Advertisement
We've partnered up with Nixers.com to offer a space where you can talk directly to Peter from Nixers.com and get an exclusive Boards.ie discount code for a free job listing. If you are recruiting or know anyone else who is please check out the forum here.
If you have a new account but can't post, please email Niamh on [email protected] for help to verify your email address. Thanks :)

EV or hybrid for high mileage and long journeys, rural driving.

  • 23-01-2021 6:17pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭✭✭ Mairead Christine


    Anyone recommend an ev or hybrid suitable for the type of driving in title? Long range would be necessary.
    Thanks!


Comments

  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,985 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    I don’t think long motorway driving lends itself to Hybrd/PHEV.

    An EV would be better but then range kicks in.

    You need to break down your typical routine and see if an EV can work.


  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional West Moderators Posts: 16,697 Mod ✭✭✭✭ yop


    Anyone recommend an ev or hybrid suitable for the type of driving in title? Long range would be necessary.
    Thanks!

    Have a PHEV, wouldn't recommend for long journeys. Anything 40km range or more than full EV.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,268 ✭✭✭ kirving


    The Mercedes E300 Bluetec Hybrid would be a good candidate.

    Fantasic motorway mile muncher, and a soft intro to the world of hybrids. It's only a Mild Hybrid, in that you can't travel really any real distance on the battery, but it does mean extremely smooth pull away from the lights and quite town driving.

    Give an idea of budget, preferences, milage type.

    Daily 100km round trip could suit a newer petrol PHEV as most would be on battery if you can charge at work, but weekly 500km round trips, would not be as suitable, since the majority of each trip would be on the petrol engine.

    If you don't charge a PHEV at every opportunity, you're carrying around a few hundred kg of batteries and motor for no benefit.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭ graememk


    Anyone recommend an ev or hybrid suitable for the type of driving in title? Long range would be necessary.
    Thanks!

    How long is long? 100, 200, 300? In a day.

    Are you back home every night? Budget?

    As others have said, hybrids don't really have any advantage on long range over standard petrol/diesel cars.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5 ✭✭✭ Mairead Christine


    Thanks for your replies, not sure yet about budget as I'm not planning to change for a year or so.
    I would do a 300km each way journey once a month maybe, every third weekend a 120km trip each way. Every day driving is between 25 and 100km. No charging point at work. The 300km journey would be a mixture of rural and national roads rather than motorway.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 3,028 ✭✭✭ Lantus


    Just the 600km trip that is an issue. You can do everything else on a good ev if your budget allows.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,490 ✭✭✭ graememk


    Thanks for your replies, not sure yet about budget as I'm not planning to change for a year or so.
    I would do a 300km each way journey once a month maybe, every third weekend a 120km trip each way. Every day driving is between 25 and 100km. No charging point at work. The 300km journey would be a mixture of rural and national roads rather than motorway.

    We have an E Niro, that can do the 120 each way without any issues even in the middle of winter.

    The 300km trip a fast charge would be needed. And depending on where you are and your route - can use the likes of plugshare to see what public charging is like on your route (Look for the CCS Fast charge)

    Our range right now at 100% is around 380km - Standard winter weather.
    The E niro has a wltp of 455km but even in the summer ours hovers around the 400 mark - maybe our right foot is too heavy, also no city driving!

    Car currently does at least 320-400km /week with the odd week double that. (R roads & N Roads). So If you can make the EV work, the running costs on it are a lot lower than a traditional ICE car.

    Last long journey (270km) i think had the car back around 30-40% left.

    Have put All Season tyres on it and they work great in the snow.

    A Plugin hybrid would work well for you also if your general commute is short
    (less than 50km round trip) and then you have the petrol engine to do the long distance journey.

    The self charging is a bit of a con. most effective in city driving, no real benefit in rural driving.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,739 ✭✭✭ zg3409


    300km each way once a month is a big issue in my.opinion.

    Even with the best 60+kWh battery cars at 35,000 euro+ you can go 300km, but you need to fully charge to get the 300km back. If you can plug in overnight at your destination then you can put in 2kW per hour, but it takes 30+ hours to refill. If your destination had a proper home charger it can charge at 7kW/h , so 8 or 9 hours to refill.

    If charging at destination is not possible because you are not there long enough or another reason, you need to publicly charge en route. This can easily take a full 1 hour + mid trip stop and totally takes the shine off EV usage. Its not so bad if its once in a blue moon or you are a 2 car household. The other big downside is there 40kW+ chargers on your normal long trip route at a point where the battery needs charging (say less than 30% left) and where you would want to stop and wait for an hour. Also is that charger just the one, which might be busy, broken or blocked, or is there 2 or 3 alternatives nearby ensuring you never get stuck?

    My solution was to get a 160km range 'cheap' EV and then use a diesel car for longer trips or if 2 cars needed take a classic old petrol car and leave the EV at home. This way you can travel non stop, or stop for a toilet break when you like. I could not justify spending 10,000 euro or 20,000 euro more for an EV car that could do it without stopping and even if I owned a 300km range EV I'd still need to stop for my common 300km each way trip.

    Its up to you, but 25km to 100km daily trip means fuel saving may be quite low. I have a 110km daily commute with toll bridge, so my savings were significant. Having on to what you have may make financial and convenience sense. A diesel is more suited for longer trips.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,985 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    Thanks for your replies, not sure yet about budget as I'm not planning to change for a year or so.
    I would do a 300km each way journey once a month maybe, every third weekend a 120km trip each way. Every day driving is between 25 and 100km. No charging point at work. The 300km journey would be a mixture of rural and national roads rather than motorway.

