4x4, what to buy?

Laura2021

Hi I'm looking to get a second hand 4x4 something cheap as wont be my daily vehicle.
Looking at commercial to fit a bike or two & hiking gear into, will be used alot in the summer with breaks away in the likes of donegal.

I also have 3 dogs so would be good to use that instead of my car

Looking at options what would you recommend thanks .

Wildly Boaring

You able to get commercial tax?
Got an insurance company who'll mirror no claims onto a policy?
Cheap and 4wd?

TrailerBob

Have a look at the suzuki grand vitara. Cheap to buy and not bad to run being 2 litre. Private tax wouldn't be the earth of you couldn't get the commercial tax sorted. Take the back seats out and thy have decent room in them, and are plenty capable for anything you'll find publicly accessible in this country.

Any full size 4x4 that you buy cheap will become less cheap with maintenance costs. Hard to avoid farms and builders with the bigger stuff. If you do want to go full size, look at the 00-03 landcruiser. Some reasonable examples on DD but the key is the condition of the chassis.. rust on the inner side of the rails, especially the back section, wheelarches, sills... Everything else on them will last till the next ice age.

Laura2021

Wildly Boaring wrote: »

You able to get commercial tax?
Got an insurance company who'll mirror no claims onto a policy?
Cheap and 4wd?

Yes I can get a commercial have been onto my insurance. Well looking around 5k mark if had to put a price on have seen a good few online.

Laura2021

Looking at Mitsubishi pajero at moment any other options I should look into?

Laura2021

TrailerBob wrote: »

Have a look at the suzuki grand vitara. Cheap to buy and not bad to run being 2 litre. Private tax wouldn't be the earth of you couldn't get the commercial tax sorted. Take the back seats out and thy have decent room in them, and are plenty capable for anything you'll find publicly accessible in this country.

Any full size 4x4 that you buy cheap will become less cheap with maintenance costs. Hard to avoid farms and builders with the bigger stuff. If you do want to go full size, look at the 00-03 landcruiser. Some reasonable examples on DD but the key is the condition of the chassis.. rust on the inner side of the rails, especially the back section, wheelarches, sills... Everything else on them will last till the next ice age.

Thanks will look at the Suzuki. I came across a 06 landcruiser but needs a head gasket they wanted just under 5k for it

Laura2021

TrailerBob wrote: »

Have a look at the suzuki grand vitara. Cheap to buy and not bad to run being 2 litre. Private tax wouldn't be the earth of you couldn't get the commercial tax sorted. Take the back seats out and thy have decent room in them, and are plenty capable.



Are you allowed take out back seats out ? I know nobody would know only if went to Nct but could put them back In when that time comes .

biko

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_0iLLbrbnQ

TrailerBob

Laura2021 wrote: »

TrailerBob wrote: »

Have a look at the suzuki grand vitara. Cheap to buy and not bad to run being 2 litre. Private tax wouldn't be the earth of you couldn't get the commercial tax sorted. Take the back seats out and thy have decent room in them, and are plenty capable.



Are you allowed take out back seats out ? I know nobody would know only if went to Nct but could put them back In when that time comes .

Of course you can. As you say, pop them back in for the nct, but you can do what you want otherwise.

For the landcruiser, I'd stay away from anything that's being sold needing engine work.. if its overheated to the point that it needs a headgasket, I'd be concerned about the cooling system, especially if its an auto. There's no reason to fear a slightly older one if its in good shape.

Laura2021

biko wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_0iLLbrbnQ

That was a good watch landcruiser wins

nsnoefc1878

Laura2021 wrote: »

Yes I can get a commercial have been onto my insurance. Well looking around 5k mark if had to put a price on have seen a good few online.

How do you get commercial if you don't mind me asking?
02-06 grand Vitara, petrol or diesel, or diesel second generation rav4 would be perfect. Back seats can be removed from both easily.

Laura2021

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

How do you get commercial if you don't mind me asking?
02-06 grand Vitara, petrol or diesel, or diesel second generation rav4 would be perfect. Back seats can be removed from both easily.

Farm work

nsnoefc1878

Laura2021 wrote: »

Farm work

You're buying it as a commercial vehicle or just 'pretending' it is for the cheaper tax and insurance?

Rows Grower

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

You're buying it as a commercial vehicle or just 'pretending' it is for the cheaper tax and insurance?

You can't "pretend" to be entitled to own and operate a commercial vehicle at commercial rates. You're either eligible to have one or you're not.

nsnoefc1878

Rows Grower wrote: »

You can't "pretend" to be entitled to own and operate a commercial vehicle at commercial rates. You're either eligible to have one or you're not.

