VW Passat struggling on icy roads

Needles73

I have a B7 Passat estate 2.0 tdi. I know it was really slippy this evening but I really struggled to the point of embarrassment. Other cars were having difficulty but mine was atrocious. I’ve previously had plenty of Toyotas and Audi A4s and am well used to winter driving technique. Car has kumho ecsta tyres which are probably 50%. Half thinking there is something wrong with clutch or diff. Or maybe it’s me? Anyone have similar car and find them fine ?
Used to keep a spare set of winter tyres so may do the same again.
Tried it with traction control off and was very gentle with throttle, staying in higher gear than normal etc
Feel free to recommend better tyres ?

FintanMcluskey

Is it an automatic or manual?

Would have considered the VW’s one the best for traction on ice

Needles73

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Is it an automatic or manual?

Would have considered the VW’s one the best for traction on ice

It’s manual. Genuinely cannot understand it but as a minimum I will be changing tyres

colm_mcm

Nothing wrong with Kumho Esctas. They’re obviously not winter tyres, but they’re not bad tyres.

Dirty Nails

Needles73 wrote: »

I have a B7 Passat estate 2.0 tdi. I know it was really slippy this evening but I really struggled to the point of embarrassment. Other cars were having difficulty but mine was atrocious. I’ve previously had plenty of Toyotas and Audi A4s and am well used to winter driving technique. Car has kumho ecsta tyres which are probably 50%. Half thinking there is something wrong with clutch or diff. Or maybe it’s me? Anyone have similar car and find them fine ?
Used to keep a spare set of winter tyres so may do the same again.
Tried it with traction control off and was very gentle with throttle, staying in higher gear than normal etc
Feel free to recommend better tyres ?

Maybe a daft question,but why would you turn off the traction control?

juicet3rry

Needles73 wrote: »

I have a B7 Passat estate 2.0 tdi. I know it was really slippy this evening but I really struggled to the point of embarrassment. Other cars were having difficulty but mine was atrocious. I’ve previously had plenty of Toyotas and Audi A4s and am well used to winter driving technique. Car has kumho ecsta tyres which are probably 50%. Half thinking there is something wrong with clutch or diff. Or maybe it’s me? Anyone have similar car and find them fine ?
Used to keep a spare set of winter tyres so may do the same again.
Tried it with traction control off and was very gentle with throttle, staying in higher gear than normal etc
Feel free to recommend better tyres ?[/quote

Did you try traction control on too? Why turn it off as a matter of interest?

heffoo

Honestly the same problem with my Passat they are terrible in this weather

wonski

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Is it an automatic or manual?

Would have considered the VW’s one the best for traction on ice

Sorry, but how?

I find all cars to be ****e when driven on ice.

What's so special about VW that other brands don't know?

wonski

heffoo wrote: »

Honestly the same problem with my Passat they are terrible in this weather

How are Passats terrible in this weather?

I honestly see no reason for them to be regardless of your tires.

Needles73

juicet3rry wrote: »

Needles73 wrote: »

I have a B7 Passat estate 2.0 tdi. I know it was really slippy this evening but I really struggled to the point of embarrassment. Other cars were having difficulty but mine was atrocious. I’ve previously had plenty of Toyotas and Audi A4s and am well used to winter driving technique. Car has kumho ecsta tyres which are probably 50%. Half thinking there is something wrong with clutch or diff. Or maybe it’s me? Anyone have similar car and find them fine ?
Used to keep a spare set of winter tyres so may do the same again.
Tried it with traction control off and was very gentle with throttle, staying in higher gear than normal etc
Feel free to recommend better tyres ?[/quote

Did you try traction control on too? Why turn it off as a matter of interest?

It seemed much worse with traction control on, keep cutting power to the point of stalling.

Needles73

wonski wrote: »

How are Passats terrible in this weather?

I honestly see no reason for them to be regardless of your tires.

Something feels totally different in my Passat vs my previous b5 and b6 audis ? Maybe the older pdi engine was more suited !
It’s like it always wants to torque steer to left even with tiny throttle input. Ease off any and it bogs down.

colm_mcm

Dirty Nails wrote: »

Maybe a daft question,but why would you turn off the traction control?

Because traction control kicking in whenever the car detects wheelspin can make progress difficult. Some cars TC systems are more sensitive and intrusive than others.

Glen Immal

Was working in Alberta, Canada, last January. -40 Snow, ice on roads. Slippy as fcuk. Hire Car, hyundai Accent, had Hankook 4 season tyres, was impressed enough by them to put the same on my avensis here in ireland when she needed new.
The last week was their first test in any snow or ice. Happy with them. Really good in the wet also.

corkgsxr

Bar you having suspension bussings etc that are bad it's all tire.

