Mars Capital - mortgage with 7 years arears

HelpOnMars

Hello,

I have a mortgage with Mars Capital for 20 years and in arears for the past 7 years.
I have opened / asked previous qustion here but cant seem to find the post.

Basically,i feel like there is no end to this ongoing mess with my mortgage account.

Mars refused to engage and just doing the "kicking the can down the road",hoping that i will crash financially and they can reposses the property. They lost my personal and financial documentation, lied that they have it for almost 3 years while doing nothing to recover/restore my account ,refused to engage with my financial advisor even when we tried to meet and discuss with them

My interest rate is at the same percentage as now 7 years ago. We are paying every month two thousands and just cant seeing those numbers falling down.

In those 240 months since we got the mortgage,i was late one month in payments.

I have all the internal documents from Mars internal CRM,where they recorded all the corespondence between themselves and us.
It describing black and white their game in waiting and crashing.
One of their staff agreed few years ago to get the account stable and back on track,with an agreeed monthly payment,Few days later,after we agreed via telephone,that staff member have been changed and a new staff took over my case with another 6 months moratorium,another moratorium every 6 months with no proper conclusion or resolution.

Last moratorium took 12 months, where i paid over €2,000 every month.
Now,they wants me to take another moratorium,same payments and no changes from their end...

Static M.e.

Hi HelpOnMars,

I think you should strongly consider getting some help with this. Have you heard of the Abhaile service, where you can get free access to a Dedicated Mortgage Advisor, a Personal Insolvency Practitioner and access to legal aid if needed? Give them a call.

https://www.mabs.ie/en/abhaile/

*I don't work for MABS but I know about all the services they offer.

HelpOnMars

Thanks.

Called them already.
They cannot assist me as i am in posibility of paying the mortgage and no issues from our side.

MARS is "helping" us with moratoriums after moratoriums without getting anything done with arears or with the balance.
Every time after a moratorium completes,full payment as agreed,they are saying that my account needs to be reviewed again and a new set of Standard Financial Statements needs to be completed and sent over to them. Once they receive the papers, a new Case Manager is being allocated and the carousell starts spinning...

Im not sure if the figures are right,in the overall statements.Everytime i asked them to review the very high interest rates,been told they cannot change anything in across account,from the moment they took over.Asked if the rates will go high, will they make the rate higher,they replied is "subject to board level decision" !
I have no financial data to attack them,just a bitter taste of complete dishonest unprofesional practice of "waiting to crack" and Mars to get hands on the property.

Back two years ago, I've threaten them with the verbal confirmation that from "next" month i will stop paying the mortgage,as i see no changes in the end month final figures.
They made up some figures and in the end, they extended the mortgage with another 5 or 6 years. But,they added the arears like is my only fault of being there...

They are refusing the send me listing of the phone call where i've asked back 6 years ago to meet with a Financial Advisor,they refused to discuss with my Financial Advisor when he call them, they requested information from my accountant and from mu doctor,i pass them all the details and they replied they are not obliged to engage with the third party inorder to assess and reach a long term agreement. They refused to send me the phone call conversation with the staff where a monthly figure payment has been agreed and a long term restructured plan to be put in place, again,back like 5 years ago.
They confirmed in writing in 2020 that they lost the Financial Statements back in 2015 and they lied to me...i mean,they lost the papers,i was beging them for meet and discuss and they ran me, keeping me / looping me in moratoriums every 6 months. Based on those missing SFF, they issued a property repossesion. Only if i knew then that they lost the documents...

Jim2007

HelpOnMars wrote: »

Im uploading some of the edited / redacted documents that i have received from Mars.
I haven't got the time in this life to go through them as most of the terms are not familliar to me and whatever is understandable, is getting scary.
Just whatever i remember striking my memory.

Can't upload anything at all... help !?

Do not attempt to upload private correspondence between you and the lender.

Jim2007

HelpOnMars wrote: »

I have a mortgage with Mars Capital for 20 years and in arears for the past 7 years.

In those 240 months since we got the mortgage,i was late one month in payments.

If you are seven years in arrears, your not meeting the payment schedule on your mortgage.

HelpOnMars wrote: »

They cannot assist me as i am in posibility of paying the mortgage and no issues from our side.

So if I'm reading this correctly, MABS have concluded that you are capable of paying your mortgage....


Is this correct?

