Motoring Offense- speed, using mobile

Barnaboy

Looking for some advice. I got pulled over on the motorway earlier for speeding and using my mobile. I was pulled over by a guard in an unmarked car. From the first moment he was aggressive and threatening. I have never got as much as a parking ticket in my entire life and no penalty points.

He accused me of driving over 160km/hr. I am honest enough to own up to the fact I was speeding. But I wasn't doing even close to that speed. 135 km/hr maybe? I disagreed, politely, with his charge. He just told me that I could tell that to the judge.

On the mobile use, I just stupidly picked it up to turn on spotify. But that was all. I have hands free in the car, so I normally never touch it when driving.

He took my licence and told me he was cautioning me under two pieces of legislation, can't remember what.

He never gave me anything in writing.

If I do get a summons I would worry that what I was accused of sounds really bad and I could end up losing my licence.

I deserve penalty points for this, I was speeding. And I used my mobile while driving. Not proud of it but the guard made an untrue accusation.

So what is most likely to happen? Any and all advice welcome.

Tzardine

Sounds like you are automatically being brought to court. Could be looking at a ban for being over 160.

Its quite common to get a ban at this speed

https://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&source=android-browser&q=driving+ban+over+160kmh

Barnaboy

Tzardine wrote: »

Sounds like you are automatically being brought to court. Could be looking at a ban for being over 160.

Its quite common to get a ban at this speed

https://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&source=android-browser&q=driving+ban+over+160kmh

Thanks for that. If this is the case, how quickly will I know?

This is really concerning. I honestly wasn't even close to that speed. If it happens then it sounds like I may need a solicitor.

I was wrong, deserve to get penalty points, but losing my licence is not justified for what I did.

biko

Get a solicitor's opinion, even if you haven't got a summons yet.
They will be able to explain better what will happen and various consequences.

Truckermal

Tzardine wrote: »

Sounds like you are automatically being brought to court. Could be looking at a ban for being over 160.

Its quite common to get a ban at this speed

https://www.google.com/search?ie=UTF-8&client=ms-android-samsung-gs-rev1&source=android-browser&q=driving+ban+over+160kmh

That's not even in Ireland FFS stop scaremongering..... OP would have been arrested on the spot if that was the case..

@OP he can only do you for one offence..

Tzardine

Truckermal wrote: »

That's not even in Ireland FFS stop scaremongering..... OP would have been arrested on the spot if that was the case..

@OP he can only do you for one offence..

I posted a link to search results, there are a number of cases from ROI mentioned.

And to say the OP would be have been arrested on the spot is totally incorrect.

Not trying to scare the OP, but it is important that they understand the potential outcomes.

OP needs to get professional legal advice once the summons arrives.

Barnaboy

Barnaboy wrote: »

.............

He took my licence and told me he was cautioning me under two pieces of legislation, can't remember what. .........So what is most likely to happen? Any and all advice welcome..

Two fines and 3 points IMO. I'd not worry about the false accusation. Worst case scenario you might get a summons for careless driving or something. Speeding and being on the phone is a tad naughty to be fair.

Truckermal wrote: »

That's not even in Ireland FFS stop scaremongering..... OP would have been arrested on the spot if that was the case..

@OP he can only do you for one offence..

Iirc you can get the points for only one offence, you can get the fine for both though.

Witcher

You may get an FCPN for the phone, that'll be it.

Tzardine

Witcher wrote: »

You may get an FCPN for the phone, that'll be it.

Again, not trying to be alarmist, but the OP said that he was cautioned and the Garda said he can explain it to the judge. He is being summonsed. Unlikely to be given a FCPN

Witcher

Tzardine wrote: »

Again, not trying to be alarmist, but the OP said that he was cautioned and the Garda said he can explain it to the judge. He is being summonsed. Unlikely to be given a FCPN

Being summonsed for what?

un5byh7sqpd2x0

Tzardine wrote: »

Again, not trying to be alarmist, but the OP said that he was cautioned and the Garda said he can explain it to the judge. He is being summonsed. Unlikely to be given a FCPN

Utter nonsense.

Tzardine

You would have to ask the Garda, or the OP when he receives it.

Tzardine

Clyde Odd Newsman wrote: »

Utter nonsense.

How so?

Henryq.

Does the actual speed have to be proven?

