VRT increased by 30% from Dec to Jan- urgent ques

gogreen81

Hi all
Have a question related to the car I imported
Before I imported I tried to calculate the vrt with multiple options for same car as on vrt drop down list . Generated a print for the same. This was ofcourse Before new year as I imported around Christmas
Now since I got appointment in 2nd week January . I logged to see if omsp and vrt has reduced
Surprisingly it is coming 30-33% extra with same data
Looks like vrt calculator is wrong but will I have to pay increased amount as that’s close to 3k extra which is actually what I think I would have been saying originally

Any advise ? Urgently required before vrt
The calc shoes no diff in vrt if I enter car purchase date as jan 19 or dec 19 which is wrong I think

colm_mcm

There have been changes to how vehicle emissions are calculated for VRT.
Cars that have higher emissions than average fare particularly badly in this.

You are going to assessed on the new VRT rates regardless of when you had the car in the country.

Can you give some more info, like the stat code of the model you’re registering etc, some basic model details?

User1998

gogreen81 wrote: »

Any advise ? Urgently required before vrt
The calc shoes no diff in vrt if I enter car purchase date as jan 19 or dec 19 which is wrong I think

The calculator doesn’t ask for the purchase date. It asks for date of first registration in the UK which is irrelevant to your problem. What year is the car?

New VRT rates were announced months ago in the budget. The information was readily available and broadcasted on the news

gogreen81

Hi Colm, thanks
It’s a x3 jan19, msport .144 co2 . 0.026 nox
The diff in vrt from last week to today shows an increase of 3 grand increase which is a huge diff.

I am
Not sure if stat code is of any use as I tried using a couple of old stat codes that were generated in dec and even they are coming off with high value

Strangely if I change car reg date from jan2019 to dec 2019, there’s no change in vrt. But if I change the months in 2020 then the vrt shows increase with each month ...I would have actually got vrt done in dec but there were no appointments

colm_mcm wrote: »

There have been changes to how vehicle emissions are calculated for VRT.
Cars that have higher emissions than average fare particularly badly in this.

You are going to assessed on the new VRT rates regardless of when you had the car in the country.

Can you give some more info, like the stat code of the model you’re registering etc, some basic model details?

colm_mcm

The stat code would be for your specific specification/model of car.
I.e different equipment levels have different stat codes, different engine and emissions variations of that particular equipment levels all have their own different stat codes.
Your car has only one valid statistical code.

The co2 level you have is from the V5?
Have you seen the Co2 level the VRT calculator is coming back with now?

Yours is on the higher end of emissions and I’m not surprised to see an increase.

Have you definitely entered the nox figure correctly?

gogreen81

User1998 wrote: »

The calculator doesn’t ask for the purchase date. It asks for date of first registration in the UK which is irrelevant to your problem. What year is the car?

New VRT rates were announced months ago in the budget. The information was readily available and broadcasted on the news

Thanks but not clear on how the calcs are done to see big increase in vrt
Talking to one of the dealer he says it might be wrong calc and you can appeal but that the next step and want to be proactive or atleast understand clearly as I am sure I will have to go thru appeal
Other details as below

User1998

The VRT has increased because there are more vrt rates and there is a new formula that increases your co2 emissions. Read the article below

https://www.vrt.ie/faq/budget-2021-vehicle-registration-tax/

colm_mcm

Do you know the current (not new price but current used value) OMSP they have on the car, and what the OMSP was last time you checked ?

gogreen81

Yes , I am not sure from where I can get stat code then. I got it from the very first calc I did in dec so it was like a quote number to me.
And then reused it again now instead of a new calc but shows same amount
Yes co2 level and nox I picked from v5
The closest matching car under drop down shows 143 and that’s what I shows in calc when I printed

I can put the screenshot here is that possible to do
So 9.8 earlier and now coming as 12.8
I have both screenshots

As said not sure where to get stat code and I was thinking it’s generated each time I do a new calc

colm_mcm wrote: »

The stat code would be for your specific specification/model of car.
I.e different equipment levels have different stat codes, different engine and emissions variations of that particular equipment levels all have their own different stat codes.
Your car has only one valid statistical code.

