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Employer trying to transfer service to a different company

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  • 15-07-2020 7:46pm
    #1
    Paul_Mc1988
    Registered Users Posts: 748 ✭✭✭


    Hi there,

    My mother in laws employer lost a contract and a new company has obtained it. They are now looking to transfer some employees to the other company and she is one of them employees.

    What are her options in this situation.

    1. Does she have to move.
    2. If she doesn't have to move and refuses and they wish to let her go is she entitled to redundancy.
    3. If she has to move does all her rights go with her. Ie years of service for future redundancy etc.

    Thanks in advance.


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    #2
    vandriver
    Registered Users Posts: 3,460 ✭✭✭vandriver


    https://employmentrightsireland.com/tupe-the-transfer-of-undertakings-directive-and-irish-employers/


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    #3
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,065 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »
    Hi there,

    My mother in laws employer lost a contract and a new company has obtained it. They are now looking to transfer some employees to the other company and she is one of them employees.

    I presume the "they" are the client company that has decide to go with this other service provider rather than your MIL's current employer... is that right?

    Assuming that is the case and her employer has lost the client, then what is the alternative? Will her current employer be able to find another client and have work for her or will it be the case at she will be made redundant.


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    #4
    Paul_Mc1988
    Registered Users Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Paul_Mc1988


    Jim2007 wrote: »
    I presume the "they" are the client company that has decide to go with this other service provider rather than your MIL's current employer... is that right?

    Assuming that is the case and her employer has lost the client, then what is the alternative? Will her current employer be able to find another client and have work for her or will it be the case at she will be made redundant.


    Hi. Yes the client has gone with another company. No they won't be able to find other work for her. Besides that would you know what her rights are?


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    #5
    Dav010
    Registered Users Posts: 14,175 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »
    Hi. Yes the client has gone with another company. No they won't be able to find other work for her. Besides that would you know what her rights are?

    How long has she worked there, and is her current employer in danger of folding if they cannot find another contract?


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    #6
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    No
    No
    Yes


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    #7
    drunkmonkey
    Registered Users Posts: 28,120 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »
    What are her options in this situation.

    1. Does she have to move.
    No she can hand in her notice and quit.

    2. If she doesn't have to move and refuses and they wish to let her go is she entitled to redundancy.
    She's entitled to follow the work so this wouldn't be a redundancy situation as she's not being let go. Her options are quit or retain her job with the new employer.

    3. If she has to move does all her rights go with her. Ie years of service for future redundancy etc.
    Yes her contract has to be the same or better with the new employer.


    Thanks in advance.

    It's called a Transfer of undertaking, it's what happens when one business takes over another, look up Tupe if you want to find out more about it.

    Legally the new employer has to take on your mother in law, what can happen though is the new employer then let's her go they might want their own staff etc but the new employer has to pay her full redundancy if they do this.


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    #8
    Paul_Mc1988
    Registered Users Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Paul_Mc1988


    Thanks for the info everyone. Much appreciated.


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    #9
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,065 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It's called a Transfer of undertaking, it's what happens when one business takes over another, look up Tupe if you want to find out more about it.

    Legally the new employer has to take on your mother in law, what can happen though is the new employer then let's her go they might want their own staff etc but the new employer has to pay her full redundancy if they do this.

    It is not a transfer of undertaking. Her employer simply lost a client. Her employer's business is not being transferred to any other company, if fails it will go bust leaving her with just her statutory redundancy entitlement.


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    #10
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,065 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »
    Hi. Yes the client has gone with another company. No they won't be able to find other work for her. Besides that would you know what her rights are?

    Well if her employer cannot find new clients, then statutory redundancy terms is all she is entitled to.


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    #11
    C3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 3,752 ✭✭✭C3PO


    drunkmonkey wrote: »
    It's called a Transfer of undertaking, it's what happens when one business takes over another, look up Tupe if you want to find out more about it.

    Legally the new employer has to take on your mother in law, what can happen though is the new employer then let's her go they might want their own staff etc but the new employer has to pay her full redundancy if they do this.

    I don’t believe that the OP said that one business was taking over another but rather that one business lost a contract to another? In which case TUPE would not apply.


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    #12
    nibtrix
    Registered Users Posts: 1,305 ✭✭✭nibtrix


    Unless I'm reading it wrong it does sound like a TUPE situation to me.

    The OP is employed by company A, to provide services onsite at company X.

    Company X now says we don't want company A anymore, instead we're going to contract with Company B to provide these services.

    Provided the actual jobs being done are the same, the employees of company A are transferred to Company B using the TUPE process.

    I've been through this exact process myself. Changing employer from company A to company B but still providing services at Company X. You keep all your length of service and your new contract terms must either be the same or better.


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    #13
    Paul_Mc1988
    Registered Users Posts: 748 ✭✭✭Paul_Mc1988


    nibtrix wrote: »
    Unless I'm reading it wrong it does sound like a TUPE situation to me.

    The OP is employed by company A, to provide services onsite at company X.

    Company X now says we don't want company A anymore, instead we're going to contract with Company B to provide these services.

    Provided the actual jobs being done are the same, the employees of company A are transferred to Company B using the TUPE process.

    I've been through this exact process myself. Changing employer from company A to company B but still providing services at Company X. You keep all your length of service and your new contract terms must either be the same or better.

    Yes this is exactly what's happening. If she said she doesn't wish to transfer to company B what would happen then. As they most likely have no work for her she would need to be made redundant I'm thinking.


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    #14
    1hnr79jr65
    Registered Users Posts: 916 ✭✭✭1hnr79jr65


    Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »
    Yes this is exactly what's happening. If she said she doesn't wish to transfer to company B what would happen then. As they most likely have no work for her she would need to be made redundant I'm thinking.

    There would be no entitlement to redundancy in the circumstance you have outlined as work is available to her. Only difference is instead of company A being employer it will be company B.

    If she does not wish to go to company B, then she can ask company A to remain and if there is a role elsewhere in the organisation which she may be suitable, available and they may accommodate her. If no role available then the only other option is she is quitting and has no entitlement after that.


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    #15
    C3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 3,752 ✭✭✭C3PO


    Sour Lemonz wrote: »
    There would be no entitlement to redundancy in the circumstance you have outlined as work is available to her. Only difference is instead of company A being employer it will be company B.

    If she does not wish to go to company B, then she can ask company A to remain and if there is a role elsewhere in the organisation which she may be suitable, available and they may accommodate her. If no role available then the only other option is she is quitting and has no entitlement after that.

    This is correct if TUPE applies in this case - https://www.xperthr.co.uk/faq/if-an-employee-in-a-tupe-situation-refuses-to-transfer-will-they-be-entitled-to-a-redundancy-payment/57198/


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