Pay scale pre 2011

pythonfoot

Have been casual unqualified substitute for many years . I am on the pre 2011 rate of pay. If I go and do my PME and became a qualified teacher and gained a job m would I be entitled to the pre 2011 pay scale starting at the entry point salary. Which is €35,088.

Thanks in advance .

dory

There's no definitive answer to this. I've seen this asked a lot of times before and there are people who subbed unqualified and got on old scale, and others who didn't. I know people personally who are in both situations.

People tell me if you subbed in primary you're grand. If you subbed in an ETB secondary you should be ok, but not if it was a voluntary secondary (as you always needed the "dip" to be qualified in the latter). I've also had someone swear blind the Dept told them the opposite - that if you subbed in a voluntary secondary you're grand but not ETB.

I would say the only way to know for sure is it to do and apply.

Treppen

From what I could gather it harked back to the VEC days where they took on teachers with just the primary degree. Since you were considered 'qualified' then you were allowed carry this over in terms of increments.
If you taught in a voluntary with just primary degree you were considered unqualified so couldn't carry this over.

Union would have all the ins and outs as I presume they represented a good few teachers dealing with it.

Snodge

What are the main dfferences/ pros and cons of teaching in a private school vs public school

mtoutlemonde

Snodge wrote: »

What are the main dfferences/ pros and cons of teaching in a private school vs public school

You have to fund your own pension.
The private school don't have to pay you department rates.
You can be fired as quickly as you were hired.
High pressure environment .... paying parents want the 600 points for their son/daughter whether it is possible or not - you must make it happen.
Not paid for holidays.
I don't know about this one - union protection?
Others can add to the list this is what I can think of initially.

Treppen

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

You have to fund your own pension.
The private school don't have to pay you department rates.
You can be fired as quickly as you were hired.
High pressure environment .... paying parents want the 600 points for their son/daughter whether it is possible or not - you must make it happen.
Not paid for holidays.
I don't know about this one - union protection?
Others can add to the list this is what I can think of initially.

I replied in the pension thread. Probably a bit negative though, there are a few very good schools that pay exactly in line with other colleagues and give you increment and holiday pay but the only difference is no pension.
Make sure to ask before taking up the contract, if the school is the same it'll say something like "pay in line with DES".
ASTI will represent privately paid teachers in a dispute. TUI will not.
ASTI is "usually" the voluntary schools (religious).
TUI is "usually" ETBs formally VECs/community college. That's a generalisation though.

As said above the parents and students can be very exam driven, but at the same time the messing in classes would be fairly minimal, and you actually get to teach your subject all of the time.
If you are sharing different classes within the same year group the students WILL be comparing notes as to who is a better teacher and who is a page ahead/behind in the course!

highly1111

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

You have to fund your own pension.
The private school don't have to pay you department rates.
You can be fired as quickly as you were hired.
High pressure environment .... paying parents want the 600 points for their son/daughter whether it is possible or not - you must make it happen.
Not paid for holidays.
I don't know about this one - union protection?
Others can add to the list this is what I can think of initially.

This is incorrect. I work in a private school on a private contract.
I get paid department rates. They also contribute 15% (yes!) to my pension. I am paid for holidays and am shop steward. It can be highly pressured but I work in an environment where I teach rather than babysit (which is all it was when I worked in Dublin's inner city in a DEIS school - of course, not all are the same), an environment with a very low labour turnover, a happy staff room, receive lunch and newspapers and have wonderful facilities with low pupil / teacher ratio - could I be fired tomorrow? Only if I breach my contract which is the same for anyone really but if I continue to do my job well I have no reason to worry about job security - even during the recession and with Covid, we were/are full to capacity.

petejmk

pythonfoot wrote: »

Have been casual unqualified substitute for many years . I am on the pre 2011 rate of pay. If I go and do my PME and became a qualified teacher and gained a job m would I be entitled to the pre 2011 pay scale starting at the entry point salary. Which is €35,088.

Thanks in advance .

If you have a payroll number with the dept you should get the old scale.

Treppen

highly1111 wrote: »

This is incorrect. I work in a private school on a private contract.
I get paid department rates. They also contribute 15% (yes!) to my pension. I am paid for holidays and am shop steward. It can be highly pressured but I work in an environment where I teach rather than babysit (which is all it was when I worked in Dublin's inner city in a DEIS school - of course, not all are the same), an environment with a very low labour turnover, a happy staff room, receive lunch and newspapers and have wonderful facilities with low pupil / teacher ratio - could I be fired tomorrow? Only if I breach my contract which is the same for anyone really but if I continue to do my job well I have no reason to worry about job security - even during the recession and with Covid, we were/are full to capacity.

Wow you are very lucky, I was Union rep too a few years ago and heard fairly shocking stories about how schools treated school paid staff.

When you mentioned getting brought newspapers and receive lunch I think I could guess the school :pac:

I think this is the case that changed everything for fee charging schools.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/court-rules-on-two-teachers-paid-privately-by-school-1.624401

BTW highly under EU legislation any worker is entitled to a CID after 4 years.

Snodge

Can you be paid 22hr salary once tou have over 18hs, or is this only apply when you have a cid?

r93kaey5p2izun

Snodge wrote: »

Can you be paid 22hr salary once tou have over 18hs, or is this only apply when you have a cid?

Only with CID.

ekiely16

Hi,
I did substitute work in 2011 but I did not qualify until 2016.
I have a payslip from the school for that time.
Would I be entitled to the pre 2011 pay scale?

Treppen

ekiely16 wrote: »

Hi,
I did substitute work in 2011 but I did not qualify until 2016.
I have a payslip from the school for that time.
Would I be entitled to the pre 2011 pay scale?

you'd have to ask the dept really.. But.. .was it a VEC by any chance?

They counted having the basic degree (before doing a PGDE/PDE/PME) as being qualified. But did away with that 'degree only' requirement around that time!

Alqua

ekiely16 wrote: »

Hi,
I did substitute work in 2011 but I did not qualify until 2016.
I have a payslip from the school for that time.
Would I be entitled to the pre 2011 pay scale?

If you subbed in 2011 you will be on the new scale. To get pre-2011 you would need to have subbed in 2010 or before.