Fr Ted helped propel a cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic church

coinop

In a recent discussion about Father Ted some deep thinker comes out with the gem "It helped propel a big cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic church in Ireland." WTF? It was a funny TV show, nothing more. Some Irish people like to think mid 1990s Ireland was like Iran. The desire to feel oppressed is strong in these woke millennial types who were probably too young to even watch Father Ted during its original TV run. Luckily for them, RTE has churned out constant repeats for the past quarter century.

Would Father Ted be a hit if it was released today? Or would we roll our eyes at the paddywhackery of lazy stereotypes of drunken Irish and wife beaters? It gave us a laugh in the time of two TV stations but would struggle today imo.

Purple Mountain

Great PhD title...

coinop

Purple Mountain wrote: »

Great PhD title...

Don't give them ideas...
Students can study Harry Potter in some American colleges. How long before some gombeen decides a degree in Father Ted studies could be a great money spinner. "Analyze the difference between black and very, very, very dark blue."

Thelonious Monk

It was great when it came out, but it's been milked to death over and over since. Who's going to start the inevitable quote marathon then? You'll put my head through a wall or something I suppose.

timeToLive

That's mad, Ted.

coinop

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It was great when it came out, but it's been milked to death over and over since. Who's going to start the inevitable quote marathon then? You'll put my head through a wall or something I suppose.

Very true and oh so predictable. Makes having an online discussion about the show next to impossible. It has therefore never been properly critiqued and so has maintained its flawless reputation in the national psyche.

The Inbetween is mine

Those churches are very far away... this church is very small

EmmetSpiceland

Certainly paved the way for being able to say “bollocks” without getting a clip round the ear off the auld pair.

silliussoddius

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Usually someone calls you edgy at this stage.

That’s the hope. I’ll be in here every five minutes checking the thanks count.

The Inbetween is mine

silliussoddius wrote: »

That’s the hope. I’ll be in here every five minutes checking the thanks count.

Almost 1 so far

tdf7187

I was reading this interesting piece about a very interesting doctor today and I couldn't help but think of Father Ted:

https://www.independent.ie/life/family/the-gunman-fired-at-me-six-or-seven-times-he-hit-me-in-the-right-hip-i-had-a-feeling-that-i-had-escaped-with-my-life-pioneering-doctor-andrew-rynne-on-the-day-he-nearly-died-39950793.html


"The bishop says I'll have to go ahead and excommunicate ya but sure we'll have a few whiskeys after the formal excommunication, 'twill be grand."
"I hear you're into the old vasectomies now. Down with that sort of thing!"

Plus the bit about when the fella who shot him was found in a park and someone offered him a smoke and a can of beer....it's honestly like something from a Father Ted episode but it all actually happened.

But of course it's the other way around...Father Ted was based on real Irish stereotypes...and the reason stereotypes become stereotypes is usually because there's usually more than a grain of truth in them.

.anon.

It propelled nothing, but it was reflective of a cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic Church that was happening already. And because of that cultural shift, I don't think Father Ted could really be a hit today - at least not in the way that it was, because most people aren't remotely familiar with priests. It came along at just the right time - when the Catholic Church was still fresh enough in people's minds to be relevant, but no longer unquestioningly revered.

The Catholic Church is now very small and increasingly far away from most people's lives.

silliussoddius

tdf7187 wrote: »

I was reading this interesting piece about a very interesting doctor today and I couldn't help but think of Father Ted:

https://www.independent.ie/life/family/the-gunman-fired-at-me-six-or-seven-times-he-hit-me-in-the-right-hip-i-had-a-feeling-that-i-had-escaped-with-my-life-pioneering-doctor-andrew-rynne-on-the-day-he-nearly-died-39950793.html


"The bishop says I'll have to go ahead and excommunicate ya but sure we'll have a few whiskeys after the formal excommunication, 'twill be grand."
"I hear you're into the old vasectomies now. Down with that sort of thing!"

Plus the bit about when the fella who shot him was found in a park and someone offered him a smoke and a can of beer....it's honestly like something from a Father Ted episode but it all actually happened.

But of course it's the other way around...Father Ted was based on real Irish stereotypes...and the reason stereotypes become stereotypes is usually because there's usually more than a grain of truth in them.

Wasn’t the idea behind the show based on one of the creators uncle being a priest and he had a fascination with priests? So they built a template around the priesthood setting, of course they make digs at the church but I think the funniest bits are the regular sit-com type humour which given the priesthood setting gives it a level of absurdism.

RobbingBandit

Except it was only ever a British media backed satire regardless of the vast majority being Irish based actors and it aired on RTE 2 it was made by a London based production company for Channel 4.

tdf7187

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Except it was only ever a British media backed satire regardless of the vast majority being Irish based actors and it aired on RTE 2 it was made by a London based production company for Channel 4.