Well I think you know what I'm getting at. I know IT contractors who bought pickups and 4wd's thru their company, now they might be technically 'eligible' to do so, but its at the very least against the spirit of the law.

Rows Grower

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

Well I think you know what I'm getting at. I know IT contractors who bought pickups and 4wd's thru their company, now they might be technically 'eligible' to do so, but its at the very least against the spirit of the law.

How would I know that you know IT contractors that drive pick ups you think they don't need?

That's just silly.

Possibly a bit of jealousy involved too.

nsnoefc1878

Rows Grower wrote: »

How would I know that you know IT contractors that drive pick ups you think they don't need?

That's just silly.

Possibly a bit of jealousy involved too.

Yeah whatever, such a lazy response. Anyone critiques anything, they're jealous.
I know they dont need them for commercial reasons because they told me.
Commercial vehicles get commercial rates of tax on the basis they are used for commercial purposes, not as family or lifestyle vehicles.
It takes some level of arrogance and entitlement to be happy to bend or break rules to save yourself some money and then get upset when someone points it out.

Rows Grower

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

Yeah whatever, such a lazy response. Anyone critiques anything, they're jealous.
I know they dont need them for commercial reasons because they told me.
Commercial vehicles get commercial rates of tax on the basis they are used for commercial purposes, not as family or lifestyle vehicles.
It takes some level of arrogance and entitlement to be happy to bend or break rules to save yourself some money and then get upset when someone points it out.

Says the lad who has the cheek to ask a stranger if they are "pretending" to need a commercial vehicle after being told how it is they are entitled to purchase one.

There's nothing lazy about my response and you were very far from being a "Critique" in your previous post, you asked a direct question insinuating wrong doing.

nsnoefc1878

Rows Grower wrote: »

Says the lad who has the cheek to ask a stranger if they are "pretending" to need a commercial vehicle after being told how it is they are entitled to purchase one.

There's nothing lazy about my response and you were very far from being a "Critique" in your previous post, you asked a direct question insinuating wrong doing.

As I said, you can be 'entitled' technically but arent using the vehicle for its intended purpose. Are you suggesting this does not happen?
Your response is lazy, its nothing to do with jealousy and everything to do with people abiding by the law or at the very least the spirit of it.
Its laughable that you think people dont have the right to ask questions either.
You obviously have no issue with people fraudulently claiming a vehicle is for commercial use even when its not. Fair enough if thats your stance.

Laura2021

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

As I said, you can be 'entitled' technically but arent using the vehicle for its intended purpose. Are you suggesting this does not happen?
Your response is lazy, its nothing to do with jealousy and everything to do with people abiding by the law or at the very least the spirit of it.
Its laughable that you think people dont have the right to ask questions either.
You obviously have no issue with people fraudulently claiming a vehicle is for commercial use even when its not. Fair enough if thats your stance.

Tell that to all the government who run this country into the ground great people to look upto most are dodgy landlords . I know plenty of garda who take advantage of there power aswell as getting family out of fines . Sure where does the car tax go in this country? Not on the roads thats for sure . If people want to use commercial vehicles for work aswell as private use why shouldn't they .
Plenty of people buy commercial for private use how do they get away with it?

Stihl waters

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

How do you get commercial if you don't mind me asking?
02-06 grand Vitara, petrol or diesel, or diesel second generation rav4 would be perfect. Back seats can be removed from both easily.

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

You're buying it as a commercial vehicle or just 'pretending' it is for the cheaper tax and insurance?

nsnoefc1878 wrote: »

Well I think you know what I'm getting at. I know IT contractors who bought pickups and 4wd's thru their company, now they might be technically 'eligible' to do so, but its at the very least against the spirit of the law.

You should get a job with revenue

nsnoefc1878

Laura2021 wrote: »

Tell that to all the government who run this country into the ground great people to look upto most are dodgy landlords . I know plenty of garda who take advantage of there power aswell as getting family out of fines . Sure where does the car tax go in this country? Not on the roads thats for sure . If people want to use commercial vehicles for work aswell as private use why shouldn't they .
Plenty of people buy commercial for private use how do they get away with it?

I agree with you re. the government, however two wrongs dont make a right.
I speak as someone who despises FG and FF.
But if you are buying a commercial vehicle thru a company and using it as a private vehicle, you are committing fraud, not high on the grand scale but its fraud nonetheless.
People never see the real problem when they are exploiting loopholes to avoid paying tax or reduce their tax liability.
Whether its twats like Dennis Obrien or some person buying a pickup thru their parents business or whatever, only to use it as a lifestyle vehicle to impress the neighbours, I have zero time for any of it.

nsnoefc1878

Stihl waters wrote: »

You should get a job with revenue

Are they hiring?

