HKC SW-10270 self install - help needed

nimrod86

Hi all,

As some may have seen from my thread about GSM-Q, I'm going through the motions of self-installing a HKC SW-10270. I'd be fairly handy when it comes to wiring and that, but these alarms seem fairly advanced over the 90's self install alarm I've seen in my folks house!

At the moment I'm not looking to do anything too fancy (I don't think) so would appreciate some advice from the experts on here as to what might be the best way to set up some zones and wiring.

I've seen a bit about using the EOL resistors for tamper protection by just putting them on the alarm terminals of the sensor, and not using the tamper terminals? On the control panel then, the tamper terminals are left with the jumper in place? What would be the reason for this? As the house is pre-wired with 4 core wire, should I just do alarm and tamper separate? I have enough resistors to do this

For the EOL resistor, do these go in series, or can they be put in parallel (ie. into both alarm terminals on the last sensor?). If anyone had a photo of an EOL resistor on an installed sensor I'd appreciate it!

I'm trying to put two PIR's (hallway and landing) on the one zone. I have them both in series, but the HKC manual shows "non End-of-Line" and "dual End-of-Line" wiring diagrams. What's the difference, and which shoudl I use in this case?

Zones wise, I'm planning so far:

Zone 1: Front Door (wired) and Back Door (wireless)

Zone 2: Hall and Landing PIR (wired)

Zone 3: Front Window (wired - 2 sensors)

Zone 4: Kitchen Window (wired)

Zone 5: Panic button (wired)

Is there any complications to putting a wired and wireless sensor on the one zone as for my Zone 1, or should I use the wireless as an RF-Point?

Thanks in advance, I'm sure I'll have more questions!

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

Hi all,

As some may have seen from my thread about GSM-Q, I'm going through the motions of self-installing a HKC SW-10270. I'd be fairly handy when it comes to wiring and that, but these alarms seem fairly advanced over the 90's self install alarm I've seen in my folks house!

At the moment I'm not looking to do anything too fancy (I don't think) so would appreciate some advice from the experts on here as to what might be the best way to set up some zones and wiring.

I've seen a bit about using the EOL resistors for tamper protection by just putting them on the alarm terminals of the sensor, and not using the tamper terminals? On the control panel then, the tamper terminals are left with the jumper in place? What would be the reason for this? As the house is pre-wired with 4 core wire, should I just do alarm and tamper separate? I have enough resistors to do this

For the EOL resistor, do these go in series, or can they be put in parallel (ie. into both alarm terminals on the last sensor?). If anyone had a photo of an EOL resistor on an installed sensor I'd appreciate it!

I'm trying to put two PIR's (hallway and landing) on the one zone. I have them both in series, but the HKC manual shows "non End-of-Line" and "dual End-of-Line" wiring diagrams. What's the difference, and which shoudl I use in this case?

Zones wise, I'm planning so far:

Zone 1: Front Door (wired) and Back Door (wireless)

Zone 2: Hall and Landing PIR (wired)

Zone 3: Front Window (wired - 2 sensors)

Zone 4: Kitchen Window (wired)

Zone 5: Panic button (wired)

Is there any complications to putting a wired and wireless sensor on the one zone as for my Zone 1, or should I use the wireless as an RF-Point?

Thanks in advance, I'm sure I'll have more questions!

If possible put the PIRs on there own zone.
You have 10 zones for wired out of the box.
Wired and wire free devices do not get put on say zone unless you are wiring out of the sensor.
I rather put the wire free in as a zone as opposed to a point, can be done either way.
If you are unsure about using resistors then just wire them as non end of line.
Panel is set up for this by default.

nimrod86

altor wrote: »

If possible put the PIRs on there own zone.
You have 10 zones for wired out of the box.
Wired and wire free devices do not get put on say zone unless you are wiring out of the sensor.
I rather put the wire free in as a zone as opposed to a point, can be done either way.
If you are unsure about using resistors then just wire them as non end of line.
Panel is set up for this by default.

Each PIR on it's own zone? Can do that yeah I suppose, as you say - there's enough zones there out of the box!