    I wouldn't class that as long driving to be honest.
    Many EV's can do that easily with the obvious 600km journey requiring a stop to charge or some plan if destination charging available.

    Next hurdle is realistic budget.
    How much does you mam want to really spend on a car?
    Theres no point us going off on a tangent recommending eNiro, Leaf 40's etc etc if the budget is half their cost.

    Also, if you are changing in 2 years then the EV scene will be different by then. Tech is moving on, current cars will drop in value and you realistically cannot make any decisions now about a car purchase you want to make in 2 years time.

    Based on your info posted ;

    Everyday driving (25-100km) - This can be done on the cheapest Leaf available in most cases.

    Every third Weekend (240km) - This could be done on a Leaf 30 kwh with destination charging or one stop for a fast charge. Approx 30 mins charge time.

    600km Trip - If you ant to complete the 300km leg in one go, you need one of he newer crop of EV's, Tesla, eNiro, Leaf 62 etc. But on an older Leaf 30 or Ioniq, you can do it on one stop to charge. When you get there, will you be there for long? Could you charge overnight?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,052 ✭✭✭ corks finest


    yop wrote: »
    Have a PHEV, wouldn't recommend for long journeys. Anything 40km range or more than full EV.

    40 km? That's nowhere good enough, it'll definitely get better though in the v near future


  • Advertisement
  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,985 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    40 km? That's nowhere good enough, it'll definitely get better though in the v near future

    That's normal for PHEV. Its designed for EV driving in the city, stop and go traffic. But has the ICE engine for those that want the long journey option or haven't got the confidence to go full EV yet.

    I don't think they will get much better if at all, the bigger the battery you put into a PHEV, then the heavier it gets, more space it takes up and yet you still have to fit a ICE in there and associated components.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,052 ✭✭✭ corks finest


    Gumbo wrote: »
    That's normal for PHEV. Its designed for EV driving in the city, stop and go traffic. But has the ICE engine for those that want the long journey option or haven't got the confidence to go full EV yet.

    I don't think they will get much better if at all, the bigger the battery you put into a PHEV, then the heavier it gets, more space it takes up and yet you still have to fit a ICE in there and associated components.

    Dissapointed, but there's sense in what you say


  • Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 6,026 Mod ✭✭✭✭ liamog


    As you increase the battery size in the PHEV it makes less sense to connect the engine to the drivetrain, the logical step is to disconnect it and use it as a generator instead such as an I3 Rex or the Nissan e-Power.
    That's why we probably won't see a PHEV with a 150km EV range.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 30,985 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Gumbo


    Dissapointed, but there's sense in what you say

    Not really. How much extra range do you need?
    The higher EV range you go in a PHEV, would you not be better going BEV then?


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,226 ✭✭✭✭ Mad_Lad


    Thanks for your replies, not sure yet about budget as I'm not planning to change for a year or so.
    I would do a 300km each way journey once a month maybe, every third weekend a 120km trip each way. Every day driving is between 25 and 100km. No charging point at work. The 300km journey would be a mixture of rural and national roads rather than motorway.

    I drive a 94 Ah BMW i3 PHEV, it's got the longest EV range of any PHEV in the World and it's the only PHEV in the World that has absolutely no mechanical connectivity to the wheels and it's always 100% driven my the electric motor.

    My commute is 140-150 Kms daily, roughly 30,000 Kms a year, I'm also rural. The best thing about the BMW i3 Rex is that with the generator you can take it anywhere at any time regardless of charge %, it holds the last 6.5% to ensure there is always plenty of power available. I can do most of this in the worst weather or all if I slow down, In summer I can drive all of it on battery at decent speeds but if I want to plant the foot I will use the generator for maybe 20 mins in the worst of weather.

    You can bypass public chargers, queues and broken chargers and also this time of the year it completely avoids increased charge times due to a cold battery which can add 20 mins or more to your charging time.

    The Kia cars have battery heating, also the new VW id.3 but they have proved not to be very effective for fast charging and probably only exist to allow max acceleration and regen power and not designed to heat for max charging power, just like the i3 but the i3 Rex has the generator so all this is irrelevant.

    BMW removed the Rex for the upgraded 120 Ah battery because they said it's enough range not to need it but that's not the real reason because 120 Ah or 44 Kwh is not enough.

    My i3 Rex is a 2017 so nearly 4 years old, has nearly 105,000 Kms and the battery is doing really well and I notice no loss of capacity. You should find one at a good price too, might get a decent spec for 20 K or less.

    If you decide to spend 35K on a Kia 64 Kwh ev you will have to wonder if chargers will be available when you get there, if they'll be in use or broken, you might have an hour wait before you even get to plug in your car then if the battery is cold enough could add another 20 mins to your charge time.

    The trick to cold battery charging is to charge straight away after a long drive when the battery has had a chance to warm up, if you leave it sit over night and go to fast charge it the next morning it could be cold enough to add 20 mins or more to you charge time.

    With the Rex if the battery is cold you can turn on the generator and drive, skip a charger and charge at the next one and it should be plenty warm. The trick is to use the ICE on the motorway at higher speed and save the battery for slower driving and town driving, it gives you so much options and freedom no EV can currently provide.


Advertisement