Possible Public Service Moratorium

James2020App

Considering about half the threads in this forum are in relation to Civil/ Public Service Jobs think it is as well to create a separate thread on it.


There was mention of it this week in the media (https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40025909.html) and it was also quoted in the incoming DPER's Ministers Brief.


Do we think it is likely to come in? And if it does come in what exactly are these "key front-line" workers who seem to be immune from it.


Interesting times ahead. Especially considering there are over 180 jobs currently available on Publicjobs.ie

There will be big recruitment in the HSE and education including administration the same to a lesser extent with the public services.

Irelands population is expanding and we need more provision of all sorts of public services the services that are there now barley keep up as it is.

That article is a little bit click bate as well.

jw_sweetman

Does anyone have any idea what impact it might have on internal comps?

Augme

Front line services would be things like nurses, guards, doctors, prison officers etc. Although I would expect to see a significant slow down in recruit for those too.

I think there will be another big drop in administration recruitment across the public and civil service. The government just won't have the money going forward and it will be a huge issue. The biggest issue will be the current pay situation. A lot of public servants feel they are in a sense still owed for the last cuts in the last recession too so I do t think they will take too kindly to being told they need to take a paycut again.

Certainly I'd would expect very little recruitment to happen at the administration level. I think a lot of places will just be told to make do.

James2020App

It is an interesting one, like on a macro level with the amount of supports and subsidies going out on COVID and probable decreases in taxes there is a big gap being created.

And the fact that it is in the incoming DPER Ministers Brief (https://assets.gov.ie/81439/0cfaae4d-dca0-408e-91b5-6958e22a212a.pdf Pg. 34) seems like it is a real possibility for a recruitement ban to come into place.

The arguement from the government will probably be is that it is to decrease spending and they will also state as it does in that Brief that the number of public service staff from 2015 to 2019 has increased by almost 46,000 FTEs (16%) to 339,000. They will also state that there is a pay rise of 2% coming in October.

There are however a number of departments hemoraging staff through retirements, in particular from HEO grades upwards, and the fact that a 12 month moratorium can quickly turn into a multiple year moratorium.

UpBack1234

James2020App wrote: »

It is an interesting one, like on a macro level with the amount of supports and subsidies going out on COVID and probable decreases in taxes there is a big gap being created.

And the fact that it is in the incoming DPER Ministers Brief (https://assets.gov.ie/81439/0cfaae4d-dca0-408e-91b5-6958e22a212a.pdf Pg. 34) seems like it is a real possibility for a recruitement ban to come into place.

The arguement from the government will probably be is that it is to decrease spending and they will also state as it does in that Brief that the number of public service staff from 2015 to 2019 has increased by almost 46,000 FTEs (16%) to 339,000. They will also state that there is a pay rise of 2% coming in October.

There are however a number of departments hemoraging staff through retirements, in particular from HEO grades upwards, and the fact that a 12 month moratorium can quickly turn into a multiple year moratorium.

We are facing into a recession at least as bad if not far worse than 2008/09 - restrictions on recruitment and promotion are pretty much inevitable. However the question will be where the axe falls - and that probably depends on gov policy regarding specific areas. If I was to speculate I would say that any recruitment that has already been sanctioned will be allowed to proceed (such as the new EO comp).

James2020App

UpBack1234 wrote: »

We are facing into a recession at least as bad if not far worse than 2008/09 - restrictions on recruitment and promotion are pretty much inevitable. However the question will be where the axe falls - and that probably depends on gov policy regarding specific areas. If I was to speculate I would say that any recruitment that has already been sanctioned will be allowed to proceed (such as the new EO comp).

I agree with you that a recruitment/promotion ban is in all likelyhood going to happen.


I am not 100% sure but from what I have heard during the last moratorium current competitions were cut short and people were not hired off them. Even many people who were very low numbers on the lists, did not a call once the moratorium came in.


Does anyone else know if this is the case?

There is an odd obsession with this it's highly unlikely there will be a recruitment ban just like that society and public policy have become too complex.

We could become like a lot of other European countries and change to basic grade public services and a cohort of highly educated public servants who will be directly recruited into policy and management.

in the UK its https://www.theguardian.com/education/2017/feb/23/ppe-oxford-university-degree-that-rules-britain

James2020App

mariaalice wrote: »

There is an odd obsession with this it's highly unlikely there will be a recruitment ban just like that society and public policy have become too complex.

We could become like a lot of other European countries and change to basic grade public services and a cohort of highly educated public servants who will be directly recruited into policy and management.

in the UK its https://www.theguardian.com/education/2017/feb/23/ppe-oxford-university-degree-that-rules-britain

The UK's civil service operates similarly to the Irish civil service. Their grades go from AA or AO → EO → SEO →G6 & G7 → SCS

James2020App

James2020App wrote: »

The UK's civil service operates similarly to the Irish civil service. Their grades go from AA or AO → EO → SEO →G6 & G7 → SCS

yes but it is a big different in those who are recruited from PPE degrees and the lower grades.

Divisadero

PAS will keep recruiting until they are told otherwise. People should still apply if interested but be very aware that the plug could be pulled at anytime or that the panel will be formed but nobody will be called from it.

During the last crisis no moratorium was officially announced but there might as well have been. If things get bad Admin type roles in the Civil Service will no longer be filled. At one stage during the last crash Civil Servants were even offered career breaks with a small payment in an effort to keep the wage bill down. Depending on how bad it gets even the Garda will stop recruiting or reduce intakes to a trickle.

During major recessions the Civil Service are basically told to make do with what you have.