The co2 level you have is from the V5?
Have you seen the Co2 level the VRT calculator is coming back with now?

Yours is on the higher end of emissions and I’m not surprised to see an increase.

Have you definitely entered the nox figure correctly?

gogreen81

colm_mcm wrote: »

Do you know the current (not new price but current used value) OMSP they have on the car, and what the OMSP was last time you checked ?

Earlier 42620, now 41143

colm_mcm

Ok. You’re now on an estimated WLTP equivalent of 177g instead of 144g NEDC.
The VRT rate on that is 31%

You were on 23% on the old system.

I think that’s where the €3k comes from on the calculator.


Now I don’t know if the actual manufacturers WLTP figure for your particular car is available or whether it’s noted on the V5, or whether that would make a difference to the VRT figure.

Buddy Bubs

c02 is 144 under nedc, old method of classifying. call this x

using the formula x(1.1405) +12.858 gives you 177.09 for the new co2 under wltp, new method of classifying

this is the 2nd highest band and attracts 31% VRT.

OMSP is 41,165 when I go to VRT calculator so 31% VRT is €12,761. Plus a small nox charge on top.

Last year this car would have been in 23% bracket which on same omsp would have been €9,467

Theres your €3,000

Honestly, its a pity you got caught out like this but the govt do not want high emission cars coming in here. Its another diesel SUV as far as they are concerned and that is not what is seen as the future.

colm_mcm

I think that also makes the annual tax €600 as well instead of €400

gogreen81

Thanks yes that what I just figured out as well.
I am not sure what can be done

colm_mcm wrote: »

Ok. You’re now on an estimated WLTP equivalent of 177g instead of 144g NEDC.
The VRT rate on that is 31%

You were on 23% on the old system.

I think that’s where the €3k comes from on the calculator.


Now I don’t know if the actual manufacturers WLTP figure for your particular car is available or whether it’s noted on the V5, or whether that would make a difference to the VRT figure.

Wildly Boaring

gogreen81 wrote: »

Thanks yes that what I just figured out as well.
I am not sure what can be done

Have you proof you couldn't get an appointment pre 1/1/21?

gogreen81

Yes thanks for that . My bad if I had known I would have not bought or have looked for alternate options. No savings in importing the car really

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

c02 is 144 under nedc, old method of classifying. call this x

using the formula x(1.1405) +12.858 gives you 177.09 for the new co2 under wltp, new method of classifying

this is the 2nd highest band and attracts 31% VRT.

OMSP is 41,165 when I go to VRT calculator so 31% VRT is €12,761. Plus a small nox charge on top.

Last year this car would have been in 23% bracket which on same omsp would have been €9,467

Theres your €3,000

Honestly, its a pity you got caught out like this but the govt do not want high emission cars coming in here. Its another diesel SUV as far as they are concerned and that is not what is seen as the future.

gogreen81

Thanks guys , very disappointed with this.
Do u think I can still appeal if I am vrt,ed higher ? As I did try to book appointment before new year but didn’t get
I don’t mind paying the additional €200
Motor tax but this was unexpected to me and not sure I can blame the dealer as it’s not that I import cars everyday to know all these things . Waiting for this purchase for over 10 months now

gogreen81

Wildly Boaring wrote: »

Have you proof you couldn't get an appointment pre 1/1/21?

Not sure I have a proof but the earliest appointment I tried in all
Dublin centre was 15th jan as I remember and not even my prefererrd one . I even booked 10 days before car was actually imported trying to get the earliest possible slot to be sure that I do in 30 days

Buddy Bubs

gogreen81 wrote: »

Thanks guys , very disappointed with this.
Do u think I can still appeal if I am vrt,ed higher ? As I did try to book appointment before new year but didn’t get
I don’t mind paying the additional €200
Motor tax but this was unexpected to me and not sure I can blame the dealer as it’s not that I import cars everyday to know all these things . Waiting for this purchase for over 10 months now

It was well known thing on the likes of this forum and people in the know but it was always going to catch out people, you're not going to be the only one. Wait until you see the threads about VAT being charged on top. I am not sure if that will apply to you or not, not sure what the applicable date is for that, but someone here will tell you.

