A novel approach to soaring rents

Eleven Benevolent Elephants

If the government and society in general are so concerned about the housing crisis and soaring rents, might this be a novel idea?

Cap rent at €1,000 on residential properties with a complete abolition of rental income tax with deduction at source for rental payments (from salary or benefits). The rent will be paid directly to the landlord as a deduction from the tenant’s payslip so the tenant’s net pay will already have the rent deducted.

This will have the effect of reducing the tax burden on landlords, reducing rent allowance paid by the state (tax payer), they have guaranteed rental income and cheaper rent for tenants. As a landlord, I would much prefer to have a guaranteed €1,000 p/m than a non-guaranteed €2,000 p/m that I have to declare and pay extortionate taxes on.

Landlord access to the PPS number will mean that any damage will be automatically deducted from the tenants wages or benefits at a rate of 50% per payslip or dole until the damage is paid off.

This effectively abolishes the need for a deposit. It would be win-win.

Duke of Url

Eleven Benevolent Elephants wrote: »

If the government and society in general are so concerned about the housing crisis and soaring rents, might this be a novel idea?

Cap rent at €1,000 on residential properties with a complete abolition of rental income tax with deduction at source for rental payments (from salary or benefits). The rent will be paid directly to the landlord as a deduction from the tenant’s payslip so the tenant’s net pay will already have the rent deducted.

This will have the effect of reducing the tax burden on landlords, reducing rent allowance paid by the state (tax payer), they have guaranteed rental income and cheaper rent for tenants. As a landlord, I would much prefer to have a guaranteed €1,000 p/m than a non-guaranteed €2,000 p/m that I have to declare and pay extortionate taxes on.

Landlord access to the PPS number will mean that any damage will be automatically deducted from the tenants wages or benefits at a rate of 50% per payslip or dole until the damage is paid off.

This effectively abolishes the need for a deposit. It would be win-win.

What if the Landlords Mortgage repayments on the rental property were higher than €1,000 p/m?

Smee_Again

How much would this cost?

_Kaiser_

Win-win for the LL maybe.

Why would I give my PPS number or direct access to my wages to a LL? Where's my guarantees that he'll perform in a competent professional manner? Where's my comeback? The PRTB that many ignore as it is?


I have been renting 20 years, never missed a month's rent or been late, never caused any issues and look after small things myself. My current LL has never set foot in the place in 3 years, does no maintenance (unless something significant breaks) and I haven't spoken to him in over a year.
Why would I buy into your idea?

Eleven Benevolent Elephants

Duke of Url wrote: »

What if the Landlords Mortgage repayments on the rental property were higher than €1,000 p/m?

€1,000 was just a figure thrown out there. Could be €1,500.

Even without caps, abolition of rental tax could cause competition and thus naturally reduced rents anyway.

Allinall

Who would rent a three bed house out for €1,000 a month?

There would be a huge shortage of rentals immediately this was brought in.

Eleven Benevolent Elephants

Allinall wrote: »

Who would rent a three bed house out for €1,000 a month?

There would be a huge shortage of rentals immediately this was brought in.

You'd only have €1,000 after tax anyway under the current system.

Pkiernan

Pie in the sky.

Does anyone honestly think that the Government will give up their 53% slice of rents from private landlords?


It makes sense to reduce tax on rents to 20% with the proviso that savings are passed on to the tenant.

Crazy that you have to pay PRSI and USC and full margin PAYE income tax on non guaranteed rental income.

Duke of Url

IMO "Have a go landlords" and "Accidental landlords" should be banned.

Landlording ( if thats a word ) should be a professional service owned by registered companies with a proven ability to financially take on this responsibility.

The Government can Own Emergency Short term housing. Property Landlord companies can own Rentals, Everyone else can Own houses.

Topgear on Dave

Duke of Url wrote: »

IMO "Have a go landlords" and "Accidental landlords" should be banned.

I rented from a few of those guys for about 15/16 years in a few places.