HelpOnMars

Hello,

Sorry for delay in respodning.
Ive asked MArs 11 questions and i was waiting their reply.
Without those documents, i could have not moved forward...

No communication from MARS from August 2020 until last week,when as a response to my phone call and email,they sent me a letter via email which apparently was sent via post in July020...and that depsite of two of my calls in August and December while the two different staff members confirming that in the internal CRM system are no updates...

Tried to approach few solictors and people in the industry...been told im wasting my time and they cannot take my case as they are working with banks and cannot be seen acting against them.

I've decided to escalate whole application / situation to Financial Ombudsman.
Anyone can tell me if their decision has any legal weight on the MARS as a mortgage provider and/or on my account,please.

Thanks

Lenar3556

With the greatest of respect, this makes no sense - you are going around in circles and none of it is going to better your situation.

An arrears support service such as abhaile would be be best placed to support you if you have difficulty in paying your mortgage.

If you do not have difficulty in paying your mortgage, or the above firm cannot help, I would suggest appointing a solicitor to review the circumstances and provide you with clear, independent and informed advice.

I would caution against taking advice from anybody else, as it may ultimately mislead you. Wishing you every success and a speedy solution to the challenges you are facing.

Jim2007

At this point I don’t see where you are going with this...

According to you, MABS has concluded that you are capable of paying your mortgage and you have been paying €2,0000 per month off it.

You are at least 7 years in arrears and have accepted multiple moratoriums, so it is not surprising that you are not seeing the overall balance coming down... What do you expect MARS to do? Give someone who has been assessed as capable of paying their mortgage a write off?

You stated that MARS tried to repossess your property twice, what does that mean? Have you been to court on this and if so what was the ruling on it?

All this stuff about lost documents etc... is just noise, it does not in any way reduce your contractual obligations to pay your mortgage. I’m not surprised that the solicitors were unwilling to take this up as so far you have not produced a factual based complaint that they could work with.

As for MARS trying to liquidate you, that is a complete non starter. They have allow you to go 7+ years into arrears, they’ve given you multiple moratoriums, they have not nor a judgment against you etc... it’s just not going to fly with a court or the FSO.

What is the outcome you are looking for?

Buddy Bubs

Can I ask how are you 7 years in arrears if you have only missed one payment? I've read that more than once in your posts.
How deep in arrears are you? Maybe I'm misreading it

cannotlogin

How much is the mortgage?
What is the term?

If a repayment of €2k per month is only covering interest and you can't see yourself being able to increasing it, then maybe the mortgage is unsustainable?

How you do you see yourself clearing the mortgage long term?

Is the property in negative equity?

Have you ever sought assistance from MABS? Would you consider contacting them?

Smee_Again

Have you actually made a complaint to Mars Capital?

And if so what was their response?

In my experience when people are dealing with banks they expend a lot of time and energy on irrelevant issues.

If I was you I’d be trying to figure out your current position is and how you get caught up on your arrears.

Everything else is just noise and distracting you from those 2 issues.

Jim2007

cannotlogin wrote: »

Have you ever sought assistance from MABS? Would you consider contacting them?

If you read the thread, you’ll see that MABS concluded that they were capable of paying the mortgage.

HelpOnMars

OK,thanks for replies.

I'll try answering above questions,one by one.
As you said,i need to make clarity in my mind,in my toughts and put some logic to the flow.

Also,as i need few more posts to add to my account in order to post attachements,i may split the answers in their own associated category / posts.

I'll start with analysing my 11 queries raised to MARS,back in May2020.

HelpOnMars

OK

I will start with question 1 out of 11
APR rate: fixed versus variable

My account has curently an APR of 4.5%
MARS bought my account at a discounted amount back in 2014 and the account at that date was on a variable APR.

Looking at the market today,found the "worst" rate at 2.5% for a fixed 10 years mortgage.
Link here:
https://www.mortgages.ie/go/customers/mortgage_rates/variable/all

The reply from MARS ,back in July 2020:

HelpOnMars

Lenar3556 wrote: »

With the greatest of respect, this makes no sense - you are going around in circles and none of it is going to better your situation.

An arrears support service such as abhaile would be be best placed to support you if you have difficulty in paying your mortgage.

If you do not have difficulty in paying your mortgage, or the above firm cannot help, I would suggest appointing a solicitor to review the circumstances and provide you with clear, independent and informed advice.

