Three Ireland and recording phone call under " training and quality purposes"

Gatoh

Hi everyone and hello Three (if you read this)!

I have some sort of ongoing issue with Three Mobile and therefore Three ( or to be more specific - people from India? behalf of Three Ireland ) keep calling me past few weeks once a day - every day ( except Sundays) to ask my credit card details for the payment I believe I do not own to the Three. Anyway looks like we seem not to have much conversation about the problem itself as once I refuse to give my credit card details over the phone the conversation ends some sort of Sopranos style " no problem sir, that means we keep collecting" or whatever that means in that context, sounds rather like someone will show up one day at my doorstep with a baseball bat or something 😁

Anyway I decided to start to record them phone calls so I can gather some evidence of Three bulling tactics so I can forward it to Comreg for further investigation. But that means it has to be done in correct way of letting another party knowing that I am recording the phone conversation. 

So yesterday when I got my "regular" call from Three the customer care representative "Roisin" 😉 started nicely with "verification" process and told me that this call may be recorded for training and quality purposes and so I did let her know that I am too recording that call and if that's ok with her. But surprisingly that was not ok with Roisin and she said "no" to my request. Twice. Because I had to ask the very same question about me recording that phone call two times. Just to make sure I'm not lost in translation. Both times Roisin said "no" to me.. And that's how our conversation had to end because now this was me who refused to continue with our phone conversation.

This leads me to think that I may do not understand that "recording-phone-call law" at all or Three ( and many other big companies in that matter) just try to pull the fast one here..

According to the Irish Times article:

https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/is-it-legal-to-record-someone-without-their-consent-1.3598275

I quote:

"The situation in Irish law is complex, and is governed by at least three separate provisions – the Interception of Postal Packets and Telecommunications (Regulation) Act 1993, the General Data Protection Regulation (GDPR), and an individual’s constitutional right to privacy, plus their rights under European Convention on Human Rights.

The definition of “interception” means that generally only “single party consent” is required for phone recordings in Ireland. Single-party consent means “it is not illegal to record a telephone conversation if one of the parties to the call consents to the recording,” says Catherine Allen, a partner in Mason Hayes & Curran Solicitors. This is in contrast to many other countries, where the permission of both parties is always needed."

So in my understanding, once the Three customer service representative (who actually dialed my number first) states that "this call may be recorded" and not even seeking my yes-or-no permission for it, shouldn't that mean we both can record that call for "training and quality purposes" without me even looking another party's permission or does it work that only who states that sentence first can record the actual call? What if I will pick up the incoming call next time and will shout straight away " Calls may be recorded for training and quality purposes, Gatoh speaking, how can I help you today?" . Would that mean on that very moment only me can solely record that phone call?

EDIT:

Today was the first day over a long period of time I had no call from the various versions of 061-203XXX ..Three -did you give up? Did you forgot to call?

Or might be someone from your team cop on and realized that if you really think I owe you anything and it's in within reason you must actually write me a formal letter or at least email because there is literally 0 chance I will give my credit card details over the phone for someone I don't know..

Stating my full name and partial address gives me no reason to trust your "verification" process and who you claiming to be over the phone.

I think email or letter looks more professional on that matter. Probably cheaper too (instead of paying for them people making endless phone calls)! 

While I am attacking only Three here with that question about recording phone calls (or not) I strongly believe there should be clear clarification regardless the operator if it's Three, EIR or Vodafone, etc. if customers are legally allowed to have a them copy of the voice conversation when they sign up new service or solving the issue over the phone call. End of the day you surely can have a copy of the chat if you used computer screen dialogue with the service provider. Or what's the difference here?

L1011

Only single party consent is required in Ireland. You don't need to tell them and they only tell you in case it can't be proved that the other agent knew (e.g. if a call was transferred).

This is not common internationally so you normally find US/UK sites giving not accurate for Ireland details, nor will call centre staff have a clue.

A daily call where you refuse to pay a debt is not going to be considered bullying, though, so you're wasting your time. Go in to a store and pay over the counter by card (they don't take cash anymore) and the calls will stop.

brav

This is is the wrong place I think and more of a legal question.

You are right that if you want to record them you would have to state on the call and both parties have the right to then end the call if they do not wish to be recorded. I would guess it is most company policies to not agree in cases like this, as if you were going down the route of possible legal action they would do it via their legal team and not call centre/standard customer service

it is standard practice for call centres to record all calls so they could be reviewed afterwards for performance/training etc, so that is not unique to Three or any ISP etc.

