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Strand Road Cycle route trial- public consultation

  • 11-09-2020 11:40am
    Registered Users Posts: 1,128 ✭✭✭

    Meant to post this before now.
    Public consultation on proposed strand road cycle route ends in a couple of days.
    The nature of these means that negative views are more likely to be submitted while broadly positive sentiment may be understated (squeaky wheel gets the grease, such as that Tampax TV ad that was banned after about 80 complaints)

    Seapoint/Dun Laoghaire route has been a success from my point of view so would be nice to see this ask trialled at least.


  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    Hope it goes ahead but will be very surprised if it does, given the amount of Range Rovers that take that route

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,128 ✭✭✭Alanbt

    Hope it goes ahead but will be very surprised if it does, given the amount of Range Rovers that take that route

    That’s the fear. The NIMBY crew shout loudest

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,207 ✭✭✭deandean

    I've taken part in a few of these public consultations, and have followed up on how they went.
    I've seen how submissions are dealt with, and how those submissions are / aren't a contributor to the final decision.
    Now, I just don't bother any more.
    The decision is already made.
    Any submissions will go into a file which the CoCo will point to, as 'Research'.
    I'm not saying whether the cycleway is good or bad; but the decision is already made.

  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    Looks like it has been postponed. Never gonna happen.

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,717 Mod ✭✭✭✭Weepsie

    2 to 1 in favour of it, so it's canned. What a load of nonsense.

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭Seaswimmer

    We just received the following report from Dublin City Council concerning the ‘Strand Road Trial Rapid Deployment Cycle Route’ at our South East Area Meeting.

    The report was provided in reply to a joint motion that was tabled at our meeting.

    The report states that no changes will be made on the Strand Road until January 2021 at the earliest.

    The report reads as follows:

    “Both DCC and the NTA are committed to the S2S and are continuing to work on how it may be advanced taking into account the sensitive environment and the environmental designations. However, it is clear from the work that has been done to date that this is a longer-term project and that the current situation of no cycling facilities along this section of Strand Road should be addressed. The trial of this route will both provide good protected cycle route along the Strand and we will ensure that the impacts of the scheme, both positive and negative can be measured and such actions as required taken to ensure that the scheme provides an overall benefit.

    The first phase of public consultation is coming to a close on the 14th of September and DCC is committed to undertaking the following:-

    · Reviewing carefully the submissions made by the public
    · Revising where possible, the proposed scheme to take account of suggestions received and proposing mitigation measures as necessary.
    · Undertaking more detailed traffic counts to better inform the traffic modelling work underway and to better understand the changes in volumes and patterns that Covid has brought about.
    · Advancing the installation of a number of pedestrian crossings in Sandymount.
    · Identifying changes to the HGV Ban in the Sandymount to ensure better compliance and extending it to 24 hours 7 days a week.
    · Providing a more comprehensive traffic management plan around the Sandymount area to show how the trial of the cycle route is proposed to be managed.
    · Undertaking to show how the cycle route connects towards the city centre and to DLRCC.
    · Making continuing use of the consultation hub to ensure all information and any amendments to schemes are available for comments.
    · In addition we will undertake to abide by the requests set out in this motion and ensure that no changes are made on the Strand Road until January 2021 at the earliest.”

    The motion read as follows:

    Motion 15 from Councillors Dermot Lacey, Mary Freehill and Deirdre Conroy
    This Committee reiterates its support for completing the S2S proposal and requests the Chief Executive of Dublin City Council and the NTA to actively pursue its development along the existing Sandymount Promenade as a matter of urgency.

    In the event of the Chief Executive seeking to implement the current proposals for Strand Road under Covid 19 legislation this Committee further requests:

    The Trial period be four months and commence on the 1st January 2021 to enable all prepare for such a significant change.
    The period between now and commencement of the trial be used to compile a report and a response to the issues raised in the public submissions to date.
    That a monthly report be given to the Area Committee on 2) above
    That a Monitoring and Consultative Committee be established before the October meeting of this Area Committee comprising representatives (if they wish to join) of the Sandymount and Merrion Residents’ Association, the Sandymount Tidy Towns and Community Association, the Bath Avenue and District Residents’ Association, the Sydney Parade Residents’ Association, the Merrion Road Residents’ Association and the Dublin Cycling Campaign and representatives of the schools in the area. The Committee would also be empowered to invite two additional members to represent any interests that they may feel could add to the work of the Committee.
    In view of the local and regional importance of the issue that the Lord Mayor of Dublin be invited to Chair the Committee.
    That a designated "Sandymount Traffic" (or similar) contact point to Dublin City Council be established on electronic and social media.
    That a full report on the initiative be presented to the Area Committee no later than the June 2021 meeting of the Area Committee prior to any final decision being taken.”

    I will keep you updated with further information.

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 47,455 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder

    the 30km/h zone expansion and the phoenix park work will also be kicked to touch.

  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine

    the 30km/h zone expansion and the phoenix park work will also be kicked to touch.

