

looksee

Churches are under increasing societal pressure to "remain relevant" by embracing progressive ideologies - does it make sense to stand firm to centuries-old biblical interpretation or go with the trendy new thinking?

This research only goes back to 2015. If it went back a century in Britain I think you would find that this progression downwards has been happening for all that time and more.

Churches in the past have taught that all people are not equal 'the rich man in his castle, the poor man at his gate, he made them, high and lowly, and ordered their estate'. This was the attitude in the mid 18thC - I have seen arguments that try and shift the meaning but the sentiment doesn't change much. Christ's teaching was pretty much the opposite - he mixed with outcasts and poor people and did not suggest that they were inferior or should 'know their place'. This is just one small example, you could go through similar reviews of attitudes to women, to homosexuals, to black people. Do most people really want to go back to those attitudes? Individuals within Christianity and also outside it fought to change attitudes; not the formal leaders of both Protestantism (CofE) and Catholicism, nor the vast bulk of their following, but individuals who fought for what they saw as right. The formal churches followed in their wake.

However, at the same time, people became educated. The churches used education initially to create suitable potential priests and to manage the beliefs of children who would be influential - something that wealthier people were prepared to pay for. The churches did not introduce the ragged schools in Britain, that was down to individuals. (as an aside, similarly the church did not set up the primary school system in Ireland, it was introduced by the British government. Yes there were individuals who earlier ran hedge schools in Ireland, but they were not organised by the formal church.)

Eventually the churches did get more involved in education - of the masses as well as the chosen few - but in Britain it was mostly secular education. Children were taught to think, gradually saw that they could be individuals, and chose to be more critical of the powerful, unelected body that controlled much of their lives. And it was all downhill from there for the formal churches.

Is Christianity about the teachings of Christ, or about the interpretations of people seeking power, money and control? As long as religion insists on making up rules and regulations to control people, and while at the same time people learn to think for themselves, the formal churches will continue to decline. It is nothing to do with faith or belief, it is everything to do with individuals trying to control other individuals to their own advantage of money or power. Many people are still looking for 'something' and join the newer evangelical groups to praise and be thankful and enjoy the company of likeminded people. I don't know anything about the individual groups but it seems likely that the most successful ones on those charts are the least controlling. Looking at those charts they are generally a list of the most gloomy and oppressive on the left to the more positive and energetic on the right.

Is the main concern of the OP and the producer of that research that the churches are failing, or that Christianity is failing? They are not the same thing, but the OP's phrasing about 'trendy new thinking' seems to suggest they (the OP) are concerned about the formal structures rather than the belief in Christ.

Maybe the main reason for failing is the determination of the established churches to hang on to their own power, and rules and organisations, and dictating their confident - mostly negative - assertions about what God wants, rather than seek to enable people to express joy and optimism about Christ's teaching, their lives and their faith.

smacl

Considering treating people equally regardless of sexual orientation, gender, race, or religion to be 'trendy new thinking' is a pretty good illustration of why the church is failing in the first place. That Christian churches, for the most part, has been on the losing side of recent referenda relating to equitable treatment of others highlights the growing gap between ethical thinking within the church and that of society at large. Add to that the many scandals surrounding the clergy and it becomes easy to understand the various degrees of apathy and outright antipathy directed at the church.

I'm not convinced that the side by side comparison of smaller groups with larger established churches really works on a statistical basis. For example, the total numbers of a smaller group could be insider to tolerance for error for numbers within a larger group. You also can get an uplift similar to that enjoyed by opposition politicians. Never having had any power means never having been in a position to make mistakes which can give the appearance of being squeaky clean. I'd guess numbers in these groups could easily plateau at small overall figures for a variety of reasons and it is a mistake to think of them as the future due to early stage growth.

My feeling is that for a church to succeed it has to provide genuine value to its community and properly understand how that community functions. In this stressful, consumer driven world we live in, there is without a doubt the need for groupings that emphasise kindness, care and inclusion. I'd imagine churches that manage to take on such a role have the best prospect of thriving.