If Gard is saying 160

Tzardine

Tzardine wrote: »

Again, not trying to be alarmist, but the OP said that he was cautioned and the Garda said he can explain it to the judge. He is being summonsed. Unlikely to be given a FCPN

He is entitled to receive a ticket, in fact he is supposed to receive a ticket.
OP, you will not be summoned for using the phone & definitely not for speeding.
Just wait a while & see if you get a ticket.

Are you sure he was cautioning you? It's fairly doubtful. Did he ask for your driving licence & certificate of insurance perhaps?

Witcher

Tzardine wrote: »

You would have to ask the Garda, or the OP when he receives it.

You're talking shoite, neither of the offences the OP just admitted to would be dealt with by summons.

Tzardine

Witcher wrote: »

You're talking shoite, neither of the offences the OP just admitted to would be dealt with by summons.

Dangerous driving is a court summons.

Is driving "over 160" while looking at the phone dangerous? Maybe the Garda thinks so?

The Garda said to the OP that he can explain his case to the judge. In what reality is that not a strong indication that he will be brought to court??

Witcher

Tzardine wrote: »

Dangerous driving is a court summons.

Is driving "over 160" while looking at the phone dangerous? Maybe the Garda thinks so?

The Garda said to the OP that he can explain his case to the judge. In what reality is that not a strong indication that he will be brought to court??

If the Garda considered what the OP did to be Dangerous Driving they would have been lifted on the spot not summonsed. Driving so dangerously that the guard let them drive away again...would ya get real lol

The prospect of being before a judge is part and parcel of many a roadside bollocking.

In this instance it looks like the guard used his discretion and the OP was cautioned on the roadside for the manner of their driving. If anything at all comes out of this it will be an FCPN for the phone and that will be it.

jamesbondings

Witcher wrote: »

You may get an FCPN for the phone, that'll be it.

This is what i reckon, OP doesnt say if he was caught by a gun or a van - the fact it was unmarked that pulled him makes me believe he was caught on the phone - the unmarked witnessed this - even if a ticket comes in the post for speeding, id be contesting it -of course i wouldnt have told the gaurds i was speeding.

the phone charge yeah, caught. but the speeding, they have to prove. Can they? If not, contest it.

Barnaboy

Thanks to everyone for their responses. I certainly hope the majority of the responses are accurate. I was stupid and deserve penalty points. I will learn from this and be more conscious of my speed when driving.

Just to clarify, as soon as I touched the phone I was pulled up. I was almost certainly comfortably under the speed limit when I did it. I was in the left lane and behind other vehicles at the time.

The speeding was when I first joined the motorway and for a bit after.

jamesbondings

Barnaboy wrote: »

Thanks to everyone for their responses. I certainly hope the majority of the responses are accurate. I was stupid and deserve penalty points. I will learn from this and be more conscious of my speed when driving.

Just to clarify, as soon as I touched the phone I was pulled up. I was almost certainly comfortably under the speed limit when I did it. I was in the left lane and behind other vehicles at the time.

The speeding was when I first joined the motorway and for a bit after.

Did you notice a van or a garda on the side of the road with his gun? if not, the speeding is just a "guess" on the gaurds behalf and they cant prove it - of course if you told the gaurd you were speeding that might be a different story.

PopZiggy

He was prob just trying to scare you. Will you come back and let us know the outcome of this? Noone ever does after people take the time to give advice.

Tzardine

Witcher wrote: »

If the Garda considered what the OP did to be Dangerous Driving they would have been lifted on the spot not summonsed. Driving so dangerously that the guard let them drive away again...would ya get real lol.

What is so unbelievable about it? It happens very often.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showthread.php?p=63184371

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showpost.php?p=106785083&postcount=51

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin//showpost.php?p=54226647&postcount=1

I could link 10 more examples if I could be bothered.

IMO OP is getting a summons, it is clear from how he described his interaction with the Garda.

Does he deserve it, no probably not. But the fact is the Garda said he was bringing him to a judge. How more clear does it need to be for you?

jamesbondings

PopZiggy wrote: »

He was prob just trying to scare you. Will you come back and let us know the outcome of this? Noone ever does after people take the time to give advice.

it will be months before this has been in court!

Bro got a fnpc the other day - in order to contest it he needs to await a summons and not pay the fine, which has a dealine of something like 4 weeks, thats before the system even realises he wants to contest it.

Barnaboy

jamesbondings wrote: »

Did you notice a van or a garda on the side of the road with his gun? if not, the speeding is just a "guess" on the gaurds behalf and they cant prove it - of course if you told the gaurd you were speeding that might be a different story.