I would caution against taking advice from anybody else, as it may ultimately mislead you. Wishing you every success and a speedy solution to the challenges you are facing.

Thank you for advise and your time.
I've contacted MABS and New Beginning and two insolvency practice.
They cannot help me as the issue at hand on my account is different.


Tried to approach some solicitors,been told they work with financial institutions and they cannot be seen acting against them.
And,anyway.. i'm wasting my time and energy.


Thanks.

HelpOnMars

Buddy Bubs wrote: »

Can I ask how are you 7 years in arrears if you have only missed one payment? I've read that more than once in your posts.
How deep in arrears are you? Maybe I'm misreading it

Account original with INBS back in 2000.

MARS bought it at a disocunted amount in 2014.


Overall,in the 20 years period i had only one missed payment.


With MARS,we have paid minim €1k when i lost my job and top-up every year since then, until i think back in 2017 i began paying €2k every month.


In May 2020 i owed MARS around €275k.
Apaprently,from the letter first seen in January 2021 but back dated July 2020 i have €90k arrears. Not sure if the total of €275 includes the arrears,i need to check the maths ...

blueythebear

HelpOnMars wrote: »

Thank you for advise and your time.
I've contacted MABS and New Beginning and two insolvency practice.
They cannot help me as the issue at hand on my account is different.


Tried to approach some solicitors,been told they work with financial institutions and they cannot be seen acting against them.
And,anyway.. i'm wasting my time and energy.


Thanks.

Most solicitors do not work with banks and fewer still work with mars capital. There does not appear to be any legal issue here howevrr.

You need financial advice from a personal insolvency practitioner (PIP), if you are insolvent. They can advise you on a personal insolvency arrangement which would force mars to make an arrangement with you that is reflective of your ability to pay. I think the Insolvency service of ireland has a website with a list of registered PIPs .

HelpOnMars

Jim2007 wrote: »

At this point I don’t see where you are going with this...

According to you, MABS has concluded that you are capable of paying your mortgage and you have been paying €2,0000 per month off it.

You are at least 7 years in arrears and have accepted multiple moratoriums, so it is not surprising that you are not seeing the overall balance coming down... What do you expect MARS to do? Give someone who has been assessed as capable of paying their mortgage a write off?

You stated that MARS tried to repossess your property twice, what does that mean? Have you been to court on this and if so what was the ruling on it?

All this stuff about lost documents etc... is just noise, it does not in any way reduce your contractual obligations to pay your mortgage. I’m not surprised that the solicitors were unwilling to take this up as so far you have not produced a factual based complaint that they could work with.

As for MARS trying to liquidate you, that is a complete non starter. They have allow you to go 7+ years into arrears, they’ve given you multiple moratoriums, they have not nor a judgment against you etc... it’s just not going to fly with a court or the FSO.

What is the outcome you are looking for?

Hi Jim,


A long post,thanks,appreciated your time.


I will answer your questions with the queries raised to MARS last May.
They replied to them in a letter first seen in January 2021 but back dated by Mars in July 2020.


My main objective in this process is to demonstrate the malmanagement of my account by MARS Capital. I may or not may be aroudn to see the day when last final payment is done but i want to fight to prove to myself that i was wrong and MARS are proceeding corect and sticking to the code of practice.I want to finish my mortgage in 10 years and not 15,additional 5 years of the payments are not caused only by our side over the past 7-8 years.


I'll try to keep the noise out and just post here with a more practical,cinical and financial optics.


Again,thanks.

HelpOnMars

ok

Question 2 out of 11

Misplacement of documents,loss and lying about ownership

Well,this is a long one.
And despite clearly ourselves thinking that the damage is done,there are no imemdiate or direct repercussions of the data loss.
The loss documents,copies of our passport/ IDs, both of our bank statements,pay slips and other supporting documents have not impacted our live but resulted in about 3-4 years of lost in a probable long term agreement with MARS.

So,to start with beggining.

MARS apoints an independent financiar company to meet us,at our house and to discuss my options,back in 2014 / January 2015.
The agent meets us,does his job and leave our home.
Part of that process,we agreed to pay €1,300 per month and MARS to come up with a long term solution.
Before that meeting,they were calling me every month.
We paid since and every month that amount.

MARS supposed to do a solution based on the SFS and all the paperwork.