Gatoh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118010969#Comment_118010969

I don't refuse to pay debt, I just don't have account with Three but just an prepay SIM order created bout two years ago for my kid I stopped paying few weeks ago as I switched operator. But might be I'm wrong, I do make mistakes often enough 😄. Therefore I would like a written ( either email or post ) notice what I owe to Three and why - instead of Three bombing me with daily calls pay-pay-pay-pay (feels bullying to me). But that's a different story, we won't go there today

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118011006#Comment_118011006

No, that's not right. Only single party consent is needed to record calls in Ireland. As I said in my first reply, this is internationally odd. Once you are aware you don't need to tell the other person and they've no option to opt-out.

Media reports you find of "illicit call recording", like the Garda station ones or the Anglo tapes, are when no party knew.

Tails142

This is probably just a scam anyway?

Doesn't sound legit if you've received nothing in writing.

Gatoh

I believe it is not a scam but it's not legit neither if that makes sense. As far I'm aware I have not signed up for anything, they have my full name and address as that's where they have sent the SIM card. I have no account with Three and billpay sort of needs an account and email confirmation or something like that as far I'm aware. For some reason Three have not sent me no email nor letter in post what could have more details like what sort of contract I have with dem and account number,etc. I'm not sure where it will go from here but I wont be surprised if one day Debt Collectors will send me that first letter and it all will get more complicated than it already is. Then again I'm pretty bored at the moment and just want to see what happens next. Like a life lesson or something 😜

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118011263#Comment_118011263

I'm pretty confident there's more to this tale , companies , particularly 3 don't randomly call people saying they owe money to them. In one sense you've answered one puzzling aspect to this story, the verification process, which you've said was OK. This demonstrates you have or had an active billing account with three, wether it be broadband , mobile number etc, prepay not relevant albeit did you possibly port out of three bill pay, onto a prepay account with another provider ? that may have had a final bill or was perhaps still in contract ?

I won't comment on the "Indian angle" but re telephone call recording, you have as much right to say no as they do to say calls may be recorded.

There's a very simple solution to all of this, email , three, with all your details, get what's called a case number, then go to comreg with that case number they'll get onto three, get to the bottom of this intriguing tale. You need a case number and account details before comreg will get involved.

The sequence of events laid out re calls, request for payment is exactly what three do and generally for not insignificant sums. The matter will at some stage if not resolved will go the phase 2, debt collection, where the matter gets even more complicated and messy.

Gatoh

I'll not call nor email to Three with "all my details" because IF I've a contract with them (what I believe I don't have) shouldn't Three have already all my details? I'm not gonna give it to them free handed

Verification process contains customer care representative saying my full name and partial address ( just a town and county) missing my full address like a house number and estate I living in. Other companies verification process goes as far as also asking my birthday and mother maiden name. None of it is OK with me, but I would like to pass the "verification" process to talk someone about the issue. And record that conversation.

EDIT: this topic is about recording the phone call, I'm not really bothered nor asking any help to solve the issue itself. The only reason I'm trying to be here as detailed about it as possible is that might be one day someone with similar problem will find this topic and it might be helpful in one or another way. That's all, but thanks anyway, much appreciated!

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118012173#Comment_118012173

With all due respect, the topic of Thread certainly states the issue re Three recording calls (which incidently they've always disclosed for training & verification purposes) but then goes onto primarily focus on an alledged billing issue, which there clearly is.

Oddly enough, its the fact Three (who are not alone in this practice), banks, insurance companies etc have been doing this for years, customers in dispute can request calls be played back as part of any internal complaint procedure. Incidently your assertion partial address will suffice is incorrect, anyone who has dealt with three, ever, knows full well your Name, DOB, Full address are required, if an existing customer, you may also be asked for 2 recent numbers called.

Companies have a right to inform customers or potential customers calls are recorded, equally customers or potential customers have to right to decline the call on that basis. If Three were wrong, persisting in calling you, that would be harassment to which you can complain to relevant authorities, clearly and based on your willingness to recieve these calls, Three are acting ligimately in relation to chasing payment.

If you are intent in rectifying the actual REAL issue, Comreg and relevant company require your details, without same, the matter goes around in circle's and procedure will not advance. Email creates a paper trail to advance a GENUINE complaint.

Your call ultimately, but there's quite enough in your OP and subsequent posts to suggest there's more to this intriguing Tale than how a company engages with its customers, especially when it comes to settling accounts. You may not like the response your getting, but like your approach to the actual matter at hand, you can choose to ignore and allow it persist.