Tb depopulation- what next?

390kid

How’s things? Where for depopulating on Thursday morning after a lengthy battle with TB heart breaking but what can ya do. I was just wondering after the cattle go what can and can’t do in regards to the land slurry and sheds and how long until we can buy back in? Finding it very hard to get straight answers from the officials

Who2

390kid wrote: »

How’s things? Where for depopulating on Thursday morning after a lengthy battle with TB heart breaking but what can ya do. I was just wondering after the cattle go what can and can’t do in regards to the land slurry and sheds and how long until we can buy back in? Finding it very hard to get straight answers from the officials

Sorry to hear that, I can only imagine how tough it is. I know very little about full depopulated herds but my first thought was sheep. It might be worth an option for a while.

Nekarsulm

You'll need to pressure wash the yards and sheds and use a disinfectant from the approved list.
Keep the receipt for the disinfectant, you'll have to produce it as one of the conditions to receive the compensation.
Also, you need a tax clearance cert to receive the comp. so if you haven't one at the moment, get it organised.
Slurry can be spread, sorry but I can't remember if there is a delay period first.
Look after yourself, it's a raw disheartening time to around the farmyard, and it empty.

older by the day

I'm sorry to hear your story too. Are you going back to what you had before or will you try something else. Have you found the root of the TB problem. How did it spread

blue5000

I think you can buy in again after 60 days, not 100% sure, it could be longer. Also don't be tempted to close up the whole place for silage and sell off meadows, it will deplete P and K levels. Get busy with the power hose when they're gone. Lime might have to be added to slurry, again not 100% sure on this either.

Get in touch with your bank, let them know what's happening. Good chance to do some reseeding or spring corn if you have good land.

Keep yourself busy, have you an off farm job? Thursday will be a tough day for you all.

Toetohand

390kid wrote: »

How’s things? Where for depopulating on Thursday morning after a lengthy battle with TB heart breaking but what can ya do. I was just wondering after the cattle go what can and can’t do in regards to the land slurry and sheds and how long until we can buy back in? Finding it very hard to get straight answers from the officials

Sorry to hear that. First thing is mind yourself it’s an annoying process. I hope that valuation of animals going is as you expected. It won’t replace them but it well help you restart if that’s your choice. I found it fair tbh just try and maximise the payments. . Then asked to clean and disinfect all sheds, collection areas, crush etc. Power wash with approved disinfectant. Keep the receipt of disinfectant. They look for this.
DVO should be telling you when you can repopulate once you have disinfected and animals have left. No restrictions this time on slurry and can’t honestly remember from last time. From memory aninals culled at Halloween and restocked in Spring.
DVO or Dept agent should be able to give you a clear answer once you’ve done your bit. Hang in there not easy to manage and frustrating with lack on answers or delays but it will pass.

390kid

older by the day wrote: »

I'm sorry to hear your story too. Are you going back to what you had before or will you try something else. Have you found the root of the TB problem. How did it spread

Just toying with a few ideas but nothing set in stone yet, likely to stay with the sucklers wen we get open again. No we have found nothing or have heard nothing about the cause. There was a skeleton of a badger we were told found on a adjoining farm and that was it, we told them we had a increase in the deer population locally and it wasn’t really touched at all

390kid

blue5000 wrote: »

I think you can buy in again after 60 days, not 100% sure, it could be longer. Also don't be tempted to close up the whole place for silage and sell off meadows, it will deplete P and K levels. Get busy with the power hose when they're gone. Lime might have to be added to slurry, again not 100% sure on this either.

Get in touch with your bank, let them know what's happening. Good chance to do some reseeding or spring corn if you have good land.

Keep yourself busy, have you an off farm job? Thursday will be a tough day for you all.