Rows Grower

Stihl waters wrote: »

You should get a job with revenue

Looking at the surmising and accusation that went on in post #19, I don't think that would be a suitable career choice.

BnB

Back to the actual subject


You're probably a bit limited with €5k but still, I'd say there is something out there for you.

You have your obvious one's first - The Pajero & the Landcruiser.

Personally, I love Pajeros - Lovely jeep to drive. The Landcruiser's probably have a bit of a better Rep for reliability. The problem with both is that in general farmers love them - And when they have them, they don't trade or sell them, untill they're knackered. So if they're in good condition, they really hold their value and you'll do well to get a decent one around the €5k mark. Not impossible..... but you'll be lucky. Other thing I would say is, I have owned a Pajero and it was an absolute sow on diesel. I know you're not doing much mileage, but even still..... It drinks it.

So, apart from the obvious 2 above, some of the more left(ish) field options

A discovery. You'd pick up a 05/06/07 commercial for 5 or 6k. Lovely jeep to drive. Also the way the back splits and opens out is fierce handy as opposed the big awkward door in the Pajero. It makes it easier to load stuff in, as well as giving you a nice little platform to work on or sit on outside or whatever when it's open. The big potential issue here is reliability and the cost of getting them fixed. I have a 08 one myself now and I love it but I'm very nervous about what it might cost to fix some day if something goes wrong.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/2007-discovery-commercial-automatic-doe-7-21/27706744

A Pagero Sport. Not as expensive as the Pajeros and a bit smaller and neater as well.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/mitsubishi-pajero-sport-2-5-td-gls-comm/27605840

Nissan Pathfinder - Technically, would be in the same class as the Pajero & Landcruiser but wouldn't be as highly rated. Still, would be a fine jeep and is a proper full 4X4
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/nissan-pathfinder/27790078

Mitsubishi Outlander - This wouldn't really be a "proper" 4X4 like the Pajero and is probably more of an "SUV". But as SUV's go, it's a lot closer to a proper 4X4 than most. For starters, it is an actual 4 wheel drive. It won't pull you up every single mountain like a Pajero would, but it won't leave you stuck in a wet field either. I drove one as my daily driver for 2 years and took it off road (in fields etc) plenty of times and it was well at home.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/12-mitsubishi-outlander-2-3did-4wd-1owner/27577575

imp1

I'm in a similar boat to the OP, looking for a full size commercial with limited mileage usage, can anybody recommend a 2.5 Touareg - they seem to be good value and are maybe a bit soft for heavy farm use???
The Disco above looks tempting, used to drive one a bit, but it was in the garage as often as my 3.0 Trooper.

Laura2021

BnB wrote: »

Back to the actual subject


You're probably a bit limited with €5k but still, I'd say there is something out there for you.

You have your obvious one's first - The Pajero & the Landcruiser.

Personally, I love Pajeros - Lovely jeep to drive. The Landcruiser's probably have a bit of a better Rep for reliability. The problem with both is that in general farmers love them - And when they have them, they don't trade or sell them, untill they're knackered. So if they're in good condition, they really hold their value and you'll do well to get a decent one around the €5k mark. Not impossible..... but you'll be lucky. Other thing I would say is, I have owned a Pajero and it was an absolute sow on diesel. I know you're not doing much mileage, but even still..... It drinks it.

So, apart from the obvious 2 above, some of the more left(ish) field options

A discovery. You'd pick up a 05/06/07 commercial for 5 or 6k. Lovely jeep to drive. Also the way the back splits and opens out is fierce handy as opposed the big awkward door in the Pajero. It makes it easier to load stuff in, as well as giving you a nice little platform to work on or sit on outside or whatever when it's open. The big potential issue here is reliability and the cost of getting them fixed. I have a 08 one myself now and I love it but I'm very nervous about what it might cost to fix some day if something goes wrong.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/2007-discovery-commercial-automatic-doe-7-21/27706744

A Pagero Sport. Not as expensive as the Pajeros and a bit smaller and neater as well.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/mitsubishi-pajero-sport-2-5-td-gls-comm/27605840

Nissan Pathfinder - Technically, would be in the same class as the Pajero & Landcruiser but wouldn't be as highly rated. Still, would be a fine jeep and is a proper full 4X4
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/nissan-pathfinder/27790078

Mitsubishi Outlander - This wouldn't really be a "proper" 4X4 like the Pajero and is probably more of an "SUV". But as SUV's go, it's a lot closer to a proper 4X4 than most. For starters, it is an actual 4 wheel drive. It won't pull you up every single mountain like a Pajero would, but it won't leave you stuck in a wet field either. I drove one as my daily driver for 2 years and took it off road (in fields etc) plenty of times and it was well at home.
https://www.donedeal.ie/commercials-for-sale/12-mitsubishi-outlander-2-3did-4wd-1owner/27577575

Thanks thanks for great advice.