Called in 09 February 2015 and asked if they have received my SFS.They confirmed are being reviewed and to continue to pay as agreed.They were surprised to see €1,300 as payment.Again,i cant post attachments so that you can see the listing from their CRM.
In 12 March 2015,they start talking about putting my home in to final vacant possesion home letters.They asks me to send the SFS.Told them they were sent by DebitTask agent and no changes since a month ago.
In 20 April 2015,their internal CRM raises the issue with no SFS received from us or from the field agent,but no action taken by MARS.
On 20 June 2015 they are chassing me for SFS and June payments.Asked them if they have dealt with my account as base don my last set of SFS and they are still chassing my payments.
On 7th September 2015,MARS calls me to address the missing SFS,again he confirms he has the SFS and works onthem,i tell them my financial situation hasnt ben changed. On the CRM line is sayhing that Chris (MARS staff) cannot see the scanned SFS despite the field agent confirmed visit to our home.

And that goes over and over to 19 September 2016,when despite my best intentions and numerous confirmations that the SFS are the same as last one signed in the house,they are labelling me non-cooperative and are issuing a FDMA letter. And from there,i guess went the first intention / action raised by them to reposses my home.They cancelled the process after i started to cooperate again...
I will find more info on this on the new question.

Reply from MARS in July2020

Non existent in the long document apparently issued in July 2020

Reply from MARS once i received CRM listing and pressed them in to confirming or delaying:

May 2020
Many thanks for your below email.
Please note we do not have the documents you have requested. The documents were not sent to Mars Capital Finance
Ireland DAC as part of your file.
If you require any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us.

cannotlogin

I think you are getting sided tracked by a lot of issues that really won't help you solve the problem.

Instead consider the following as a starting point:-

1. Clarify the exact amount owed. There is a big difference between €275k plus €90k arrears - €365k and €275k which includes €90k arrears.

2. Confirm how many years you have to retirement based on your current job? Max mortgage on a home loan is typically 70 years of age

3. Then put this into an online mortgage calculator. The full amount owed, the number of years you have left in your working life and the current rate to determine the appropriate monthly repayments.

4. If your mortgage is sustainable, this figure should be no more than the 2k per month you can afford to pay

5. If this figure is above, the €2k, have you capacity to increase your repayment to this amount? If not your mortgage is unsustainable i.e. has no possibility of being repaid during your working life.

If sustainable, you have options.
If not, you have different options.

€2k is a significant amount of money. You may be better of renting somewhere instead but either way you need proper financial advice. If MABS and new beginnings can't help you there must be more to the situation.

Until you confirm the amount outstanding in full and the maximum term potential (how long you have left to work), it is extremely difficult for anyone to really understand the situation.

Missing paperwork and all that regardless of who is at fault, will not help you here. You need to focus on whether the mortgage is relatable over your working life time or not.

HelpOnMars

OK

Question 3
Long Term Proposal accepted over the phone,the Case Manager gets dismissed "next day"

ED E

If you are this unhelpful with boards members trying to assist you I can see why other advisors and solicitors would run a mile.

Do you want help or do you want to complain about a vulture funds level of customer care?

Peregrinus

HelpOnMars, it seems to me that you're getting hung up on how badly you've been treated, but the real issue here — the one that matters — is, how bad is your financial situation? Forget the litany of grievances and just focus on the finances. Cannotlogin's analysis is very sound; start from there.

When you know what your financial situation is, whether it's recoverable, what steps you need to take to recover it, and whether you can take them — then, and only then, it is time to worry about whether someone else is to blame for your financial situation, to what extent they are to blame, and whether you might have some kind of remedy against them. But that's very much a secondary issue, and very much one which you need to disentangle from the main issue. It's a distraction at this point and, really, you don't want to be distracted. Plus, there is literally no point in considering what remedy you might have against someone for damage you have suffered when you can't yet identify the damage you have suffered.

Jim2007

HelpOnMars wrote: »

Also,as i need few more posts to add to my account in order to post attachements,i may split the answers in their own associated category / posts.

I have already given you a warning on this: do not attempt to post private communications on this thread.

Jim2007

I want to finish my mortgage in 10 years and not 15,additional 5 years of the payments are not caused only by our side over the past 7-8 years.

This just is not going to happen. Nothing you have posted so far would justify it. You have been classified by MABS as being capable of meeting your obligations and neither the courts nor the FSO look favorable on these kinds of complaint.

The rant is now over. I’m locking this thread to review its content.

After review and discussion with the administrator. This tread will not be reopened.