When you say you put the wire-free RF sensor in as a zone, is that on a zone on it's own, or can that be added to a zone which also has wired sensors? Eg. A wired front door and wireless back door on the same zone

I actually managed to get the resistors working after finding a PDF you posted back in 2015 in another thread! Got a door and window working using mag contact/inertia sensors, and am currently wiring up a window which needs two sensors the two opening parts.

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

Each PIR on it's own zone? Can do that yeah I suppose, as you say - there's enough zones there out of the box!

When you say you put the wire-free RF sensor in as a zone, is that on a zone on it's own, or can that be added to a zone which also has wired sensors? Eg. A wired front door and wireless back door on the same zone

I actually managed to get the resistors working after finding a PDF you posted back in 2015 in another thread! Got a door and window working using mag contact/inertia sensors, and am currently wiring up a window which needs two sensors the two opening parts.

Wire everything into panel using the wired zones.

Then add the RF devices onto the zones after the zones you have used. E.G. 6 zones using wires, scan for RF devices, then scroll to the zone you want to put the wire free on, E.G. zone 8.

Happy days re the resistors

nimrod86

Another quick question for you Altor, if you don't mind!

My house has an extension that the previous owners built, but they never extended in the alarm wires (the house was built originally prewired). Worst thing is that they used the old side door in the kitchen as the way into the extension and either cut or pushed the wire back into the wall. I've a cable tracer on the way to hopefully find this cable and extend it in, but worst case I'll be going wireless.

What I'm curious about is why the RF contacts from HKC have alarm and tamper terminals on them? Would I be able to use one RF contact and then run wires from that to wired sensors, making zone that's wireless, and saving the expense of multiple RF sensors?

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

Another quick question for you Altor, if you don't mind!

My house has an extension that the previous owners built, but they never extended in the alarm wires (the house was built originally prewired). Worst thing is that they used the old side door in the kitchen as the way into the extension and either cut or pushed the wire back into the wall. I've a cable tracer on the way to hopefully find this cable and extend it in, but worst case I'll be going wireless.

What I'm curious about is why the RF contacts from HKC have alarm and tamper terminals on them? Would I be able to use one RF contact and then run wires from that to wired sensors, making zone that's wireless, and saving the expense of multiple RF sensors?

Yes you can and that is what they are designed for.

nimrod86

altor wrote: »

Yes you can and that is what they are designed for.

Brilliant! That is super handy - really come along way since my dad did a self install kit in 1990 in his house.

If I was extending off an RF sensor to a pair of wired ones, does the Dual End of Line setup still work, or would it be done as just No EOL?

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

Brilliant! That is super handy - really come along way since my dad did a self install kit in 1990 in his house.

If I was extending off an RF sensor to a pair of wired ones, does the Dual End of Line setup still work, or would it be done as just No EOL?

They are set up non end of line meaning no resistors.
Alarm and tamer circuit.

nimrod86

altor wrote: »

They are set up non end of line meaning no resistors.
Alarm and tamer circuit.

Just wanted to say a massive thanks Altor, last few bits I ordered arrived today and I was able to set up the Wireless and wired sensors in about an hour including the running cables through the extensions attic.

Not sure I'd have managed it all without your help, or at the least it would have taken three times longer with a lot more head scratching! :pac:

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

Just wanted to say a massive thanks Altor, last few bits I ordered arrived today and I was able to set up the Wireless and wired sensors in about an hour including the running cables through the extensions attic.

Not sure I'd have managed it all without your help, or at the least it would have taken three times longer with a lot more head scratching! :pac:

Thanks nimrod86, always happy to help

nimrod86

One last question! I'm at the last stage of installing now - the SABB...

The house was built pre-wired for alarm as I said, and the previous owners never used them. All houses in the estate have their SABB's in the same location, but from the outside I can't see a wire at all. In the attic I can see a wire running off in that direction but it disappears into a mass of cob-webs and fiberglass insualtion which I'm hoping to avoid at all costs!

Is there a common builders trick used for installing this cable? like am I missing a simple trick to pull it out somewhere, or will I have to go into the attic and poke it through the fascia board? All other houses bar one have the SABB about 1ft down from the fascia too with no visible wiring, so I'm unsure if these are wireless SABB's or else the wire is coming out through the blockwork (I can't see any wiring in my pebble-dashed blockwork), and there's no sign of a panel or junction in the wall of the room on the other side of the usual SABB location.