Any set guidelines for the lime in the slurry? We’ve 2 fields marked for reseeding and fencing. I have and as much as I give out about the job I’m glad of it these days

390kid

Toetohand wrote: »

Sorry to hear that. First thing is mind yourself it’s an annoying process. I hope that valuation of animals going is as you expected. It won’t replace them but it well help you restart if that’s your choice. I found it fair tbh just try and maximise the payments. . Then asked to clean and disinfect all sheds, collection areas, crush etc. Power wash with approved disinfectant. Keep the receipt of disinfectant. They look for this.
DVO should be telling you when you can repopulate once you have disinfected and animals have left. No restrictions this time on slurry and can’t honestly remember from last time. From memory aninals culled at Halloween and restocked in Spring.
DVO or Dept agent should be able to give you a clear answer once you’ve done your bit. Hang in there not easy to manage and frustrating with lack on answers or delays but it will pass.

Thank you. Ye your spot on with the valuation found it fair enough to be honest but hard to replace them with current prices and wanting to try keep quality up.
Ye that time frame would sound right enough going by most people.
Ye after this ordeal since last April I wouldn’t depend to much on the DVO or department to give you much help

blue5000

390kid wrote: »

Any set guidelines for the lime in the slurry? We’ve 2 fields marked for reseeding and fencing. I have and as much as I give out about the job I’m glad of it these days

http://www.bovinetb.info/docs/veterinary-handbook-for-herd-management-in-the-bovine-tb-eradication-programme.pdf

Did a search on line, p29 deals with de-population, sorry no mention of lime. 120 days before you can re-stock according to that. Did you get anything in the post from the dept?

Edit; from the opening paragraph
In the first 10 years of the scheme, from a cattle population of circa 5
million head some 800,000 TB reactors were slaughtered. By 1964 the position had
improved significantly and that year, just 0.75% of the national herd of 5,659,344, or
some 40,433 animals were TB reactors, which represented a 23-fold reduction in
reactor numbers. In October 1965, Charles Haughey T.D. the then Minister for
Agriculture announced “To mark this memorable occasion of the formal declaration of
the whole state as cleared of bovine tuberculosis, I thought it well to publish a complete
account of how the job was done”. In hindsight we know that this declaration was
somewhat premature!

K.G.

390kid wrote: »

How’s things? Where for depopulating on Thursday morning after a lengthy battle with TB heart breaking but what can ya do. I was just wondering after the cattle go what can and can’t do in regards to the land slurry and sheds and how long until we can buy back in? Finding it very hard to get straight answers from the officials

Unfortunately my experience may not be relevant but we were done with bse.the last animal left the yard on friday morning and we rang the department monday morning to say we were washed and ready for inspection.did a deal on herd of cows friday subject to valuation of our own being on target.was working off farm at the time so wasnt idle and the herd landed the evening of the 41 st day.may not be relevant as tb period is longer.my advice is do what ever you have to do quickly and move on.

TooOldBoots

K.G. wrote: »

Unfortunately my experience may not be relevant but we were done with bse.the last animal left the yard on friday morning and we rang the department monday morning to say we were washed and ready for inspection.did a deal on herd of cows friday subject to valuation of our own being on target.was working off farm at the time so wasnt idle and the herd landed the evening of the 41 st day.may not be relevant as tb period is longer.my advice is do what ever you have to do quickly and move on.

I don't think this is good advice. Why the rush back in and move on? this is akin to pretend it didn't happen.
No, take a step back and use this time to evaluate the whole setup. Don't be rushed into anything, the land isn't going nowhere, in fact this might be the first time the land has gotten a rest in 50 years. Ask a few tough questions like
Is TB an ongoing problem in the area that could see it return what then?
Is there any other system worth considering now?
Would a few months off be such a bad thing?
Might be a good time to build up winter feed buffers, do a bit of land improvements etc.

josephsoap

390kid wrote: »

Just toying with a few ideas but nothing set in stone yet, likely to stay with the sucklers wen we get open again. No we have found nothing or have heard nothing about the cause. There was a skeleton of a badger we were told found on a adjoining farm and that was it, we told them we had a increase in the deer population locally and it wasn’t really touched at all

Sorry to hear what’s happening to your herd, was many reactors found on your farm before they decided to depop your herd ?

Did you buy in any livestock before the outbreak?

K.G.

