Forestry Penalties

Mikeymay2

Guys, Im thinking of buying some forestry. Its 15 yr planted and premiums are finished. Its in a beautiful spot that I am attached to. I dont expect to ever make money from it at my age but I do see it as an interesting project.


Its all sitka spruce surrounding a lake. I would like to tinker with it over the years, clear some space.let some light in, add natives, fruit nuts etc.


I came across a Department Agri page about penalties and it worried me, really seemed like they wanted to micromanage the forestry themselves.


My question is, do they inspect forestry and impose penalties, even after the premium period is over, and secondly would playing around with the makeup of a small part of the forest <10% bring officialdom down on me?


As the grant money (paid to the original owner) is greater than what I might be paying for the forest, I wouldnt like to find myself in this situation.

blue5000

Continuous cover forestry with a 10 year felling licence and a plan drawn up by a forester might work out for you. But if it's on a peat soil I don't think CCF is an option due to windfall problems.

I see it's 15 years old so you'll probably have to do first thinning on it too, which will probably cost as much as what the thinned timber is worth.

Mikeymay2

Thanks for this. Yes, CCF is the way I would want to go.

When you say 'might not be an option' do you mean that I wouldnt be allowed to do it or that it might not be the financally advisable strategy?

accidental forester

Go for it! You'll need to have some flavour of felling license in place but you can thin/clear areas and replant or allow natural regeneration occur. We've seen some signs/markings that would indicate that the Forest Service have been in at least once in the eight years we've owned our now 30 year old, largely Sitka plantation. We had planned a (belated) thinning regime but Darwin and Ophelia had their own ideas of "improvements". So... I clean up the damage at a respectable pace and my wife plants any open space created with a mix of hardwoods from her collection of grown from seed or found seedlings.
We generate about 95% of our home heating fuel from the Sitka. It's a lot of work but I enjoy it. Be prepared for some expenditures if you're planning on working it yourself.
The Forest Service is very specific about the site aspect and soil type to qualify for CCF. Our forester is going to see if he can get our site accepted but it's highly unlikely. It doesn't mean you can follow the tenets of CCF, it just won't be subsidized.

Mikeymay2

Thanks for the encouragement. Glad to see somebody making a go of it on the lines that I was thinking of. The forestry is not going to make any money in the next 10 years or more so if I get some pleasure or amenity value out of it, while letting most of it grow, i think its a fair deal. Im not looking for subsidies, but I dont want some official to come along and tell me I cant do someting in my own wood, when I'm working with best intentions .

blue5000

Mikeymay2 wrote: »

Thanks for the encouragement. Glad to see somebody making a go of it on the lines that I was thinking of. The forestry is not going to make any money in the next 10 years or more so if I get some pleasure or amenity value out of it, while letting most of it grow, i think its a fair deal. Im not looking for subsidies, but I dont want some official to come along and tell me I cant do someting in my own wood, when I'm working with best intentions .

The simplest way to do this is to get a management plan drawn up and a 10 year felling licence.

Mikeymay2

blue5000 wrote: »

The simplest way to do this is to get a management plan drawn up and a 10 year felling licence.

Thanks. You mean get a plan made by a forestry expert and then get it approved by the department?
Are such plans very rigid or can much flexibility be built in?

timfromtang

Mikeymay2 wrote: »

Thanks. You mean get a plan made by a forestry expert and then get it approved by the department?
Are such plans very rigid or can much flexibility be built in?

Hi Mikey,
A great deal of flexibility is possible with a management plan. If what you plan to do is good for the forest and the environment there will be no obstructive behavior from the forest service, I have had a great relationship with them over the years running our far from conventional very diverse forest.


A good forester will be able to help you with preparing a plan and obtaining a felling license. The 10 year license can be extended for another 5 years I believe, to ensure flexibility just put in many options in the management plan.


tim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/116174349#Comment_116174349

I notice that Sitka on peat tends to be less likely to blow that SS on mineral soil. Depends on the fibrosity of the peat.

blue5000

Thanks C, but I don’t think dept will pay the ccf grant on peat soils at all. I think it is €750 per ha over 12 years. Open to correction on that figure though, it could be €750 x3 over the 12 years.