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Transgender Woman Jailed for Five Years in Cameroon

  • 16-05-2021 8:17am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭ hawley


    From February to April, officers arrested at least 27 Cameroonians — including a 17-year-old boy — on charges of same-sex affection or gender nonconformity, according to Human Rights Watch, after years of more lenient enforcement. Some endured beatings or forced anal examinations, a homosexuality “test” that activists liken to torture.

    “It’s been a real shock — we can’t get over it,” said Jean Paul Enama, executive director of Humanity First Cameroon, an advocacy group in the capital, Yaoundé. “In almost 20 years of activism, we’ve seen people get one year. Two years. Never the maximum sentence. We now fear that we all may be the next Shakiro.”

    Same-sex relationships are outlawed in more than half of Africa’s 54 countries — many of which inherited penal codes from former colonial powers. (Only South Africa defends rights based on sexual orientation in its constitution.)
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/05/15/shakiro-cameroon-transgender-rights/%3foutputType=amp

    What right do they have to treat a person like this. It's abhorrent that she has been jailed for this, it's like something from the middle ages. I know that we probably don't have much trade or interaction with Cameroon, but hopefully our government can do something.


Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 10,628 ✭✭✭✭ snoopsheep


    Thanks op ill keep an eye out for her


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    snoopsheep wrote: »
    Thanks op ill keep an eye out for her

    At least he's moved on from American police shooting threads, for now at least.

    It's Africa OP. A complete cluster **** of a continent, especially if you are gay or trans. Hilarious that you think the Irish government can do anything. A good example however of why immigration nos. From outside the EU be kept to a minimum, lest our hard fought rights come under pressure from such people.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,222 ✭✭✭✭ the dunne


    hawley wrote: »
    What right do they have to treat a person like this. It's abhorrent that she has been jailed for this, it's like something from the middle ages. I know that we probably don't have much trade or interaction with Cameroon, but hopefully our government can do something.

    Lol. Ok chief.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,854 ✭✭✭ TomTomTim


    hawley wrote: »
    From February to April, officers arrested at least 27 Cameroonians — including a 17-year-old boy — on charges of same-sex affection or gender nonconformity, according to Human Rights Watch, after years of more lenient enforcement. Some endured beatings or forced anal examinations, a homosexuality “test” that activists liken to torture.

    “It’s been a real shock — we can’t get over it,” said Jean Paul Enama, executive director of Humanity First Cameroon, an advocacy group in the capital, Yaoundé. “In almost 20 years of activism, we’ve seen people get one year. Two years. Never the maximum sentence. We now fear that we all may be the next Shakiro.”

    Same-sex relationships are outlawed in more than half of Africa’s 54 countries — many of which inherited penal codes from former colonial powers. (Only South Africa defends rights based on sexual orientation in its constitution.)
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/05/15/shakiro-cameroon-transgender-rights/%3foutputType=amp

    What right do they have to treat a person like this. It's abhorrent that she has been jailed for this, it's like something from the middle ages. I know that we probably don't have much trade or interaction with Cameroon, but hopefully our government can do something.

    Are you calling an African country backwards? That's outrageous. I remember a certain orange man calling African countries backwards and he was met with global outrage.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,660 ✭✭✭✭ Timberrrrrrrr


    TomTomTim wrote: »
    Are you calling an African country backwards? That's outrageous. I remember a certain orange man calling African countries backwards and he was met with global outrage.

    What's that got to do with anything?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,145 ✭✭✭✭ Donald Trump


    TomTomTim wrote: »
    Are you calling an African country backwards? That's outrageous. I remember a certain orange man calling African countries backwards and he was met with global outrage.




    Ahem ... the word used by the most glorious and bestest president emeritus was shithole. Not backward.


    Get your bleedin' facts straight.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,520 ✭✭✭ Bobblehats


    hawley wrote: »
    I know that we probably don't have much trade or interaction with Cameroon, but hopefully our government can do something.

    Pain in de wold :( would you like to strike up better relations? Deep in the mud as we already are I think it’s best to try and keep off these peoples radar as much as remains possible; should we find any more at our doorstep.


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,264 ✭✭✭✭ Gatling


    Maybe fix the clickbate title


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,788 ✭✭✭✭ klaz


    hawley wrote: »
    What right do they have to treat a person like this.