I wasn't too impressed by same tires myself didn't feel premium imo

Dirty Nails

colm_mcm wrote: »

Because traction control kicking in whenever the car detects wheelspin can make progress difficult. Some cars TC systems are more sensitive and intrusive than others.

Fraid I'd have to disagree with you on that one.The whole idea is to prevent wheelspin. If the car is getting wheelspin to the point that the TC is that noticeable,the answer is one gear higher & lift the right foot a bit.
Likewise OP mentioned the car being on the point of stalling - he likely was one gear too high.

colm_mcm

Dirty Nails wrote: »

Fraid I'd have to disagree with you on that one.The whole idea is to prevent wheelspin. If the car is getting wheelspin to the point that the TC is that noticeable,the answer is one gear higher & lift the right foot a bit.
Likewise OP mentioned the car being on the point of stalling - he likely was one gear too high.

It’s the reason there’s an off button.
In some circumstances a certain amount of wheelspin is unavoidable, and the traction control cutting in won’t help.
As said, some cars are more sensitive than others. My old Civic TRC couldn’t cope with snow for example.

I thought your original question was a general one.

Personally I find a sensitive right foot in a low gear to be more effective than changing up gears.

Dirty Nails

colm_mcm wrote: »

It’s the reason there’s an off button.
In some circumstances a certain amount of wheelspin is unavoidable, and the traction control cutting in won’t help.
As said, some cars are more sensitive than others. My old Civic TRC couldn’t cope with snow for example.

I thought your original question was a general one.

Personally I find a sensitive right foot in a low gear to be more effective than changing up gears.

Yeah,it was a general question to a point. TC on or off, it's as much skill & more importantly tyre grip to match the conditions. Don't know how us old fogies managed before ASR,TC,ABS & power steering. You'd be considered posh if you had a brake servo.

zg3409

Is it rear wheel drive with a non limited slip differential? If so all power goes to the most slippy wheel.

Sometimes going faster than you might like can help too, as its starting to move where you have most trouble and a bit of speed can get you over icy parts.

Another trick is some concrete blocks or heavy junk in the boot.

punisher5112

zg3409 wrote: »

Is it rear wheel drive with a non limited slip differential? If so all power goes to the most slippy wheel.

Sometimes going faster than you might like can help too, as it starting to move where you have most trouble and a bit of speed can get you over icy parts.

Another trick is some concrete blocks or heavy junk in the boot.

Passat..... It ain't no rear wheel drive.

Get a set of part worn winter tyres.

Wonder is the newer Passat lighter on the front?

Was there a lot in the boot?

Taking off in 2nd may help in some cases and leaving it there or 3rd, I wouldn't be going any higher then that as you can use the engine breaking to help stop the car and gently use the brakes.

An Ri rua

punisher5112 wrote: »

Passat..... It ain't no rear wheel drive.

Get a set of part worn winter tyres.

Wonder is the newer Passat lighter on the front?

Was there a lot in the boot?

Taking off in 2nd may help in some cases and leaving it there or 3rd, I wouldn't be going any higher then that as you can use the engine breaking to help stop the car and gently use the brakes.

Ice is ice. Nothing grips in ice, though the soft compound of a winter tyre is better than nothing.
I had Dunlop Grandtrek SJ6 on a Honda CRV that tackled BFTE /Storm Emma snow 8-10 inches no problemo (around Slieve Blooms) but lost traction often (I was testing limits) on ice the previous December when there was frozen light snow.

It's all down to driver technique and, as someone else mentioned, maybe suspension maintenance.

bladespin

Just to add my own 2c to this, the Passat isn't a bad winter car, the best I've driven was an Alfa 156 which seemed perfectly balanced in snow or on ice (decent tyres did help too), in comparison the Passat is heavy but predictible, I haven't tried tC off but I know how it will respond, the worst (and I mean worst compared to any car i've ever driven) was a Mondeo, that thing was a slug when it got slippery, never knew where it was going to decide to go (good tyres didn't really make a difference).

soundman45

Glen Immal wrote: »

Was working in Alberta, Canada, last January. -40 Snow, ice on roads. Slippy as fcuk. Hire Car, hyundai Accent, had Hankook 4 season tyres, was impressed enough by them to put the same on my avensis here in ireland when she needed new.
The last week was their first test in any snow or ice. Happy with them. Really good in the wet also.