UPDATE:
Found the cable strewn about in the attic, so now I know I need to bring it out to the fascia myself. What would be best practise for doing the cable now, as I don't want it exposed on the front of the house. Options I'm thinking are either:

1. Put the SABB right up against the fasica board.

2. drop the cable behind the plasterboard of the internal room, and then drill out trough the blockwork to behind the SABB.

Professional people - what are your thoughts?

altor

nimrod86 wrote: »

One last question! I'm at the last stage of installing now - the SABB...

The house was built pre-wired for alarm as I said, and the previous owners never used them. All houses in the estate have their SABB's in the same location, but from the outside I can't see a wire at all. In the attic I can see a wire running off in that direction but it disappears into a mass of cob-webs and fiberglass insualtion which I'm hoping to avoid at all costs!

Is there a common builders trick used for installing this cable? like am I missing a simple trick to pull it out somewhere, or will I have to go into the attic and poke it through the fascia board? All other houses bar one have the SABB about 1ft down from the fascia too with no visible wiring, so I'm unsure if these are wireless SABB's or else the wire is coming out through the blockwork (I can't see any wiring in my pebble-dashed blockwork), and there's no sign of a panel or junction in the wall of the room on the other side of the usual SABB location.

UPDATE:
Found the cable strewn about in the attic, so now I know I need to bring it out to the fascia myself. What would be best practise for doing the cable now, as I don't want it exposed on the front of the house. Options I'm thinking are either:

1. Put the SABB right up against the fasica board.

2. drop the cable behind the plasterboard of the internal room, and then drill out trough the blockwork to behind the SABB.

Professional people - what are your thoughts?

If you has a rod or something that you can drill the hole and fish into attic then pull cable out just below the soffit you wont see the cable.

ABug

Hi just wondering about wiring this alarm system, any advice would be great. I’m a sparks but haven’t done much on alarms. It’s for my own house, I’ve wired a single cable to each point in the house and back to the attic

downstairs

fronth door - inertia and contact

back door - inertia and contact

roof light - inertia

Sitting room - inertia and contact

porch - pir

Sitting room - pir

kitchen - pir

upstairs

fronth bed - inertia and contact

master bed - inertia and contact

long bed - inertia and contact

bathroom - inertia and contact

relay for smoke detectors

first question is which wiring method is best

What are the advantages and disadvantages?

second question I was hoping to do each point on its own zone so when I use the app

I’ve more control on arming points . Is this a good idea ?

my device only has 10 zones so

do I need to buy and expansion pack or should I return the box for a different version with more zones has I haven’t used it yet?

any advice would be great

Security Expert

Abug, Non end of line is best.

DEOL is just a 'get out of jail free' card if theres a faulty cable. Or sometimes lazy lads will use it because they couldnt be bothered wiring the extra 2 wires.

Best method is as you say, a single zone per sensor - it also makes it much easier for fault finding and/or if you had a false alarm, to know exactly which device it was.

You can buy 10 zone boxed expanders, which are just fed with one cable from the Data bus..... zones 1 to 10 are on the panel - Expander 1 will be zones 11-20, Expander 3 will be Z21-30, and so on.

davidconroy46

If not engineer locked you shouldn't have a problem. All you will have to do is default codes only and reset time and date. If engineer locked you might have a problem. Not all engineers can unlock them.

Coddle4dinner

There is a 10 zone expander on adverts at the moment.

I got mine there for 40e or so a while back.

GoldenOzier

Hi,

I am new to boards so I am not sure if I should start a new thread or just ask here.

I am self installing the SW-10270 as follows:

I have wired 12 NC reed switch/magnet sensors on all the windows and doors without any tamper devices. I have 6 zones with 2 sensors connected in series. I just used the red and black wires from a 6 core cable. I will wire them into Zones 1 to 6. The unit was delivered with jumpers across both the alarm and tamper terminals for all 10 zones. It was supplied with twenty 4.7K ohm resistors loose in the box.

I have a few questions:

1. Do I just remove the jumpers for alarm zones 1 to 6 and leave all the other jumpers in place?
2. Should I solder a resistor to each black wire and connect the resistor to the terminal block in the unit, or should I just connect them without any resistor in series with the sensors?
3. Should I connect the front door to Zone 1 for the entry/exit delay timer?