    It's been a depressing day alright.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    I would imagine if they do anything they'll just build the bike lane without affecting the road, like they did with the newer parts of the cycle lanes on the way to Sutton. I don't think they'll want to ever make that road one way.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,223 ✭✭✭Breezer

    the 30km/h zone expansion and the phoenix park work will also be kicked to touch.

    Has this been confirmed, or is this speculation?

  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 47,455 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder

    Bid to extend 30km speed limit in Dublin city stalled

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    I just think we are too car centric a country for any major developments.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,223 ✭✭✭Breezer

    Bid to extend 30km speed limit in Dublin city stalled

    I don't know much about Naoise Ó Muirí. Mary Freehill I'm familiar with, and I'm not surprised.

  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,717 Mod ✭✭✭✭Weepsie

    You can't go more than a few hundred metres on these roads without hitting a set of lights so I'm not sure what the issue with the limit is to be honest

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,223 ✭✭✭Breezer

    Weepsie wrote: »
    You can't go more than a few hundred metres on these roads without hitting a set of lights so I'm not sure what the issue with the limit is to be honest


  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine

    Breezer wrote: »
    I don't know much about Naoise Ó Muirí. Mary Freehill I'm familiar with, and I'm not surprised.

    Ó Muirí is hit and miss.

    I don't think he wanted to collapse the entire thing but that's what happened. Wouldn't put him in the same category as Freehill though.

  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine

    So, it's not actually deferred to January 2021.

    But it will still take time to go through the 2,500+ submissions and write up a report.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    Yeah I'm finding it hard to decipher this. Is the trial happening or?

  • Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,397 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine

    Yeah I'm finding it hard to decipher this. Is the trial happening or?

    Basically, ignore what happened on Monday.

    As it stands, they'll have to go through almost 3,000 submissions and bring a report to the October area committee meeting. It could still be delayed then but, if the submissions are as positive as they say, it'll be difficult for councillors.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭Seaswimmer

    I hope are you well.

    Last night, all 63 councillors on Dublin City Council received three documents from the Chief Executive concerning the ‘Trial of Strand Road Rapid Deployment Cycle Route’.

    These documents were;

    1. Trial of Strand Road Rapid Deployment Cycle Route - Report on Public Consultation
    2. Final Strand Road Trial Modelling Analysis and Data
    3. Images from the National Transport Agency concerning the proposal

    I have uploaded all these documents and if you wish to access any of them, simply click on the document above.(links at bottom of post)

    The reports are the first item on our agenda at the South East Area meeting on Monday 12th of October 2020 where I, along with other councillors, will have an opportunity to ask questions of the officials responsible for the plan.


    The executive (unelected officials) on Dublin City Council have estimated that the “considerable work” which is to be undertaken prior to the commencement of any trial shall take 8 – 10 weeks. The report notes however that Covid-19 related restrictions may impact on their estimated timescale.

    10 weeks from the report would be the 16th of December 2020.


    That “considerable work” referred to above is detailed in the report as including the following;

    o Sandymount Green will have two pedestrian crossings installed over the next 4-6 weeks. A Traffic camera will be added so as to allow the DCC control to monitor traffic in the Village area. In addition, this location will have traffic count equipment fitted to the pedestrian crossings in order to allow monitoring in real time of traffic volumes.

    o Engagement with residents’ groups who have requested meetings.

    o Putting up details of a proposed change to also make Beach Road one way for traffic (outbound) with the cycle route using the current outbound traffic lane on the DCC consultation hub. This did not form part of the original proposal.

    o Agree new Bus stop locations with the NTA and Dublin Bus. Dublin Bus require eight weeks' notice of change of services stop locations.

    o The report then sets out the works under specific headings;

    Merrion Gates
    · Work will commence on modifying the median to allow for the new right turn.
    · Additional ducts and cabling will be installed for the new signalised exit.
    · A new pedestrian crossing will be installed
    · The existing signals will be upgraded and Smart Micros added.

    Rock Road
    · The design work on the section from Merrion Gates to the DCC boundary is now complete and discussions with DLRCC are progressing re joint implementation.
    · Preparatory works to commence for its installation.

    Sean Moore Road/ Beach Road Junction.
    · Upgrade works to junction to allow one way operation unless major difficulties with this change are flagged during consultation.

    Strand Road
    · Some of the mini roundabouts need come changes to allow for the cycle track to be installed.
    · Pedestrian crossings will all be upgraded and fitted with Smart Micros to allow cycle counting and vehicle classification.
    · Protection equipment, signage and road markings to be finalised and ready for completion.
    Trial Area
    · Speed and traffic count surveys
    · Statutory signage review and planning

    Publicity campaign
    · Preparation of the necessary information campaign for people affected
    · Ensuring that advance notification and signage is in place prior to start of trial.
    o The Traffic signals in the area with be equipped with Smart Micro technology. These allow Dublin City Council to automatically detect and count cyclists as well as provide classification of vehicles and these are all linked to the DCC SCATS Traffic control system.

    o Details of the traffic management for when the trial will be installed will be made available in advance of the trial commencing.

    o Speed measurements in the Tritonville Road/ Newbridge Avenue area will be undertaken using the CCTV at Irishtown Garda station and CCTV installation at the junction of Tritonville Road/ Newbridge Avenue, both of which are linked to the DCC traffic Control centre.