They were grand. Why are you so intent on screwing people like me?

Topgear on Dave

Eleven Benevolent Elephants wrote: »

If the government and society in general are so concerned about the housing crisis and soaring rents, might this be a novel idea?

Society in general is unconcerned by rising rents, thats a massive part of the problem.

Idbatterim

here is another idea to help the working poor that are screwed on housing, stop giving free housing to the workshy "poor"! No lpt, no management fees, no rent if you arent bothered paying, the absolute pittance it is, often with free money if they even bother paying it...

total rent overhaul for social housing, use the money raised, to reduce cost to workers for housing, in the form of reduced taxes on new builds, stamp duty abolition , whatever would work...

Idbatterim

lads watch this fantastic documentary, it gets to the heart of why governments and many other, love rip off property prices. Well worth a watch!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL3n59wC8kk&t=71s

Duke of Url

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

I rented from a few of those guys for about 15/16 years in a few places.

They were grand. Why are you so intent on screwing people like me?

How would it screw you?

Duke of Url

Duke of Url wrote: »

IMO "Have a go landlords" and "Accidental landlords" should be banned.

Landlording ( if thats a word ) should be a professional service owned by registered companies with a proven ability to financially take on this responsibility.

The Government can Own Emergency Short term housing. Property Landlord companies can own Rentals, Everyone else can Own houses.

My estate agent runs a so called professional service.

She is the most incompetent person I've ever had the misfortune of dealing with.

Meanwhile, I've had Accidental landlords who were perfect.

_Kaiser_

Idbatterim wrote: »

here is another idea to help the working poor that are screwed on housing, stop giving free housing to the workshy "poor"! No lpt, no management fees, no rent if you arent bothered paying, the absolute pittance it is, often with free money if they even bother paying it...

total rent overhaul for social housing, use the money raised, to reduce cost to workers for housing, in the form of reduced taxes on new builds, stamp duty abolition , whatever would work...

Mate of mine is renting out an apartment in north Dublin. The only applicants he got initially from the agent were HAP recipients who were approved up to 1850

That's madness and it's completely distorting the rental market.

Dav010

Duke of Url wrote: »

IMO "Have a go landlords" and "Accidental landlords" should be banned.

Landlording ( if thats a word ) should be a professional service owned by registered companies with a proven ability to financially take on this responsibility.

The Government can Own Emergency Short term housing. Property Landlord companies can own Rentals, Everyone else can Own houses.

I love seeing posts like this. I get to remind people later when they complain about corporates automatic yearly rent increases, being able to set market rates, efficiency and lack of understanding during eviction processes, unwillingness to invest in rental property anywhere outside cities etc. I totally agree with you by the way, renting is no longer for the small, single property landlord, that is why so many were leaving even before Covid. Corporates would prefer to leave a property empty than lower rents, whereas an “amateur” LL likely has a mortgage to pay so is more willing to lower rent to get a tenant.

Drive on professionalism.

Op, good on you, at least you gave it some thought and though there are problems with your suggestion, it can’t be as bad as the complete cluster **** that currently exists thanks to Government incompetence.

Idbatterim

great post from another thread on this forum! the halting of constuction with covid, has further exacerbated problems! Government are so concerned with optics, that honest to god, I wouldnt be surprised if they start buying every available new build, for social housing! RTE and those weak idiots, all you hear is their idea of the vulnerable, margaret cash etc! When people say they are disgusted at the housing crisis, let me clarify this, I am! mostly due to hard working people being in **** situations, nothing offered but bull**** lies for years! I am not concerned about the perpetual wasters that the media want housed, before the people paying for the entire **** show, in crap situations themselves!

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=115017601&postcount=7785

Inflation has been decreasing for two decades in terms of the long trend. If you ask me, this has principally been cause by a decline in consumer purchasing power due to stagnated or declining real incomes (US incomes back to 1970' levels, for instance), which, leaving aside neo-con politics effects on labour bargaining, I personally believe is because of multinational tax avoidance having lead to tax increases on wage and salary earners as governments try to make up for the difference. This effect has been confirmed by the OECD, not that many sheep have paid attention.