Definitely not. He was driving in an unmarked car. Looking back I'm not exactly sure what I said on the speeding. But I contested the assertion that I was going over 160.

Oh and I should clarify. full remorse for using the phone as well. I didn't mention that in my last post. Ironically I often give out to others for doing it.

jamesbondings

Barnaboy wrote: »

Definitely not. He was driving in an unmarked car. Looking back I'm not exactly sure what I said on the speeding. But I contested the assertion that I was going over 160.

Oh and I should clarify. full remorse for using the phone as well. I didn't mention that in my last post. Ironically I often give out to others for doing it.

Id say its a fine to be honest. any more is a stretch unless you professing your guilt is enough for them to do you.

Are you sure he was cautioning you OP?
Doesn't really sound right, did he ask for your licence and insurance?

POBox19

Barnaboy wrote: »

Definitely not. He was driving in an unmarked car. Looking back I'm not exactly sure what I said on the speeding. But I contested the assertion that I was going over 160.

Oh and I should clarify. full remorse for using the phone as well. I didn't mention that in my last post. Ironically I often give out to others for doing it.

All you can do really is wait to see what happens next.

The unmarked car should have the kit to record your driving as evidence in court, so the speed will not be in doubt if they decide to go that way.


Either way, let's know if/when you hear from them.
It is better to be a bit late in this world than too early in the next.

Barnaboy

POBox19 wrote: »

All you can do really is wait to see what happens next.

The unmarked car should have the kit to record your driving as evidence in court, so the speed will not be in doubt if they decide to go that way.


Either way, let's know if/when you hear from them.
It is better to be a bit late in this world than too early in the next.

Agreed. Lesson learned. I'll do my best to update this thread when I find out. How long do FCPN take to arrive? I have never got one before.

jamesbondings

Barnaboy wrote: »

Agreed. Lesson learned. I'll do my best to update this thread when I find out. How long do FCPN take to arrive? I have never got one before.

my ro got his last week in 3 working days

Barnaboy

bubblypop wrote: »

Are you sure he was cautioning you OP?
Doesn't really sound right, did he ask for your licence and insurance?

He used the word caution and mentioned legislation. I gave him my licence and he checked the tax and insurance discs which were fine.

PopZiggy

Barnaboy wrote: »

He used the word caution and mentioned legislation. I gave him my licence and he checked the tax and insurance discs which were fine.

Did he say you would be receiving a summons or a fixed charge notice in the post? Did he ask you to confirm that the address on your licence was correct?

Samuel T. Cogley

Barnaboy wrote: »

Looking for some advice. I got pulled over on the motorway earlier for speeding and using my mobile. I was pulled over by a guard in an unmarked car. From the first moment he was aggressive and threatening. I have never got as much as a parking ticket in my entire life and no penalty points.

My advice is bear in mind what these lads and lasses have to deal with on a daily basis. I thank my lucky stars it's not my job to knock on someone's door and explain to them that their loved ones aren't coming home because some eejit was distracted by something while driving.

PopZiggy

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

My advice is bear in mind what these lads and lasses have to deal with on a daily basis. I thank my lucky stars it's not my job to knock on someone's door and explain to them that their loved ones aren't coming home because some eejit was distracted by something while driving.

I think you should stick to the legal aspect

Samuel T. Cogley

PopZiggy wrote: »

I think you should stick to the legal aspect

New Mods in Legal Discussion?

Henryq.

If you admit you were speeding can you
be done for it then?.

With no data

Barnaboy

PopZiggy wrote: »

Did he say you would be receiving a summons or a fixed charge notice in the post? Did he ask you to confirm that the address on your licence was correct?

He did ask me to confirm my address. No mention of either a FCPN of summons.

PopZiggy

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

New Mods in Legal Discussion?

Sam, I'm just trying to help the person. He has already apologised and realised what he did was wrong.

OP, did the guard ask you to verify your address/ask that the address on your licence was correct? Did he say a notice or summons would come in the post?

PopZiggy

Barnaboy wrote: »

He did ask me to confirm my address. No mention of either a FCPN of summons.

Touch and go so. I'd say a FCPN at most.

Etc

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

My advice is bear in mind what these lads and lasses have to deal with on a daily basis. I thank my lucky stars it's not my job to knock on someone's door and explain to them that their loved ones aren't coming home because some eejit was distracted by something while driving.

I bet that felt good getting it off your chest...............

