Swiss roll over Eurosceptics!!!

Snickers Man

A referendum in Switzerland that would have overturned a treaty permitting free movement of people between that country and the EU has been decisively defeated.

By a margin of 62% to 38%, the Swiss people decided not to suspend the free movement treaty much to the chagrin of anti-immigrant and Eurosceptic advocates in that country and much to the horror of Pro-Brexit voices in the UK such as the Daily Express.

Yesterday the Express was hopeful that a favourable result (from their point of view) would have been a ringing endorsement of Brexit and would be an even heavier blow to the EU than was Britain's referendum result of 2016.

Today, the sour grapes are evident as they blame fear mongering and Brussels bullying for the resounding defeat of their point of view.

Only the plucky Brits, it seems, have the stomach to stand up to the evil empire that is EU.

Off you go lads. All you ever had to do to leave the EU was write a bloody letter to Donald Tusk. Contrast that with what people had to do to leave the British Empire.
Now that really WAS an evil empire.

How's that "Hard Border" between Kent and the rest of England coming on?

stoneill

Daily Express? They lie more than Trump or Johnson.

suicide_circus

Hardly a rollover of the eurosceptics when you consider that the Swiss have remained steadfastly outside the EU.

ancapailldorcha

suicide_circus wrote: »

Hardly a rollover of the eurosceptics when you consider that the Swiss have remained steadfastly outside the EU.

That's not really true. They have a cornucopia of treaties with Brussels, over 100 I believe so they're effectively in most of it already. I think it's a great result myself.

Snickers Man

suicide_circus wrote: »

Hardly a rollover of the eurosceptics when you consider that the Swiss have remained steadfastly outside the EU.

How do you fancy a "Swiss" version of Brexit then?

And how do you think such an arrangement would go down with the Cummings, Farage and Rees-Mogg constituency in the UK?

You know: freedom of movement, alignment with most EU regulations, neutrality from NATO....I only ask.

Switzerland can manage Splendid Isolation. Britain can't. Never could. Too many people dislike them. They need to be part of a gang.

suicide_circus

Yes indeed, it's great when referenda results are respected and implemented.

Snickers Man

stoneill wrote: »

Daily Express? They lie more than Trump or Johnson.

It was their reaction to the FACT of the Swiss referendum (both in prospect and in retrospect) that I thought was worthy of perusal.
If only for my own amusement.

lucalux

I'd take a Swiss roll over euroskeptics any day

mcmoustache

Something that I think people forget is that freedom of movement works both ways. The Swiss were probably more aware than the Brits that ending freedom of movement would mean more difficulty for them with trips to France, Germany or Italy or wherever.

indioblack

Snickers Man wrote: »

Contrast that with what people had to do to leave the British Empire.
Now that really WAS an evil empire.

So what's this thread about?
The Swiss or the British empire?

JeffKenna

I would have thought 38% was quite a high number for a county like Switzerland?

ancapailldorcha

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Could scrap democracy based on that premise (and Im not necessarily disagreeing with yoU!)

I disagree. Representative democracy works by the populace delegating responsibility, powers and authority for the running of the state to the individuals they vote for. Those individuals are supposed to act as they set out in their campaigns and manifestos. Come election time, their records are scrutinised as the public decides on whether or not to re-elect them or to elect someone new.

Referenda can work when they're used for easily understood matters and the outcomes can be known within reason. The referenda on the eighth amendment and SSM are excellent examples. Alternatively, they can be used by unscrupulous politicians to ditch responsibility by dumping it onto the masses as we see happening with Brexit.

Snickers Man

indioblack wrote: »

So what's this thread about?
The Swiss or the British empire?

In broad terms, it's about relations between European countries.

indioblack

Snickers Man wrote: »

In broad terms, it's about relations between European countries.

OK.
Didn't get the point of the unnecessary reference to an evil empire.

biko

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the swiss do them regularly and they seem to get on fine.

Indeed, their democracy is based on regular referendums.

ancapailldorcha

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the swiss do them regularly and they seem to get on fine.

Switzerland is an agglomeration of 26 cantons who have had a history of autonomy going back centuries. I think the regular referenda are a way of consensus-seeking that avoids pitting cantons against each other.

Snickers Man

indioblack wrote: »

OK.
Didn't get the point of the unnecessary reference to an evil empire.

Never heard Brexit Party MEP Anne Widdicombe's speech to the EU about how Brexit was another example of the common people throwing over the burden of an empire?

Hamsterchops

indioblack wrote: »

So what's this thread about?
The Swiss or the British empire?

Is the British Empire even mentioned?

Swissroll for me, yum yum

Jimbob1977

The Swiss need immigration to keep the economy ticking over.

Their national football team is like a Kosovar Albanian XI

indioblack

Snickers Man wrote: »

Never heard Brexit Party MEP Anne Widdicombe's speech to the EU about how Brexit was another example of the common people throwing over the burden of an empire?

You made the comparison.
Anne Widdicombe doesn't speak for me.

indioblack

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Is the British Empire even mentioned?

Swissroll for me, yum yum

Read the opening post.

ohnonotgmail

Snickers Man wrote: »

Never heard Brexit Party MEP Anne Widdicombe's speech to the EU about how Brexit was another example of the common people throwing over the burden of an empire?

you would have to be an awful thick bigot to pay any attention to anything she says

PsychoPete

So this has nothing to do with actual Swiss rolls?

indioblack

PsychoPete wrote: »

So this has nothing to do with actual Swiss rolls?

It would make a tastier thread.

Hamsterchops

indioblack wrote: »

Read the opening post.

Ah now I see it, he throws in the evil British Empire at the end Vis-à-vis the EU Empire. I guess this thread is meant to be about the sour grapes.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I disagree. Representative democracy works by the populace delegating responsibility, powers and authority for the running of the state to the individuals they vote for. Those individuals are supposed to act as they set out in their campaigns and manifestos. Come election time, their records are scrutinised as the public decides on whether or not to re-elect them or to elect someone new.

Referenda can work when they're used for easily understood matters and the outcomes can be known within reason. The referenda on the eighth amendment and SSM are excellent examples. Alternatively, they can be used by unscrupulous politicians to ditch responsibility by dumping it onto the masses as we see happening with Brexit.

Can't find my post () so not sure what I was responding to (:o) but it was something along the lines of large groups of people makeing bad decisions (open to correction) and certain elections would follow that pattern.