Wood fence label

karlitob

Hi all

Appreciate any advice on the following:

Have my concrete post and wood fence panels (finallly) up.

Fence panels are 19mm tongue and grove (1.7m) and picture framed all round. I’ve a 40mm d-rail to go on top and wondered what the best method for securing them is.

One suggestion I’ve been given is a pilot hole and 60mm decking screws. My main concern is that I might split the tongue and groove panels underneath.

Thanks all.

Calahonda52

if picture framed all around , how deep is the picture frame.
Could you pin them across through the legs on the D with ss nails in a pilot hole.

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

if picture framed all around , how deep is the picture frame.
Could you pin them across through the legs on the D with ss nails in a pilot hole.

They frame is around 70mm I think.

Not sure what you mean by through legs of the D. The d rail looks to me like a large 2x4 with rounded edges at top. There’s no rabbet cut in the bottom or anything.

Hope that makes sense.

Calahonda52

thanks, is the picture framing half rounded, leaving a reduced support area for the 2 by 4
can you post a pic of the 2 by 4

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

thanks, is the picture framing half rounded, leaving a reduced support area for the 2 by 4
can you post a pic of the 2 by 4

That’s right - the picture framing is half rounded. Will get a picture up.

At the top of the fence panel I have a 40mm space for the d rail to sit into. So I’m planning to jigsaw out the rebate shape so I can sit the d rail flush.

What are your thoughts on it?

Calahonda52

have you access to a table saw, a better idea would be to cut a rebate in the D section and seat it over the whole lot, the half round will make any fixing unstable

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

have you access to a table saw, a better idea would be to cut a rebate in the D section and seat it over the whole lot, the half round will make any fixing unstable

That’s exactly the plan. Was thinking jigsaw but I have access to table saw and band saw. It should fit somewhat snuggly in. Then needs to be fixed - exterior glue and decking screws?

Calahonda52

It would be a lot of glue, am thinking clear Tec 7

Table saw with the blade at the right height and centered for the work piece would work, just set the fence so as the first cut is along the line, regardless of which end it put into the saw, this will allow you turn the piece when half way down for safety.

then widen the fence by a blade width to get the rest out

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

It would be a lot of glue, am thinking clear Tec 7

Table saw with the blade at the right height and centered for the work piece would work, just set the fence so as the first cut is along the line, regardless of which end it put into the saw, this will allow you turn the piece when half way down for safety.

then widen the fence by a blade width to get the rest out

Thank you.

So you don’t think screws just tec7

Calahonda52

no, screws as well but the the 7 would give a great bond and eliminate any gaps.
You might get a better grip with ss pins in from the side across through the panel, end grain that thin is not great

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

no, screws as well but the the 7 would give a great bond and eliminate any gaps.
You might get a better grip with ss pins in from the side across through the panel, end grain that thin is not great

Understood. Didn’t read earlier post correctly - a rebate in the d rail. Yeah - I think that might be worth testing. Thanks again.

karlitob

karlitob wrote: »

Understood. Didn’t read earlier post correctly - a rebate in the d rail. Yeah - I think that might be worth testing. Thanks again.

Update:

Have the rebate cleared in the middle. And also have a small throat cut either side as a drip edge. Fits snug. Though I’ve done a bit of hacking at the ends (not in picture) to make a tenon, or sorts, to fit it into the rebate on the fence post.

Have been advised that there’s no need for tec7 and to go for 4x60mm reissner deck screws without pilot hole.

Would prefer some tec7 but I’ve 24 panels at 1.8m - presume that would be a lot of product, even with a single bead. But if it’s the right thing to do then I would.

Any comments welcome. Thanks all.

Calahonda52

4mm into end grain is .....

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

4mm into end grain is .....

Don’t understand the point? That’s what reissner recommened

Calahonda52

karlitob wrote: »

Don’t understand the point? That’s what reissner recommened

Sorry, it was late.
IIRC the top of the panel has a rounded top edge on the lathes each side, leaving you really with the end grain of the panel as the target for the screws.

I cant tell what thickness the end grain piece is but its a tough shot, and the thread on a 4mm screw will be fine enough.
Maybe go in at an angle from the side, into the lathes.
I would pilot all the way to avoid splitting the lathes.