The main problem with the last two decades is a lack of consumer spending and the money to do it with, not a surfeit of it. There is no lack of goods, in fact, there are too many companies chasing too few consumer discretionary dollars. This is not a recpie for inflation.

Another effect of diasterous neo-con politics has been to exacerbate the unequal distribution of wealth - which of course is the whole point of the rancid doctrine. The wealthy don't spend, they invest and try and create more wealth. That game is now as oversubscribed as the availabilty of goods, hence interest rates declining to zero. The monied few in their relentless pursuit of return, have ramped up involvement in their centuries old favourite, property. If you want to see what really pushes property prices up, look at Australia, NZ, London, Seattle, Vancouver, San Francisco.

Governments, IMO, should have taken serious measures to limit investment by corporations and wealthy individuals in the residential property market. The Irish government, as usual, has encouraged it with near tax free earnings for the vulture funds. Then of course there's the knee-jerk reaction to the social housing non-problem which is to use the money obtained from the bled-dry consumer to compete with said consumer in the residential property market, thus driving up prices and reducing further their already near non-existant discretionary purchasing power.

Where's the door? Let me out, I want to get as far away from these idiots as possible.

Topgear on Dave

Duke of Url wrote: »

How would it screw you?

Many of these people were decent folks, I got good deals from them. "Professional" estate agents and the like can be a pain in the hole to deal with.

Duke of Url

Dav010 wrote: »

I love seeing posts like this. I get to remind people later when they complain about corporates automatic yearly rent increases, being able to set market rates, efficiency and lack of understanding during eviction processes, unwillingness to invest in rental property anywhere outside cities etc. I totally agree with you by the way, renting is no longer for the small, single property landlord, that is why so many were leaving even before Covid. Corporates would prefer to leave a property empty than lower rents, whereas an “amateur” LL likely has a mortgage to pay so is more willing to lower rent to get a tenant.

Drive on professionalism.

Op, good on you, at least you gave it some thought and though there are problems with your suggestion, it can’t be as bad as the complete cluster **** that currently exists thanks to Government incompetence.

Private Landlords drive up prices.

Do you think a Landlord who are renting out to cover mortgages are also able to cover the maintenance of their rented properties.

Landlords take the piss out of tenants

Tenants take the piss out of Landlords

Professionalism needs to be brought in so the whole sector can be reformed from being a Landlord, A Tenant, Evictions, Rental Prices etc

Dav010

Duke of Url wrote: »

Private Landlords drive up prices.

Do you think a Landlord who are renting out to cover mortgages are also able to cover the maintenance of their rented properties.

Landlords take the piss out of tenants

Tenants take the piss out of Landlords

Professionalism needs to be brought in so the whole sector can be reformed from being a Landlord, A Tenant, Evictions, Rental Prices etc

While I can see the benefit of your policy in cities, the reality is that REITs are not going to buy individual apartments/houses is Athy, Macroom, Charlestown etc.

If you reform the sector to penalise both bad tenants and Landlords, there will be room for, and it will appeal to both “professional” and “amateur” landlords. To do that though, you have to make removing bad tenants easier and quicker, but that is not going to happen, is it?

By the way, there have been posts from institutional investor tenants also complaining about maintenance issues.

This “professional” and “amateur” monikers is compete BS, with proper regulation and a functioning market, both would bring benefits to that market.

Pkiernan

Duke of Url wrote: »

IMO "Have a go landlords" and "Accidental landlords" should be banned.

Landlording ( if thats a word ) should be a professional service owned by registered companies with a proven ability to financially take on this responsibility.

The Government can Own Emergency Short term housing. Property Landlord companies can own Rentals, Everyone else can Own houses.

Be careful what you wish for.
Professional corporate landlords won't tolerate deadbeat tenants.