The Ease of Sex vs Emotional Bonds

Liberty_Bear

I am writing this having thrown it out on my own social media accounts to garner opinion and to see if this tallies perhaps with other peoples experiences of being gay men.

I made a decision to dispense with the one night stands for the next while in the middle of November. There were weeks that I was racking up figures or three or four men a week all in the pursuit of enjoyment in some cases and it affected me mentally (normally it might be one a fortnight but there has been some extreme times as I call them!). As the weeks went on, rolled into the years that feeling of emptiness never really went. I came out of a relationship of nearly five years having been cheated on and whereas 15 years ago I was free and easy with my emotions when dating , up till recently I am guarded however came to the realization that I am ready to seriously date , I've let myself be vulnerable and its a revelation.

This brings me to the continued issues I came up against. There is a few pervading thoughts that seem to run through my own head and others - the limited dating culture is now diminished both to covid (quelle surprise) and what I think is an approach to have sex first and see if the bond is there. Has the easy availability of sex brought us into this culture where emotionally bonding is not available due to the free availability of sex?

This is a passing thought so just grateful for input

AllForIt

Personally I think being promiscuous is not good for you. It's like anything, food, beer, smoking, if you over indulge it's just bad for you. I'm not taking a moral stance here at all, I'm just saying that if you over indulge or fixate on anything it's not good for you.

Personally I'm fine with being single, so I don't spend a second looking for a partner. I'll hook up if the mood takes me, but given I live in a small town now, opportunities are rare. Doesn't really bother me, I had my fun years in the 90's/2000, when apps weren't really a think which I don't care for at all.

Some might call me 'fussy' or 'picky'. Well, I don't know any other way to do it, there has to be some kind of something I see in someone before I'd hook up with then. I think that's normal.

I don't have a problem with app or nightclub/bar pick-ups. I do think they can lead to something serious. They have in my case. How else are you gonna meet people and get to know them intimately if not that way.

Canard

I think you're right. And I've bought into that idea in the past - I used to think 'what's the point getting on well with the guy etc, if there won't be any chemistry / we're sexually incompatible?', thinking I better find out first, so I can see where it comes from. But something about it has become exhausting, and it takes away any build up or mystery.

When I was 21/22 I was how you described yourself, always looking for the next guy, and not even wanting to see guys I'd enjoyed sex with a second time because it wasn't a novelty! I have no idea what put me in that mindset tbh, so it's hard to even understand it. After the difficulty of meeting people with COVID, I'm beyond the 'need' to have sex and won't bother going to meet someone just for it with no other motive, because, well, it's an urge I can fix myself fairly happily. But I find that with so many guys these days, the depth of the conversation is "I'm so horny" 🙄

Makes me feel old to be bothered by it, and I guess if it's something we notice, then that means most guys are okay with it. But it's not in your head!

Liberty_Bear

Many thanks for the feedback. We may have fallen into this trap of the whole 'we need our needs satisfied now'. Its been a few months since I had sex and as you say we can resolve our own urges when we need no bother. Would you believe I took out a subscription to Tinder for a month just to see what it would be like. Its not been that great a week in. The typical hi and then hear nothing else or just people I am not into. Think COVID has pushed a lot of us to discover what we want.

Frostynight

Hi Liberty,

Yep this has been on my mind very recently too. Yes I've seen studies over the years saying gay men today typically sleep with 100+ men, often 200 by a certain age, can be more. I'd give it a search if you're curious.

One major reason I'd say I happily made use of hookups was simply because, I've had a few pretty bad breakups. Some guys were really hurtful and I just don't recover well. Hookups are a sort of safe environment where you know the situation and you get the intimacy, and just play out natural urges.

Why this has become live for me, after matching with a nice lad in an app, he seemed to be suggesting 'let's hookup and go from there, we'll see'. No. If you have a heart and it's delicate, how? I've been hurt too many times. I did a bit of searching this online, it seems some people are very 'go with the flow', meet, date, sleep together, let's not call it anything, if we're happy we'll just keep doing it. Others, like me, like an idea of 'what are you looking for'. So, I feel a bit challenged on this - how popular is the idea of 'sleep together and we'll figure it out'? I'm thinking that connects into the sex-now apps.

Even before COVID, weren't there articles saying sex-now apps were killing bars?