No sh** , Sherlock...I think everyone knows that.

Seemingly the claim that the creators originally went to RTE with it and were turned down is a myth. They already had top level media connections in the UK and lived in London so there wouldn't have been any point....why not shoot for the bigger audience...no point bothering with two-bit operators like RTE.

El_Duderino 09

I think it would be wrong to say it has no influence. I remember it being part of opening the catholics to ridicule. There was a culture of ridiculing the catholics at the time because it hadn’t really been acceptable up until around that time.

The show wouldn’t make sense now because ridiculing then catholics isn’t novel anymore. It didn’t start the trend of irreverence, but it was a popular part of the trend.

Dermot Morgan was doing his Fr. Trendy character before Fr. Ted. So it wasn’t the start but it was significant.

coinop

coinop wrote: »

In a recent discussion about Father Ted some deep thinker comes out with the gem "It helped propel a big cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic church in Ireland." WTF? It was a funny TV show, nothing more. Some Irish people like to think mid 1990s Ireland was like Iran. The desire to feel oppressed is strong in these woke millennial types who were probably too young to even watch Father Ted during its original TV run. Luckily for them, RTE has churned out constant repeats for the past quarter century.

Would Father Ted be a hit if it was released today? Or would we roll our eyes at the paddywhackery of lazy stereotypes of drunken Irish and wife beaters? It gave us a laugh in the time of two TV stations but would struggle today imo.

Divorce was only signed into law in 1996 following a referendum in which YES won by 0.5%, or less than 10,000 votes. DIVORCE!

We had only decriminalised 'buggery' in 1993.

Ireland was still very conservative.

Greyfox

coinop wrote: »

Don't give them ideas...
Students can study Harry Potter in some American colleges. How long before some gombeen decides a degree in Father Ted studies could be a great money spinner. "Analyze the difference between black and very, very, very dark blue."

Although it certainly wouldnt get you a job at least if you studied Harry Potter or Father Ted in college you'd be studying two of the best things ever written rather than overrarred stuff like Shakespere or Dickens.

EmmetSpiceland

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Divorce was only signed into law in 1996 following a referendum in which YES won by 0.5%, or less than 10,000 votes. DIVORCE!

We had only decriminalised 'buggery' in 1993.

Ireland was still very conservative.

Paedophilia, in Ireland, had only become socially unacceptable in ‘94. Must have been such a chaotic time to be part of The Church. Like a massive #MeToo movement hitting almost overnight.

I have to open my post by saying that I know very little about Catholicism. I grew and was a devout member of another church, a church that has a very small presence here in Ireland. I left that church (formally) two years ago. I'm really struggling to understand the points people are making regarding the irrelevance of the Catholic church in Ireland.

75% of the population here are Catholic, according to the 2016 census, which is very high. Every christening, marriage and funeral I've heard about since we moved here has been held in a Catholic church. Two women I work with have daughters who made their communion last year, and I got the impression that it is a very big day for families, and most, if not all, children partake in that ordinance. Our next door neighbour is a big GAA man, your national sport, and his local club and every GAA club on the island, according to him, has an annual mass in a Catholic church. I'm just not seeing this massive shift away from the church in everyday life.

Can someone join the dots between the apparent shift away from the Catholic church, my experience and the stats (census)? We've been looking at Christian churches to attend since we moved here, and a ridiculously high number are Catholic. They have multiple masses listed for every weekend. The other Christian churches we've found only have one or two.

Thelonious Monk

It's called a la carte catholicism, usually done by people to appease their old school parents, or because schools are run by the church

KaneToad

tara2k wrote: »

I have to open my post by saying that I know very little about Catholicism. I grew and was a devout member of another church, a church that has a very small presence here in Ireland. I left that church (formally) two years ago. I'm really struggling to understand the points people are making regarding the irrelevance of the Catholic church in Ireland.

75% of the population here are Catholic, according to the 2016 census, which is very high. Every christening, marriage and funeral I've heard about since we moved here has been held in a Catholic church. Two women I work with have daughters who made their communion last year, and I got the impression that it is a very big day for families, and most, if not all, children partake in that ordinance. Our next door neighbour is a big GAA man, your national sport, and his local club and every GAA club on the island, according to him, has an annual mass in a Catholic church. I'm just not seeing this massive shift away from the church in everyday life.

Can someone join the dots between the apparent shift away from the Catholic church, my experience and the stats (census)? We've been looking at Christian churches to attend since we moved here, and a ridiculously high number are Catholic. They have multiple masses listed for every weekend. The other Christian churches we've found only have one or two.

Dara O Briain puts it well...he's is an atheist, doesnt believe in any higher power but is, obviously, still a Catholic.