Many thanks for your help,

Dermot

altor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119795998#Comment_119795998

The link is on the alarm and tamper on each zone. If not using the tamper then leave this link in place.

The resistor needs to be put in the last device, no real need to solider providing alarm cable is twisted around one leg and just put this into the free tamper terminal you are not using then other end to close the loop.

Yes, zone one on the alarm comes preprogrammed as entry/exit so that makes perfect sense.

GoldenOzier

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119796342#Comment_119796342

Thank you Altor for your reply.

I enclose a diagram of the circuit as I understand it:

I am using reed switches in a small plastic housing but I could get the resistor in there with a squeeze. I would have lots of space to put it at the end of the wire going back into the alarm box. Is there a reason that it has to be at the last reed switch and not at the box itself?

Many Thanks,

Dermot

altor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119797113#Comment_119797113

Its used to monitor the circuit.

If you put it in the panel you may as well go non end of line and not use it as if you had some short on the circuit the panel may not see it, hence the reason for it going in the last device.

GoldenOzier

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800067#Comment_119800067

Thanks Altor,

Thanks for the explanation, it all makes sense now, I will put the resistors after the last reed switch on each zone. I am only putting 2 sensors on each zone and keeping the cable runs very clean with no connections back to the box. In my previous house the installers had about 6 sensors and tampers on each zone and the cable connections in the attic resembled a crows nest so I can see the possibility of short circuits.

Much Appreciated,

Dermot

altor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119800669#Comment_119800669

The less the better on a zone as it makes fault finding any issues easier.

I've come across many a crows nest in my time, rather that than trying to find a missing junction box 🤣

GoldenOzier

Hi Altor,

I have the sensors connected across 8 zones.

The internal bell and control panel are connected.

I am now working on the external bell/strobe SABB.

The strobe and external bell connections are fairly obvious but is it OK to use 4 wires of the standard 6 core alarm cable for those as it mentions that these are high current?

I am not so sure about the Tamper and SABB Hold connections. There is a resistor across the tamper terminals on the SABB and I think I leave this in place and take a wire from the left contact back to the alarm box, and also take a wire from the SAB Hold back to the alarm box. Is that correct?

In the alarm box there is a resistor across the Tamper and SABB Hold terminals, do I remove this resistor and connect the 2 wires (mentioned above) from the SABB to these terminals?

Many thanks,

Dermot

altor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119812917#Comment_119812917

You take the resistor out of the control panel and use the one in the SABB.

BHO to BHO in panel

Return with one leg of resistor goes in the bell, should be marked back to panel, then into the return back at the panel.

Alarm cable is perfect for this.

GoldenOzier

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119820390#Comment_119820390

Thanks Altor, weather permitting I will finish it tomorrow :)

GoldenOzier

Hi Alton,

Thanks for your help, I powered it up over the weekend and everything worked fine except I was getting an open tamper on the SEB (outdoor alarm bell/strobe), so I disconnected the tamper return wire coming into the alarm unit and reinstated the resistor across the Tamper-SEB Hold terminals and all was OK. All zones are working and I am very pleased with it. I am happy to leave it working as it is but I would like to fix the tamper if I could. I had left the resistor across the Tamper-SEB Hold terminals on the SEB and wired it as shown in the picture. Did I do something wrong here or how can I check what could be wrong.

Many Thanks,

Dermot

altor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119913031#Comment_119913031

Looks good to me but you do need to connect the battery wire.

Did you take resistor out of panel as it only needs one in the bell once installed.

GoldenOzier

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119913326#Comment_119913326

Thanks Altor

I had not planned to use the battery in the SEB which is why I did not connect it. Do you think it is better that I buy the battery pack and connect it. Originally, I had removed the resistor in the alarm panel when I had the tamper return cable connected but then I was getting the tamper alarm. I re-installed it now when I disconnected the Tamper return from the SEB to remove the Tamper alarm. I know that this is not an ideal solution. I will test the resistance values between the Tamper cable and the SEB Hold cable back at the alarm panel, with the tamper switch open and closed. Do you know what values I should expect in those scenerios?

Many thanks,

Dermot