I think they're kind of great, and kind of our worst enemy. The fact is, my straight friends and family get everything they want by 30/early 30s and many gay guys I know can't understand why their single. What's going on here?

Liberty_Bear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118414042#Comment_118414042

Thanks for sharing that experience. All too common are the men epousing sex first then see if there is a connection. Its reassuring that I am not alone in this

Canard

Ah I have to say though, nothing puts me off more than "what are you looking for?" after 2 messages or guys who overtly state "looking for LTR"... like, ideally I am too, but sometimes it hits me as a bit of an "anyone will do" vibe. You wouldn't have that as a first conversation with an 'organic' stranger, so I don't like it on apps which are already a bit forced as it is. At the end of the day, you still have to click, no point rushing into it.

Liberty_Bear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118440759#Comment_118440759

I find that men should be up front with their intentions. Yes the whole "I want an LTR" strikes me as a tad casting net wide for anyone however the whole "friends and fun" or as you said "what are you into". Fun and friends leads to an impression they want actual friendship, Ive had plenty of lads over the years promise friendship on basis of wanting to get into my trousers whereupon I tell them once I am comfortable with them I will and the "what are you looking for" grinds my gears as equally. Organically it happens in person more so. I was in the George twice this week, more or less just having a pint with a friend but we are unable to approach anyone to strike up conversation organically as with Covid rules these are not removed. People are terrified of LTR, I often say I might want more after dating, guys baulk at that but Im out long enough to know that anyone wanting to settle down after three dates is a red flag as is anyone wanting sex up front. Emotionally there is a disconnect of a lot of men from relationships as the easy availability of sex has created this lacklustre emotional state. I can be accused of it myself, there are times I just want me end full stop.

Frostynight

Sticking to the original themes, I'm right there with you OP.

I think we've all deleted Grindr at some point and thought 'never again'.

I'm just in a place in my life where I want and am ready for more. After months of slow movement on dating apps, and realising it might be a while before my next ride, I downloaded Grindr earlier this month and sure enough I got what I wanted. But if, underneath it all, you want LTR, I think it brings you into contact with the wrong people. It's like wanting to swim while in a desert.

I realised positively speaking, that I've learned a lot about sex thanks to hookups, which I've brought into relationships, so I'm grateful for that.

A hookup recently told me that he thinks I'm nice. I thought he was nice. He said that lots of hookups for him, the men weren't nice. I saw vulnerability and honesty on his face. Grindr can be a chilly place if you're looking for something more.

With restrictions now lifted, I'm keeping an eye on meet-ups. I'll be out and about.

Liberty_Bear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118520892#Comment_118520892

Exactly and you nailed it beautifully when you said - wanting to swim in the desert. By coincidence went on a lovely date yesterday with a guy, we chatted. Who knows!

JupiterKid

My experience as a gay man who has been out since I was 22 - that’s nearly 25 years now 😬😜 - is that casual hookups and sex with other men is easy to find, but a deep connection, love and intimacy with another man leading to a LTR is much, much more elusive.

I think it is a very common gripe with gay guys of all ages, shapes and sizes. I firmly believe that it is closely linked to the nature of men in general - we are able to compartmentalise sex from love very easily. When it is two men this separation of sex and love is amplified.

Liberty_Bear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118537971#Comment_118537971

Thats eloquently put mate. Its been something Ive experienced as I get older, the ability to strip back the elements of my emotions to leave nothing but sex. As a younger man, love was something I found on a frequent basis but after two relationships and learning about myself, Ive developed this leather hide that seeks to be vulnerable with the right person if the chance crops up but alas does not happen

Frostynight

For me, a major theme seems to be after sex what happens. I've been on some pretty nice dates the past few months with guys who said they wanted LTR. Things didn't work out and the guys act different after sex. I think I'm going to have to delay sex a bit. It's a beautiful and wonderful thing to share with a guy, but to often I've been left holding my heart in my hand after sex.

Lack of emotional maturity has come up often. The guys I've dated recently and in the past share my drive in career, some of them are very successful in their own fields. But discuss things, conflict resolution, even calm, respectful chats about what we're looking for etc. leave much to be desired.

Liberty_Bear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118548205#Comment_118548205

From my reading of it, a lot want to put sex first invariably putting the cart before the horse....!