It's a tradition in this country rather than a religious belief.

Fritzbox

tara2k wrote: »

I have to open my post by saying that I know very little about Catholicism. I grew and was a devout member of another church, a church that has a very small presence here in Ireland. I left that church (formally) two years ago. I'm really struggling to understand the points people are making regarding the irrelevance of the Catholic church in Ireland.

75% of the population here are Catholic, according to the 2016 census, which is very high. Every christening, marriage and funeral I've heard about since we moved here has been held in a Catholic church. Two women I work with have daughters who made their communion last year, and I got the impression that it is a very big day for families, and most, if not all, children partake in that ordinance. Our next door neighbour is a big GAA man, your national sport, and his local club and every GAA club on the island, according to him, has an annual mass in a Catholic church. I'm just not seeing this massive shift away from the church in everyday life.

Can someone join the dots between the apparent shift away from the Catholic church, my experience and the stats (census)? We've been looking at Christian churches to attend since we moved here, and a ridiculously high number are Catholic. They have multiple masses listed for every weekend. The other Christian churches we've found only have one or two.

People still enjoy the various rites and ceremonies of the Church, even if they are that particularly devout. First Holy Communion, for instance, for most families it's just a a big day out, the children get to wear unusual clothes and the relatives call around and there's a big meal somewhere and hopefully they all have fun.
Weddings and funerals are the same. Even if the people involved are not so devout, it just seems a bit strange for many people to not hold these events in a church.

KaneToad

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It's called a la carte catholicism, usually done by people to appease their old school parents, or because schools are run by the church

I think it's more than that. I think people actually like the pageantry of the ceremonies. They couldn't be arsed sitting through a weekly mass but would gladly participate in the occasional christening, wedding or funeral.

whisky_galore

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It's called a la carte catholicism, usually done by people to appease their old school parents, or because schools are run by the church

Bouncy castle Catholics.

alchemist33

.anon. wrote: »

The Catholic Church is now very small and increasingly far away from most people's lives.

I see what you did there. Well played!

endacl

coinop wrote: »

Students can study Harry Potter in some American colleges.

Any Phd thesis title can be improved by adding 'Harry Potter and the...'

Harry Potter and the Disappearance of traditional (especially courtyard) architecture in the Middle East and adaptation of Western styles of city planning in the second part of the 20th century.

Harry Potter and the Morbidity/complications associated with autogenous bone graft harvesting from the chin to augment resorbed/deficient alveolar bone defects prior to dental implant placement.

Harry Potter and the Insurgent Butterflies: Gender and Revolution in El Salvador, 1965-2015.

Harry Potter and the Alpha Alpha Alpha Male: Relations Among Fraternity Membership, Traditional Masculine Gender Roles, and Sexual Violence.

91wx763

I remember me mother turning it off on it's first run. "Disgusting programme". "Pure filt". Subject of the sunday sermon from the pulpit.

Roll the years on and great hilarity in the armchair when I got home from the pub one night.

"Would ya look at yer man drunk in the chair, and the other fellas dressed up as priests". "Mother that's Father Ted, the yoke you used to turn off". "Ah but shur you couldn't help laughing......".

Thelonious Monk

KaneToad wrote: »

I think it's more than that. I think people actually like the pageantry of the ceremonies. They couldn't be arsed sitting through a weekly mass but would gladly participate in the occasional christening, wedding or funeral.

Maybe, the whole thing gives me the creeps I don't know how people do it.

KaneToad

KaneToad wrote: »

Dara O Briain puts it well...he's is an atheist, doesnt believe in any higher power but is, obviously, still a Catholic.

It's a tradition in this country rather than a religious belief.

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

It's called a la carte catholicism, usually done by people to appease their old school parents, or because schools are run by the church

KaneToad wrote: »

I think it's more than that. I think people actually like the pageantry of the ceremonies. They couldn't be arsed sitting through a weekly mass but would gladly participate in the occasional christening, wedding or funeral.

Thank you for your replies. So, it's primarily to do with tradition and pageantry. Why do the religious leaders go along with this? Surely the church would be better off with a smaller number of people who believe that the church is true.

An Ri rua

whisky_galore wrote: »

Bouncy castle Catholics.

In fairness, though I hate sunshine footballers and sunshine anything, it's still better than Frank Castle Catholics. Whose solution was to beat the living sh1t out of anyone (weaker than them).

That might be a good PhD. How the Frank Castle Catholics got emasculated and gentrified out of existence by the Bouncy Castle Catholics.
Or maybe just a David McWilliams daydream.... And then he could throw in the East Belfast Prod for good measure, to satisfy his in-laws and make his article appear exotic, historically grounded and, oh yeh, woke.

Fritzbox

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Maybe, the whole thing gives me the creeps...