TooOldBoots wrote: »

I don't think this is good advice. Why the rush back in and move on? this is akin to pretend it didn't happen.
No, take a step back and use this time to evaluate the whole setup. Don't be rushed into anything, the land isn't going nowhere, in fact this might be the first time the land has gotten a rest in 50 years. Ask a few tough questions like
Is TB an ongoing problem in the area that could see it return what then?
Is there any other system worth considering now?
Would a few months off be such a bad thing?
Might be a good time to build up winter feed buffers, do a bit of land improvements etc.


Maybe so but the dept offical who handled our case came into our yard a few years later and happened to say that we handle the whole thing the best he saw.he attributed it to the fact i was working elsewhere at the time so it wasnt all my world.he said alot of people dwell on the event for too long before finally getting their feet under them and get on with it

Mooooo

We were cleared with brucellosis years ago, had bullocks in the intervening period but were fully restocked the following spring. If you know what you want to do it's as well to drive on to make it happen, if not then go through the options, imo

jd_12345

390kid wrote: »

How’s things? Where for depopulating on Thursday morning after a lengthy battle with TB heart breaking but what can ya do. I was just wondering after the cattle go what can and can’t do in regards to the land slurry and sheds and how long until we can buy back in? Finding it very hard to get straight answers from the officials

Awfully sorry to hear that. Having TB issues here atm and tbh the Department are for the most part grand to deal with but as you say very hard to get a straight answer. Imo that’s not because they’re excessively slippery , it’s because in the circumstances of depopulation every situation is different and while there are rules it’s up to the department what they can let you off with or not. As regards slurry I think you may have to wait 6 months to spread it and land left idle for 4 months. Again that may not be correct.
From what I can make out department vets can write permits to bypass certain rules if lads are under pressure mentally or financially. If the department says jump you say how high and then you can push your case. It’s if you don’t play ball they can get awkward.

390kid

TooOldBoots wrote: »

I don't think this is good advice. Why the rush back in and move on? this is akin to pretend it didn't happen.
No, take a step back and use this time to evaluate the whole setup. Don't be rushed into anything, the land isn't going nowhere, in fact this might be the first time the land has gotten a rest in 50 years. Ask a few tough questions like
Is TB an ongoing problem in the area that could see it return what then?
Is there any other system worth considering now?
Would a few months off be such a bad thing?
Might be a good time to build up winter feed buffers, do a bit of land improvements etc.

Your right we have decided that nothing is to be done until there’s more hard evidence if the source has been found as it’s come into the area quite quickly out of nowhere

390kid

josephsoap wrote: »

Sorry to hear what’s happening to your herd, was many reactors found on your farm before they decided to depop your herd ?

Did you buy in any livestock before the outbreak?

There was 31 found since we first went down through out 4 skin tests and one blood test. Then 12 in the last blood test. Then it was decided then.
There was a bull purchased locally 4 years ago and 3 springers the year before him

Sheep breeder

390kid wrote: »

Your right we have decided that nothing is to be done until there’s more hard evidence if the source has been found as it’s come into the area quite quickly out of nowhere

Big thing is find the source of the problem with your break down, we had a on going TB problem over 4 years with 7 adjoining farmers being up and down, we done a good cull on deer and listened to a couple of good hunters who knew about deer. Get the source sorted and buy back when it suits you, the bse depopulation were many years ago and different than a TB depopulation. Best of luck and tb can be hard to deal with.

390kid

Sheep breeder wrote: »

Big thing is find the source of the problem with your break down, we had a on going TB problem over 4 years with 7 adjoining farmers being up and down, we done a good cull on deer and listened to a couple of good hunters who knew about deer. Get the source sorted and buy back when it suits you, the bse depopulation were many years ago and different than a TB depopulation. Best of luck and tb can be hard to deal with.

How did you go about culling the deer? There pinning it all on badgers here

Farmer2017

390kid wrote: »

How did you go about culling the deer? There pinning it all on badgers here

Sorry to hear this 390kid. It not a nice thing to happen and hard on ye all. Neighbour depopulated last April was 4 months before he could buy back. Had to disinfect everything and dept came out and checked it.