As for appeals, I believe its really only if they get the OMSP wrong. Over valuing car. C02 and NOX are black and white really so dont think youve a case there, nor will I see any sympathy from them for not being able to get an appointment in 2020.

Silver lining? Your car, as you can see, will not be imported into ireland too much from now on with VRT figures like that so your residual value should stay comparatively higher, won't be benchmarked against UK imports.

colm_mcm

gogreen81 wrote: »

Thanks yes that what I just figured out as well.
I am not sure what can be done

You may be able to argue the OMSP depreciation isn’t enough.
On the other hand the lack of imports and increased new price of an x3 will strengthen used prices so this may negate the argument.

Wildly Boaring

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

As for appeals, I believe its really only if they get the OMSP wrong. Over valuing car. C02 and NOX are black and white really so dont think youve a case there, nor will I see any sympathy from them for not being able to get an appointment in 2020.

There is an official appeals process.
You pay vrt and then appeal.

You MUST appeal within 30 days. MUST!!!

If you're paying the VRT then an appeal is a no-brainer.
You have the original rate. You have the new rate. You have the evidence that you had the car here pre 31/12/20. You book the Jan appointment last year??

Nothing to say you'll win appeal. But if you plan paying the VRT, you must appeal.

gogreen81

colm_mcm wrote: »

You may be able to argue the OMSP depreciation isn’t enough.
On the other hand the lack of imports and increased new price of an x3 will strengthen used prices so this may negate the argument.

I hope so . Don’t see the increased price much / I let go 2 cars here as they were of similar price or good value . Now I will end up paying the same
Fingers crossed

gogreen81

Yes that’s what I will be going for. Luckily I have a print which I took last year showing less VRT.
And appointment I definitely booked in mid-dec but earliest was mid-jan
Seems I have no other options as the calcs seems to be right
Would see if anyone else posts similar questions and feedback as this will impact everyone who imported in Dec or planning to import now with new Vat
As everyone is rightly saying that used car price will go up in Ireland

Wildly Boaring wrote: »

There is an official appeals process.
You pay vrt and then appeal.

You MUST appeal within 30 days. MUST!!!

If you're paying the VRT then an appeal is a no-brainer.
You have the original rate. You have the new rate. You have the evidence that you had the car here pre 31/12/20. You book the Jan appointment last year??

Nothing to say you'll win appeal. But if you plan paying the VRT, you must appeal.

Squeaksoutloud

Saw this on completecar.ie...

https://www.completecar.ie/askusanything/question/17250/Can-I-pay-the-old-VRT-rate-on-import

Hi Darren,

We were lead to believe that there was no leeway on this, but since you posted this question, you've told us that you've been in touch with Revenue and, actually, a refund of the difference should be possible for people in your situation. We'd urge anyone else in this situation to get clarification beforehand of course.

gogreen81

Hi thanks for the below details
Sorry not clear on the part in the post . From
Whom the clarification needs to be sought beforehand? Is it revenue ?

I am trying to arrange the wltp figure from the dealer I bought car and he’s probably in contact with bmw. Checking online I see the wltp on bmw website takes me to 26% category as it’s actual and not from the vrt formula
Keeping options open for me and in end I might appealing with the data I have gathered

Squeaksoutloud wrote: »

Saw this on completecar.ie...

https://www.completecar.ie/askusanything/question/17250/Can-I-pay-the-old-VRT-rate-on-import

Hi Darren,

We were lead to believe that there was no leeway on this, but since you posted this question, you've told us that you've been in touch with Revenue and, actually, a refund of the difference should be possible for people in your situation. We'd urge anyone else in this situation to get clarification beforehand of course.

gogreen81

Not sure if I can change the title
But the story here is that I have ended up paying 3300 extra vrt as compared to the dec quote which was 9800. The lady at the office said first that they are using old calcs till Feb but then next time I went they actually charged 2021 rates and not 2020.
The office themselves seems to be not clear

Any suggestions on appeal if anyone has done it before ? Should I do myself or any agency in between like the one I know charges 30%