Barnaboy

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

My advice is bear in mind what these lads and lasses have to deal with on a daily basis. I thank my lucky stars it's not my job to knock on someone's door and explain to them that their loved ones aren't coming home because some eejit was distracted by something while driving.

I appreciate the sentiment. And I have already admitted that I was wrong and will try to be a better driver. I didn't come here for consolation or justification of my actions. I came here to understand what may happen next.

I never got in any trouble with guards in my life. I try to be a responsible driver. But I'll happily admit that I do tend to speed from time to time. Like most drivers. It doesn't mean it's right. Penalty points will ensure I learn from this.

Samuel T. Cogley

PopZiggy wrote: »

Sam, I'm just trying to help the person. He has already apologised and realised what he did was wrong.

OP asked for advice, he got some - you and others could have just left it at that if you wished and simply ignored me. If it wasn't an issue for him then why mention it in the OP?

He apologised for the mobile phone usage - he's shown absolutely no understanding of why a guard might be rightly pissed off by someone using a mobile phone while driving - and driving in a manner where he either wasn't aware or didn't care about what speed he was doing.

JeffKenna

If I were in your situation OP I'd head straight to a solicitor to get advise and document what happened. Better get to it in writing now rather than a few weeks when a potential summons comes and trying to remember exact specifics.

Buddy Bubs

Barnaboy wrote: »

Definitely not. He was driving in an unmarked car. Looking back I'm not exactly sure what I said on the speeding. But I contested the assertion that I was going over 160.

Oh and I should clarify. full remorse for using the phone as well. I didn't mention that in my last post. Ironically I often give out to others for doing it.

Fair play to you for showing remorse here, if you do go to court show the same remorse and apologise, it will go a long way. In my opinion you'll be charged for the phone use which can be done by the Garda eyewitness statement but doesn't sound like they have radar speed evidence against you.

Let it be a lesson to anyone reading, I'm no saint but holding a phone while driving really annoys me, can be sorted for a few quid Bluetooth kit. First saw them in year 2000.
Doesn't help you send whatsapps and watch tiktoks but thats a whole other story.

Waiting for headline that a motorist making a tiktok video while driving mows down electric scooter rider wearing no lights and that will wrap up 2020 nicely.

Henryq.

JeffKenna wrote: »

If I were in your situation OP I'd head straight to a solicitor to get advise and document what happened. Better get to it in writing now rather than a few weeks when a potential summons comes and trying to remember exact specifics.

Think so , op is unsure

Solicitor time

PopZiggy

Henryq. wrote: »

Think so , op is unsure

Solicitor time

Just wait and see what actually comes. I think the OP is over worrying and would be wasting money on a solicitor at this very early stage. He wasn't exactly arrested for dangerous driving was he? The guard gave him a rollocking and at most a FCPN.

POBox19

JeffKenna wrote: »

If I were in your situation OP I'd head straight to a solicitor to get advise and document what happened. Better get to it in writing now rather than a few weeks when a potential summons comes and trying to remember exact specifics.

Henryq. wrote: »

Think so , op is unsure

Solicitor time

Wait until you hear from the Gardai before going legal. No point spending money on an opinion when you may not need to. Do look around and pick a solicitor whom you could use if you are summoned to the District Court. Be ready.

Gardai talk a lot of sh/te on the side of the road. It really does their image no good, but they do it nonetheless. They also often cower out of confrontation, so won't actually tell you that they're going to issue a fine or such. You just get it in the post, randomly. The fact he said he's doing you for it, means he likely will.

The FCPN (fixed charge penalty notice - in other words, the fine with penalty points) can take up to a month to arrive, and with the postal delays at the moment, I wouldn't be surprised if you did actually get a FCPN to start the new year.

Gardai can let you go, and still do you for dangerous driving. It's usually reduced to careless driving once in court. A friend of a friend got done for doing 170 on the motorway, and she was summonsed to court, but still allowed to drive on after the roadside rant.


That said, you will see, from looking at their twitter page, they will often arrest someone there and then if they're excessively over the limit.

There's a boards thread of their Twitter feed here:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058082376&page=58


If they used a speed gun to nail you, they will almost always bring it to your car to show you the speed you were doing, so you can't argue it. If he didn't have a speed gun, and especially if you contested the speed he said, then he doesn't have any proof of your speed, and as such, he can't do you for speeding.

What will happen, realistically, is you'll either hear nothing out of this at all, or, if I'm being honest, the more likely outcome is you'll get the FCPN in the door for using the phone. I am open to correction, but I believe it is a €60 fine and 3 points.