Another vote for Hankook 4s tyres, been using them last few years and find them excellent.

ednwireland

An Ri rua wrote: »

Ice is ice. Nothing grips in ice, though the soft compound of a winter tyre is better than nothing.

yeh but when you get any grip at all on winters its there, as long as your road isnt on glassy sheet of ice all the way down , cant remember what year that was, day after boxing day frozen rain crashes everywhere

i use bridgestone all seasons a005 you wouldnt have noticed the packed snow in the last snowfall (havent had any this time) and regularly drive down ungritted icy roads , as long as you take it easy its ok

Wishbone Ash

heffoo wrote: »

Honestly the same problem with my Passat they are terrible in this weather

Mrs WA has a Passat. She was only saying the other night that it is the worst car she has had when it comes to driving on snow/ice.

CoBo55

Some cars just seem to be worse than others I think it's down to suspension geometry and obviously tyres too. Sister in law had an 02 Micra and I swear to god but that fecker could go anywhere. I had an 07 Octavia at the time and it was useless, the 01 transit van I had for work was brilliant (fwd) it was even better when, as was suggested earlier, I put part worn winter tyres on it.

Auld Jim Halpin

OP, check tyre pressures,esp the rears

wonski

wonski wrote: »

What's so special about VW that other brands don't know?

Electric heated tyres.

Needles73

Auld Jim Halpin wrote: »

OP, check tyre pressures,esp the rears

I’m getting front tyres replaced tomorrow regardless, have it booked for 12.
Will check pressures alright out of curiosity and see are they off by much. Will check and adjust rears also but don’t think I will replace them.

CoBo55

Needles73 wrote: »

I’m getting front tyres replaced tomorrow regardless, have it booked for 12.
Will check pressures alright out of curiosity and see are they off by much. Will check and adjust rears also but don’t think I will replace them.

What tyres are you getting?

Needles73

CoBo55 wrote: »

What tyres are you getting?

Well it has Kumho ecsta hs51 on at moment, but i see some websites call a summer tyre ? So if they have anything different that’s what’s going on. I just want them gone !! I used to use vredestein tyres and never had an issue. Some people have recommended Hankook so I will enquire about them. Perhaps better to order them and wait a few days ..?

colm_mcm

The cold spell will be gone soon

bladespin

CoBo55 wrote: »

Some cars just seem to be worse than others I think it's down to suspension geometry and obviously tyres too. Sister in law had an 02 Micra and I swear to god but that fecker could go anywhere.

Second that, learned in a Micra, nothing stopped it, ice, snow it plodded on regardless.

gk5000

Wide tyres are not good in snow/ice. Thinner tyre bites better I think.

CoBo55

Needles73 wrote: »

Well it has Kumho ecsta hs51 on at moment, but i see some websites call a summer tyre ? So if they have anything different that’s what’s going on. I just want them gone !! I used to use vredestein tyres and never had an issue. Some people have recommended Hankook so I will enquire about them. Perhaps better to order them and wait a few days ..?

Would you consider Michelin crossclimates? Can't stand the look of them tbh but they're supposed to be good in ice/snow conditions.

Spook_ie

Is that the tread pattern, not an expert but doesn't look as though it would do much for ice, even less so at 50% worn

NoBread

I''d say part of the problem is the new trend of oversized tyres. 18" alloys and bigger, no need for 255 tyres on a diesel saloon. Spreading the weight is the opposite of what you need in slippy conditions.

Popoutman

Tyres ill-suited to the conditions, is the reason for poor grip in the vast majority of cases, and almost certainly in the OP's instance as well. It's likely not the car's fault assuming the suspension is in good nick, it's likely not the driver's fault, as the traction control and stability controls will do whatever they can with the available grip, and those systems are better than 99% of drivers - turning off the traction control is not a smart thing to do. That leaves the car<->ground interface, and that the tyres. Kumho Ecstas are low to mid level summer tyres based on the tread pattern, they're definitely not "good" tyres in my own personal experience.

Most people in Ireland really do not have any experience with good quality tyres in the ordinary poor conditions we deal with nearly all of the time, as most people are buying their tyres only on the cost of the tyre, and very rarely on the ability of the tyre to do its job. It is a pity, but that is the Irish way of doing things and not going to change anytime soon.

Decent all-seasons are the most appropriate tyre type for Irish weather and Irish roads as we don't get enough ice to warrant true (non-studded) winters, and our summers and our roads are not good enough to get the benefits from good summer tyres. Though, good winter tyres would certainly help most people in the September to April time range keep more grip than the standard Irish favourite ditch-finders..

If the OP had a decent set of real brand quality all-season or winter tyres, with a many-siped tread pattern, they would not be having the same grip issues.