    It's their law. That's the right in itself. Many countries have laws which western societies find to be unacceptable... but these countries still have the ability to retain those laws or cultural taboos.

    If you want to live a way that runs counter to the laws of that country, move elsewhere. If you wish to fight against those laws, with the expectation that they will be changed, it will result in a great many people being punished, or executed before enough change happens in the society to encourage such change.

    Don't forget how long it took for western nations to gain enough social momentum before those laws/taboos were changed.... along with the amount of people who were punished or executed while it was happening. So, yeah, stop expecting other nations to immediately become tolerant, when the west themselves changed only a relatively short time ago.

    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle 



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators Posts: 81,470 Mod ✭✭✭✭ biko


    OP, you need to fly down to Africa and set them straight.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,474 ✭✭✭✭ whisky_galore


    Backward laws in backward country shocker.


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    biko wrote: »
    OP, you need to fly down to Africa and set them straight.

    When are you booking your trip to Sweden, Kettle?


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,788 ✭✭✭✭ klaz


    Backward laws in backward country shocker.

    I dunno.. I think they have the right to operate their country as they wish.

    I don't personally agree with those laws/rules (as I'm bisexual), but then, I'd either avoid going there or avoid partaking in that behavior there. As for people from there, they still have the option to go elsewhere. There isn't a ban on emmigration.

    The thing is that I'm not so sure it is backwards. Sure, I believe that homosexuality should be legal, and available to everyone (without fear of punishment), but the range of gender issues that have arisen over the last few decades are still a very recent change in society, and one that hasn't brought about all positives.

    There's a whole range of negatives that have come about from the gender identity, and trans situation in the west... and I can understand why some cultures would hesitate before encouraging it to happen in their own countries. Especially, if their own cultures are more brittle and less comfortable with such change. It very possible they're waiting to see how things develop in the West, before encouraging it to happen in their own countries.

    We like to point to the West as being so quick to embrace new ideas, and giving freedoms for people to behave/live as they wish as a personal freedom... but... we rarely consider the negatives before applying those changes, instead, seeking to defer the negatives to later generations, for them to solve for us.

    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle 



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    klaz wrote: »
    It's their law. That's the right in itself. Many countries have laws which western societies find to be unacceptable... but these countries still have the ability to retain those laws or cultural taboos.

    If you want to live a way that runs counter to the laws of that country, move elsewhere. If you wish to fight against those laws, with the expectation that they will be changed, it will result in a great many people being punished, or executed before enough change happens in the society to encourage such change.

    Don't forget how long it took for western nations to gain enough social momentum before those laws/taboos were changed.... along with the amount of people who were punished or executed while it was happening. So, yeah, stop expecting other nations to immediately become tolerant, when the west themselves changed only a relatively short time ago.

    Cameroon is a member of the United Nations, it joined in 1960 and the general assembly has adopted a declaration of human rights. So it's not just a case of this being a rogue state, they have diplomatically joined the international community, so, it's not like anyone here, all of us whom are presumably from UN member states, have no standing to be critical of Cameroon. Same applies for these problems in other UN member states of which there are indeed many that have problems with recognizing the human rights of persons who are not neurotypical.

    In fact there should absolutely be an action by the Irish Ambassador to the United Nations condemning the human rights abuses of Cameroon. Wouldn't you agree? I hope the US Ambassador addresses it as well, especially in such an inclusive administration.

    That seems more constructive than "fly down to Africa OP lolz"


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Overheal wrote: »
    Cameroon is a member of the United Nations, it joined in 1960 and the general assembly has adopted a declaration of human rights. So it's not just a case of this being a rogue state, they have diplomatically joined the international community, so, it's not like anyone here, all of us whom are presumably from UN member states, have no standing to be critical of Cameroon. Same applies for these problems in other UN member states of which there are indeed many that have problems with recognizing the human rights of persons who are not neurotypical.

    In fact there should absolutely be an action by the Irish Ambassador to the United Nations condemning the human rights abuses of Cameroon. Wouldn't you agree? I hope the US Ambassador addresses it as well, especially in such an inclusive administration.

    That seems more constructive than "fly down to Africa OP lolz"
    Do you think anyone in Cameroon even knows who the Irish Ambassador to the UN is, let along give a ****e what they think.

    In Ireland we can complain and condemn all we want, it won't make one bit of difference. Traveling to Africa would just be as useful, so the point wasn't without merit.