    o Investigating further restricting HGVs in the area to include a ban on 4 axle vehicles.

    o Investigating a connection from the cycle route to Sandymount village to “try and ensure that the village benefits from having the cycle route in place”.

    o Investigating links from schools to the cycle route.

    o Speed surveys will be carried out and locations identified if required where displays could be put in.

    o Dublin City Council are open to assessing any additional turn bans including time limited or class of vehicle options and suggestions can be sent to [email protected]


    According to the traffic modelling done by the NTA (National Transport Agency) on behalf of Dublin City Council, they have estimated the following;

    1. Sandymount Village, Gilford Road and Park Avenue

    The modelling shows that it’s likely that there could be an increase of up to 20% traffic in the village along Park Avenue and through Sandymount Village towards Sandymount Road. The report states “Traffic volumes are in general down 80% of pre Covid so this level of increase will at worst return this area to pre Covid volumes”.

    2. Serpentine Avenue and Tritonville Avenue

    The modelling data shows that traffic along this route may increase by up to 36%. The report states that “the traffic volumes currently in this area are at less than 80% of pre Covid but if the full predicted increase happens then this route will have around 10% additional traffic over and above pre Covid times”.

    3. Merrion Road

    The modelling shows that the biggest impact is on the Merrion Road with volumes predicted to double on the section north of Merrion Gates with 798 vehicles per hour. The report states that “SCATS traffic control system shows that this section of the road is currently at 70% of previous volumes”.

    4. Marine Drive and Leahy’s Terrace

    The report details that the concern for increased traffic on these roads was “due to through traffic using the roads to access the two-way layout on Beach Road”. The new proposal is to make Beach Road one way for traffic (outbound) which the report states will eliminate through traffic using Marine drive and Leahy’s Terrace.

    5. Durham Road

    Dublin City Council are open to the suggestion which was put forward in the public consultation to provide filtered permeability on Durham Road so as to allow Pedestrian and cycling access to schools in the area but ensure that through traffic will not be allowed.


    The report states;

    “It is not proposed to make any changes on the Merrion Road for the first 2 months to allow time for the scheme to settle and for some clarity regarding the traffic patterns to emerge. This will then be reviewed and if concerns of residents in this area still persist it is proposed a time limited right turn at the Merrion Road / Ailesbury Road may be facilitated.”


    It is proposed to undertake a six month trial of a 2 way separated cycle track from Merrion Gates to Sean Moore Rd with links either side as they are developed.

    It is represented in the report that;

    “the scheme will involve minimal civil works and will be installed in such a way as to allow for localised alterations and to minimise any alterations to existing road surface or kerbs”

    The cycle lane will be separated from the traffic lane using mini orcas.


    The report states that these prevent vehicles from encroaching onto the cycle lane but are also flexible enough to be adjusted if required. These are suitable for emergency vehicles to drive over if required to use the cycle route to access any location along it.

    More permanent protection will be installed if the trial is successful.

    The report states;

    “Six months will allow time for the scheme to settle in, for new patterns of movement to be established and for movement data to be gathered. During the initial period of the trial it is normal that there are changes in pattern and levels of interventions required and so by the end of the trial the situation should have reached a stable situation. In addition we will be flexible enough to make changes as the trial progresses to deal with specific issues which may arise and six months gives us time to undertake changes as required.”

    The report also notes that Merrion Road, Serpentine Avenue and Tritonville Avenue shall be subjected to the highest levels of monitoring, comparatively speaking, as a consequence of what their modelling indicates about increased traffic flow.


    I would like to hear from you on your views on this latest report or if there are any representations I can make at, or after, the 12th of October area meeting with the officials on your behalf.

    I want to do as much as I can to support the Sandymount community.

    I look forward to hearing from you.

    Kind regards,
    Cllr James Geoghegan
    Smaoinigh ar an timpeallacht sula ndéanann tú an ríomhphost seo a phriontáil. Please consider the Environment before printing this mail.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,954 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    Had a quick look through this and they seem to be telling the proposed ideas by the STC group or whatever they're called to get f*cked as it's totally unviable.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,011 ✭✭✭buffalo

    Part of the assessment of the STC proposal for a section of one-way road near the Merrion Gates that alternated direction with traffic lights (TIL, called a 'shuttle'):
    A vehicle joining the back of the queue at 1pm would not clear the shuttle till almost 6pm

    The effect of this, surmised DCC, would be that there would be a lot more drivers choosing to divert through Sandymount. The exact thing that STC were apparently trying to avoid!

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,980 ✭✭✭Seaswimmer

    Looks like trial is definitely (hopefully) going ahead now in its original form..

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,011 ✭✭✭buffalo

    Rather than drag the south Dublin cycling infra thread into the depths again, I believe the Strand Road case is in court today at 11.

  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 37,100 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    President of the High Court, David Barniville, yesterday said it was a “critical issue” in the High Court judgement that it was not accepted that the Strand Road trial was temporary even after a start date and a 6-month timeframe were outlined by the council in its traffic signs order and elsewhere.