You need a man a licence for culling deer to go at it and can only do it from sept 1st to feb 28th.

How they contracted Tb can be caused in many ways. One animal could have it silently and spread to all others.

Badgers and deer carrying it.

My advice if any setts on your land fence cattle off from
Them. Raise your water troughs to 25cm at least so deters badgers getting in and move out from ditches a couple feet.
If feeding meal feed in morn and in troughs and keeps feed stores closed r covered.
If stagnant water lying on land drain them spots or fence around as a sick badger will drink piss and swim in them.
Keep cattle away from latrines usually found round setts that why important to fence cattle out as this is the source of infection.

Toetohand

390kid wrote: »

How did you go about culling the deer? There pinning it all on badgers here

Pinning it all on badgers here too. Deer numbers are absolutely out of control in our area. Adjoining Coilte land and private forestry is giving them great cover. Dept trapped 4 badgers here and no lesions found. We shot six deer last November four had lesions. I’m estimating there is anything from 100-150 in our area. Once you would see 2 or 3 now it’s groups of 15-20. No grass in Spring fencing destroyed etc. There my are a hybrid between Sika and Red deer. Fair size. Like having a flock of sheep for the Winter!
You can shoot deer out of season by applying for a section 42 exemption. It might be worth your while talking to neighbours as it’s probably a shared experience. We’re at the start of that process here with 3/4 neighbours.,
I’d take another another posters advice and get water troughs off ground. Put them up on blocks or get ones with a higher lip that badgers can’t access.IMO we’re just ruling it out. I’ve a strong suspicion that our outbreak is linked to rise in deer numbers.
The very best of luck to you over next couple of month’s.

lab man

Nothing to say here only keep the chin up I'd my test on friday reading tomorrow no sleep got since thursday most important 3 days of a small suckler farm

390kid

Toetohand wrote: »

Pinning it all on badgers here too. Deer numbers are absolutely out of control in our area. Adjoining Coilte land and private forestry is giving them great cover. Dept trapped 4 badgers here and no lesions found. We shot six deer last November four had lesions. I’m estimating there is anything from 100-150 in our area. Once you would see 2 or 3 now it’s groups of 15-20. No grass in Spring fencing destroyed etc. There my are a hybrid between Sika and Red deer. Fair size. Like having a flock of sheep for the Winter!
You can shoot deer out of season by applying for a section 42 exemption. It might be worth your while talking to neighbours as it’s probably a shared experience. We’re at the start of that process here with 3/4 neighbours.,
I’d take another another posters advice and get water troughs off ground. Put them up on blocks or get ones with a higher lip that badgers can’t access.IMO we’re just ruling it out. I’ve a strong suspicion that our outbreak is linked to rise in deer numbers.
The very best of luck to you over next couple of month’s.

Would different breed of deer matter? I wouldn’t know the difference but the ones we see are dark brown with a white arse.
Thanks for that we just will have to go over everything with a fine tooth comb in that matter

390kid

lab man wrote: »

Nothing to say here only keep the chin up I'd my test on friday reading tomorrow no sleep got since thursday most important 3 days of a small suckler farm

It’s torture the waiting on it. Mam told us Friday night was the first full night sleep the aul lad had in months. I do often wonder if they had to go through it would they be as keen on pushing the testing

Toetohand

390kid wrote: »

Would different breed of deer matter? I wouldn’t know the difference but the ones we see are dark brown with a white arse.
Thanks for that we just will have to go over everything with a fine tooth comb in that matter

No it wouldn’t matter. All are carriers. I knew nothing about deer up six months ago. I’m learning quick now! I only know about them from marksmen coming in to shoot. We have three species Sika, Fallow and native red. If you check images online you’ll have a fair idea what’s in your place. The lads in hunting section on boards would be good to talk to about organising a cull.,I don’t know what part of country you’re in 390 but if you want PM me and I’ll pass on numbers. Good lads found them very professional.