Right turn, tricky scenario

SimonTemplar

I'm at a junction wanting to turn right. My new road is clear so I move forward when the lights turn green. There are a number of cars approaching from the opposite direction so I need to hold back in the middle of the junction until the oncoming traffic has cleared and I am free to complete my turn.

However, let's say a lot of cars from the opposite direction turn left into the new road to the point that there is no longer a space for me. If I stay where I am, I'll end up blocking traffic when the lights change but there is literally no space for me to complete my right turn. This is especially the case if the new road traffic takes a while to clear.

Any suggestions on what I should do in this scenario?

Smee_Again

Any road markings or traffic light sequence to facilitate the right turn?

SimonTemplar

Smee_Again wrote: »

Any road markings or traffic light sequence to facilitate the right turn?

This is a hypothetical question. It isn't a scenario that has happened to me yet. But for argument's sake, let's say it is a bog standard crossroads junction like this one with me doing a right turn onto Old Kilmainham Rd https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3406335,-6.3076708,45m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en-GB

Darc19

Proceed when the way is clear is the text book answer.

But cars turning left should give way to cars from the right, so I would simply proceed and put myself into the mix.

That way I would not be blocking cars coming from that road onto the road I was coming off.

Smee_Again

SimonTemplar wrote: »

This is a hypothetical question. It isn't a scenario that has happened to me yet. But for argument's sake, let's say it is a bog standard crossroads junction like this one with me doing a right turn onto Old Kilmainham Rd https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3406335,-6.3076708,45m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en-GB

Well traffic would be coming from your left at the next change of lights so I’d move right so I was at the front of them.

I might end up blocking traffic that was originally coming in the opposite direction but the light sequence should allow me clear the junction before they can move forward.

biko

If there is no yellow box then you can just sit there. Yes, you are blocking other drivers but I see nothing "illegal" with what you did.
In theory (and when you are new this is what you should do) you shouldn't have moved forward until you could complete your turn in one go.
But I have seen your scenario plenty times IRL.

biko

biko wrote: »

If there is no yellow box then you can just sit there. Yes, you are blocking other drivers but I see nothing "illegal" with what you did.
In theory (and when you are new this is what you should do) you shouldn't have moved forward until you could complete your turn in one go.
But I have seen your scenario plenty times IRL.

You can stop in a yellow box if turning right.
In the OP scenario, they should not move forward until they can make the turn, but in reality will probably end up driving through an amber or red light.

biko

bubblypop wrote: »

You can stop in a yellow box if turning right.
In the OP scenario, they should not move forward until they can make the turn, but in reality will probably end up driving through an amber or red light.

Unless your exit is perfectly clear and attainable – such as it being feasible to turn the way you wish to – you should leave the yellow boxes in the clear for others to benefit.

https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/its-simple-keep-out-of-yellow-boxes-40125969.html

biko

biko wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/its-simple-keep-out-of-yellow-boxes-40125969.html

An opinion piece in a newspaper? You really shouldn't get your knowledge of the rules of the road from that!

You cannot enter a yellow box junction unless you can exit it, the exception is when you are turning right.

Smee_Again

biko wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/its-simple-keep-out-of-yellow-boxes-40125969.html

Always check the actual legislation.

29. (1) Subject to sub-article (2), where traffic sign number RRM 020 [yellow box] is provided at a junction (whether controlled by traffic sign number RTS 00I, RTS 002 or RTS 004 [traffic lights], or otherwise], and notwithstanding any indication to the contrary that may be given by such traffic signs, a driver of a vehicle shall not enter, either partly or wholly, the crosshatched area unless the vehicle can clear the area without stopping.

(2) Sub-article (1) shall not apply where a driver of a vehicle intending to make a right-hand turn at a junction enters the crosshatched area for that purpose.

Allinall

In the example given, the cars will be backed up on the Old Kilmainham rd and around the corner in front of you.

If you just turn as far as you can go, you won't be blocking any traffic.

You will however, be at the mercy of the cars turning left in front of you if the scenario continues, and will be relying on someone to let you turn in front of them.

Richard_parker

biko wrote: »

If there is no yellow box then you can just sit there. Yes, you are blocking other drivers but I see nothing "illegal" with what you did.
In theory (and when you are new this is what you should do) you shouldn't have moved forward until you could complete your turn in one go.
But I have seen your scenario plenty times IRL.

If he is the first car waiting for lights to turn green he should absolutely move forward when light turns green. First car should always claim the junction, yellow box or not(explanation below). Second car behind him should not move forward unless first car is clearing the junction/yellow box and then proceed according to lights.

IF you have a red filter light to turn right when main light turns green you stay put don't move forward, obviously. If there is filter light but it isn't on, main light is green you are proceeding according to the main light.



OP what you have done is completely correct, and it in that case you move forward as much as you can, you will only be blocking traffic now coming from your left when light turns red to you and green to them. Meaning, as you inch froward you will be clearing the space for traffic now coming from your right and you will not be blocking them. Traffic on your left is behind you and they are of no problem to you as they cant move forward anyway.


So, junction with or without yellow box: you are the first car waiting, the light turns green but yellow box isn't clear, or space to move right isn't clear you DONT enter the junction/yellow box. However, if yellow box was empty and there was space to the right where you are going when lights turned green you should absolutely enter the box(or junction with no box), but now situation changed and oncoming traffic filled that space, you did everything right, all you can do now is inch forward to give as much space as you can to traffic now approaching from your right. Traffic to your left is not your problem here cos they cant move forward anyway, there is no space otherwise you wouldn't be sitting there and they can not enter yellow box/junction when it isn't clear, you are there.
It is the cars in oncoming traffic who entered the junction in front of you when there was no space who are at fault, meaning they are now sitting on the line or blocking pedestrian crossing when their light changes to red, meaning they entered the junction with nowhere to go. You did everything correct.