Looking at the rebate and the curved top, maybe a cheaper solution than Tec 7 would work, to try stop it rolling due to the curved lathes

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Sorry, it was late.
IIRC the top of the panel has a rounded top edge on the lathes each side, leaving you really with the end grain of the panel as the target for the screws.

I cant tell what thickness the end grain piece is but its a tough shot, and the thread on a 4mm screw will be fine enough.
Maybe go in at an angle from the side, into the lathes.
I would pilot all the way to avoid splitting the lathes.

Looking at the rebate and the curved top, maybe a cheaper solution than Tec 7 would work, to try stop it rolling due to the curved lathes

Thanks for that.

The end grain of the tongue and Grove panel is 19mm. I take the point that it will be challenging To hit it.
I don’t think I can come in from the sides as there isn’t enough depth and more importantly I have a throat cut for a drip edge.


Just so we’re on the same sheet. I will be putting the rebate of the d-rail capping in those pictures on top of a 50mm wood label fence which has a 19mm tongue and Grove slats sandwiched in a picture frame fashion by 15mm panels either side.

Calahonda52

19mm, were not cheap!
Assuming the grove is a snug fit, accurately mark the centre line of the 19mm in the groove and drill pilot holes vertically from inside out, trying to avoid the joins.

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

19mm, were not cheap!
Assuming the grove is a snug fit, accurately mark the centre line of the 19mm in the groove and drill pilot holes vertically from inside out, trying to avoid the joins.

Good advice. Thank you.

Yeah, not cheap. But they look good (I think)

Also - 4x60 or 3.5x60? Any thoughts on size of decking screws?

Calahonda52

I would go 4 and have the pilot big enough so as no threading in it.
I would use the cordless with a low power and then finish by hand, so easy to strip in end grain

ps
they look GREAT

chooseusername

That's some job Karlito, well done.
If you can keep the cats off that 'twill last forever.
Out of curiosity, what did you decide to do at the base eventually?

karlitob

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I would go 4 and have the pilot big enough so as no threading in it.
I would use the cordless with a low power and then finish by hand, so easy to strip in end grain

ps
they look GREAT

Thanks calahonda. Appreciate all the advice and help. Delighted with them. Need to get good weather this weekend and I can finish off painting them and putting the capping in.

karlitob

chooseusername wrote: »

That's some job Karlito, well done.
If you can keep the cats off that 'twill last forever.
Out of curiosity, what did you decide to do at the base eventually?

Thanks very much. Pretty chuffed with the output.
Yet to decide on that. I do need a plan for the garden - even a loose one. Just so I know where the new levels maybe or not maybe.

I’ve yet to put the soil removed from the holes back in around the concrete. I’ve put packers on the concrete and removed all slabs and bricks from under the gravel board so now the moving ground won’t affect the gravel board or anything like that.

Since I don’t want my neighbours overgrown jungle to come in under, I’m quite keen on having some form of concrete strip along the hole thing. It needn’t be wide but I would like it to be effective.

I was thinking of putting some cheap plywood or cement board either right under the gravel board (or only until 10mm or so onto the board) and for it to go deep to act as a form for concrete.

Hopefully the pic makes sense. Would appreciate any advice.

chooseusername

If the 'battleaxe' next door would allow,
I would remove any loose soil between the posts down to solid ground.
A form for concrete along the bottom of the posts on neighbours side,
a couple of inches above the bottom of gravel board.
Same on your side but a couple or 3 ins below the bottom of gravel board.
(leave your supports in place for now, provided they don't interfere with
with the forms)
Fill the forms with concrete up to the top of the forms on your side,
it will be about 4 ins or the thickness of fence posts.
Not too sloppy,it needs to keep its shape.
The last few inches, pack a fairly dry mix tight in under the gravel board .
You can square it off , round it off or slope it down to the form.
Tamp it down with a stick on neighbours side,
making sure your supports can be removed later.
When it's cured remove your supports and infill .

You'v gone to some trouble and expense so far,
so whatever you chose to do I'm sure it will be spot-on.