Would the discovery not have a great reputation for being reliable especially the electrical side of things. They are nice looking and have always wanted one , commercial would be perfect.


Pajero sport might be a bit to small they are nice though would that drink diesel aswell ?


Il look into the Nissan pathfinder & Outlander any year in particular and problems to look out for ?

Cheensbo

Mk2 pajero if you can find one that's not rotten,

I've had 6 of them and when minded well they're the best jeep out there imho.

https://www.donedeal.ie/vintagecars-for-sale/92-pajero-2-5/27819534?campaign=14

interestingly this is an originally Irish sold one....

My god they're getting pricey though..


Edit - next year that paj can be taxed for €56 a year and put on a classic policy €150- €300/year

colm_mcm

I had a 2.8 mk2 Pajero and it should be remembered that they are slow and thirsty.
2.5 is even worse IIRC.

I wouldn’t be driving to Donegal in one, put it that way.

Cheensbo

colm_mcm wrote: »

I had a 2.8 mk2 Pajero and it should be remembered that they are slow and thirsty.
2.5 is even worse IIRC.

I wouldn’t be driving to Donegal in one, put it that way.

I can only disagree on that tbh, they're definitely not slower or more thirsty than a 1kz powered 90series landcruiser, possibly slower than a d4d but you have the reliability factor then. You're not really going to get much beyond 25mpg in any "agricultural" jeep.

My 2.5 goes well enough, I couldn't call it slow. little turn of the pump awakens them from their slumber.

selectamatic

You would be as well off avoid the 2.8 pajeros due to the head design. The 2.5s are good.

Waste of time even thinking about fuel economy in this segment imo. Condition of the vehicle is the be all and end all once you avoid the known
problem models.

Isuzu dmax would be a good option.

Some great value to be had on single cab pickups of all makes too if the back seats aren't needed.

Laura2021

selectamatic wrote: »

You would be as well off avoid the 2.8 pajeros due to the head design. The 2.5s are good.

Waste of time even thinking about fuel economy in this segment imo. Condition of the vehicle is the be all and end all once you avoid the known
problem models.

Isuzu dmax would be a good option.

Some great value to be had on single cab pickups of all makes too if the back seats aren't needed.

Would you recommend any? I wont be thinking of fuel economy just want something that is somewhat reliable and wont break down every week haha

selectamatic

Laura2021 wrote: »

Would you recommend any? I wont be thinking of fuel economy just want something that is somewhat reliable and wont break down every week haha

Dmax or older moldel Ford ranger worth looking for farm work type stuff.

Not sure you'd need something like that for trips away though. Surely a bike rack and roof box on a smaller suv type thing would be good enough and much easier ran.

Rows Grower

A commercial Kia Sportage, Hyundai Santa Fe or a SSangyong Korando might fit the bill.

Mad_maxx

jeep grand cherokee are dirt cheap if you go pre 2011 , probably no less reliable than a landrover discovery

colm_mcm

Mad_maxx wrote: »

jeep grand cherokee are dirt cheap if you go pre 2011 , probably no less reliable than a landrover discovery

High praise

BnB

Mad_maxx wrote: »

jeep grand cherokee are dirt cheap if you go pre 2011 , probably no less reliable than a landrover discovery

Very hard to find one though. I was on the lookout for one for a few months before Christmas and I gave up in the end and bought a Disco.

I don't think reliability is meant to be a big issue for them. Don't they have an old Merc engine in them that is meant to be decent. (I could be wrong there though)

If you find one in decent condition, they are great value for what you get and you should certainly get one for less than €5k.

Look at this one for € 4.5k. It needs a good clean, but it's tested till the end of the year. You'd be looking at a fair sh1theap of a Pajero for the same money

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/2010-jeep-grand-cherokee/27677760

Mad_maxx

BnB wrote: »

Very hard to find one though. I was on the lookout for one for a few months before Christmas and I gave up in the end and bought a Disco.

I don't think reliability is meant to be a big issue for them. Don't they have an old Merc engine in them that is meant to be decent. (I could be wrong there though)

If you find one in decent condition, they are great value for what you get and you should certainly get one for less than €5k.

Look at this one for € 4.5k. It needs a good clean, but it's tested till the end of the year. You'd be looking at a fair sh1theap of a Pajero for the same money

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/2010-jeep-grand-cherokee/27677760

the Merc engine in the grand cherokee is not viewed as having been an especially great Merc engine , the post 2011 cherokees have a very good Fiat engine in them

i just like the look of the cherokee , something different , probably be difficult to get parts however as only about two dealers left in the country ?