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,788 ✭✭✭✭ klaz


    Overheal wrote: »
    Cameroon is a member of the United Nations, it joined in 1960 and the general assembly has adopted a declaration of human rights. So it's not just a case of this being a rogue state, they have diplomatically joined the international community, so, it's not like anyone here, all of us whom are presumably from UN member states, have no standing to be critical of Cameroon. Same applies for these problems in other UN member states of which there are indeed many that have problems with recognizing the human rights of persons who are not neurotypical.

    Ahh well... I'm very skeptical at the power of the UN to encourage the application of human rights, and consider that over the period of it's existence, the enforcement of those human rights have been applied more due to politics, than a genuine desire to improve the lives of it's member states.

    All powerful organisations become corrupt over time, pushing certain agendas over others. For example, the UN equality commissions, tend to focus mostly on women's rights over the rights of men, looking to the problems that women face, while not dealing equally with those that men face. A range of agendas, put forward with good intentions but still biased nonetheless.

    I would consider the UN to be a paper tiger, that is dependent on the major powers, and should those powers feel disinclined to help, or even if they do, there's usually much more going on than the considerations of human rights, or a real desire to improve the lot of the target population. Short term goals with little consideration of the long term consequences.

    And then there is the decision as to what is a human right, or something else entirely, but still falling under the mandate of the UN.
    In fact there should absolutely be an action by the Irish Ambassador to the United Nations condemning the human rights abuses of Cameroon. Wouldn't you agree? I hope the US Ambassador addresses it as well, especially in such an inclusive administration.

    That seems more constructive than "fly down to Africa OP lolz"

    Social/cultural change comes from within... not externally. While external sources can provide an example for others to follow, as a source for inspiration, there needs to be shown a clear value in doing so. When it comes to gender identity (like the trans movement), and the range of social change pushed into western society, I'm skeptical of those who consider it as being an immediate positive, since they're obviously ignoring all the negatives, nor giving any consideration for the effects over time. It's just about having the right immediately, and not about how that right will affect others or society in general.

    Other cultures should choose for themselves whether they want to adopt those social changes... and should that culture decide not to, then, those who can't accept it can go elsewhere. Or seek social/cultural change themselves... with the practical realisation that it will take extensive time and investment before it happens.

    "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." - Aristotle 



  • Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭ Papa_Bear


    biko wrote: »
    OP, you need to fly down to Africa and set them straight.


    and stay the hell off the current affairs forum too cause it is not a dumping ground for your outrage against countries that dont uphold your standards.


    The first 2 pages of the forum are littered with these stupid threads FFS.


  • Registered Users Posts: 65,187 ✭✭✭✭ Overheal


    Hhhhh wrote: »
    Do you think anyone in Cameroon even knows who the Irish Ambassador to the UN is, let along give a ****e what they think.

    I doubt most Cameroonians know who their own ambassador is, yet, that still misses the point.


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Overheal wrote: »
    I doubt most Cameroonians know who their own ambassador is, yet, that still misses the point.

    It doesn't. The UN is an organization that is becoming more and.more irrelevant. May be a case that you don't know what you had till its gone, so I wouldn't want to see it disappear.

    But one problem with it is it allows for nothing more than political posturing, a chance for people to be seen to do something rather than actually do something. The Irish ambassador to the UN doing what yiu suggested would fall into the former.


  • Registered Users Posts: 814 ✭✭✭ Mike Murdock


    Overheal wrote: »
    Cameroon is a member of the United Nations, it joined in 1960 and the general assembly has adopted a declaration of human rights. So it's not just a case of this being a rogue state, they have diplomatically joined the international community, so, it's not like anyone here, all of us whom are presumably from UN member states, have no standing to be critical of Cameroon. Same applies for these problems in other UN member states of which there are indeed many that have problems with recognizing the human rights of persons who are not neurotypical.

    In fact there should absolutely be an action by the Irish Ambassador to the United Nations condemning the human rights abuses of Cameroon. Wouldn't you agree? I hope the US Ambassador addresses it as well, especially in such an inclusive administration.

    That seems more constructive than "fly down to Africa OP lolz"

    The same UN that elected Saudi Arabia to the U.N. Commission on the Status of Women?

    The UN is nothing more that a more bureaucratic League of Nations.


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