I think the point is, most people don't, though.

An Ri rua

tara2k wrote: »

Thank you for your replies. So, it's primarily to do with tradition and pageantry. Why do the religious leaders go along with this? Surely the church would be better off with a smaller number of people who believe that the church is true.

The Church of God or the Church of St Peter? One needs paying for on a weekly basis (and not being anti-Church here, simply pragmatic. Organisations of such scale need regular funding. Not by the few who have given most of it away already if they are truly true believers ala St Francis of Assisi).

dxhound2005

coinop wrote: »

In a recent discussion about Father Ted some deep thinker comes out with the gem "It helped propel a big cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic church in Ireland." WTF? It was a funny TV show, nothing more. Some Irish people like to think mid 1990s Ireland was like Iran. The desire to feel oppressed is strong in these woke millennial types who were probably too young to even watch Father Ted during its original TV run. Luckily for them, RTE has churned out constant repeats for the past quarter century.

Would Father Ted be a hit if it was released today? Or would we roll our eyes at the paddywhackery of lazy stereotypes of drunken Irish and wife beaters? It gave us a laugh in the time of two TV stations but would struggle today imo.

There is a lot more to it than you would think.

https://journals.openedition.org/etudesirlandaises/2999

An Ri rua

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Maybe, the whole thing gives me the creeps I don't know how people do it.

You may require an exorcism monkboy.

salmocab

A teacher in our school who was a priest used to tell us it just wasn’t funny and not because of the religious stuff just that it was a poor show. I strongly suspect he was full of it.

An Ri rua

An Ri rua wrote: »

The Church of God or the Church of St Peter? One needs paying for on a weekly basis (and not being anti-Church here, simply pragmatic. Organisations of such scale need regular funding. Not by the few who have given most of it away already if they are truly true believers ala St Francis of Assisi).

Makes perfect sense. A church needs to be funded, just like every organisation in the world.

silliussoddius

whisky_galore wrote: »

Bouncy castle Catholics.

How would you define non bouncy castle catholics? It’s not as if before the influence of the church started to ane that everyone who called themselves catholic were well versed in the theology of what seperated catholoicism from protestantism.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

I remember Graham Linehan saying on the commentary that they were going for affection rather than irreverence. They weren’t aiming for mean-spiritedness and I think that comes across. I mean, I think the show still qualifies as irreverent but it’s not scathing or angry.

I loved the show but it didn’t change me being a Catholic.

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts

.anon. wrote: »

It propelled nothing, but it was reflective of a cultural shift away from the reverence of the Catholic Church that was happening already. And because of that cultural shift, I don't think Father Ted could really be a hit today - at least not in the way that it was, because most people aren't remotely familiar with priests. It came along at just the right time - when the Catholic Church was still fresh enough in people's minds to be relevant, but no longer unquestioningly revered.

The Catholic Church is now very small and increasingly far away from most people's lives.

The church is just one part of the show. What elevates it to greatness for me is recognising so many people in the show’s characters. The characters are exaggerated but relatable to people many of us have known. So I think I would enjoy it just as much if it debuted today. The church stuff would have a historical aspect to it that I’d find interesting to revisit too. A show doesn’t need to be on a contemporary topic to be funny or interesting.

tdf7187

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Paedophilia, in Ireland, had only become socially unacceptable in ‘94.

That's nonce-sense.

Pherekydes

endacl wrote: »

Any Phd thesis title can be improved by adding 'Harry Potter and the...'

Harry Potter and the Temple of Doom
Harry Potter and the Last Crusade
Harry Potter and the Fellowship of the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull

Mad_maxx

tara2k wrote: »

I have to open my post by saying that I know very little about Catholicism. I grew and was a devout member of another church, a church that has a very small presence here in Ireland. I left that church (formally) two years ago. I'm really struggling to understand the points people are making regarding the irrelevance of the Catholic church in Ireland.

75% of the population here are Catholic, according to the 2016 census, which is very high. Every christening, marriage and funeral I've heard about since we moved here has been held in a Catholic church. Two women I work with have daughters who made their communion last year, and I got the impression that it is a very big day for families, and most, if not all, children partake in that ordinance. Our next door neighbour is a big GAA man, your national sport, and his local club and every GAA club on the island, according to him, has an annual mass in a Catholic church. I'm just not seeing this massive shift away from the church in everyday life.

Can someone join the dots between the apparent shift away from the Catholic church, my experience and the stats (census)? We've been looking at Christian churches to attend since we moved here, and a ridiculously high number are Catholic. They have multiple masses listed for every weekend. The other Christian churches we've found only have one or two.

cultural catholicism is still very prevalent , thats what you have observed

RandomViewer

By the same metric would " Father Brown" have the opposite effect?